What's the Penalty?

[Deleted member 23344]

The following happened last week in a seniors match against another club. My partner and I were playing in a 4BBB off the yellow tees. Halfway round, we reached the next tee and our opponents had the honour. They both drove off and, as I was leading for us, I put my ball on a tee and prepared to drive. However, when I looked up to check that my ball was not in advance of the markers, I noticed that they were white, not yellow. The two tees were on the same tee box, but the whites were several club lengths behind the yellows and our opponents had teed off from the wrong tee. My partner immediately said that our opponents had lost the hole and, as the other three of were unsure whether this was correct or not, this "ruling" stood. In the end, it did not matter as our opponents won the match 3 & 2 anyway.

When I looked at the rules, it was clear that our both of our opponents were in breach of Rule 6.2b(1) in that they had not teed off from the teeing area, given that the white tees were more than two club lengths behind the designated tees. However, I could not find the penalty for breaching this rule in match play. Is it the loss of the hole as my partner claimed or something else? And what is the penalty in stroke play ... the general penalty of two strokes perhaps?

NB: Rule 6.2b specifies the penalty for breaching Rule 6.2b(2) ... the need to tee off from a tee or the ground ... but does not appear to specify the penalty for breaching Rule 6.2b(1).

 

[Colin L]

Go back a bit to 6.1b (1) and 6.1b(2). where it is detailed.

The R&A

The R&A seeks to engage in and support activities for the benefit of the sport of golf from The Royal and Ancient Golf Club of St Andrews.

www.randa.org

That's a link to the rule, by the way. Just click inside the box.

There's no penalty in matchplay but your opponent has the right to accept the stroke or cancel it and require you to play again.
Two stroke penalty in stroke play, and you must start again. The original stroke and any subsequent strokes before correcting don't count. In effect then you are playing 3 from the tee. If you don't correct the error before starting the next hole you are disqualified.

 

[Deleted member 23344]

Go back a bit to 6.1b (1) and 6.1b(2). where it is detailed.

The R&A

The R&A seeks to engage in and support activities for the benefit of the sport of golf from The Royal and Ancient Golf Club of St Andrews.

www.randa.org

That's a link to the rule, by the way. Just click inside the box.

There's no penalty in matchplay but your opponent has the right to accept the stroke or cancel it and require you to play again.
Two stroke penalty in stroke play, and you must start again. The original stroke and any subsequent strokes before correcting don't count. In effect then you are playing 3 from the tee. If you don't correct the error before starting the next hole you are disqualified.

Thanks Colin. I missed that! So my partner was wrong ... we live and learn.

 

[salfordlad]

Thanks Colin. I missed that! So my partner was wrong ... we live and learn.

And as this was four ball and you discovered their error only after both had played from outside the TA, you only had the option of cancelling the second stroke.

 

[backwoodsman]

And as this was four ball and you discovered their error only after both had played from outside the TA, you only had the option of cancelling the second stroke.

Can I ask - can you expand on whereabouts in the rules you get this? My reading of 6.1b(1) is not making that clear to me

 

[salfordlad]

Can I ask - can you expand on whereabouts in the rules you get this? My reading of 6.1b(1) is not making that clear to me

Not covered in Rule 6 but 23.6. See 23.6/3
"When Side in Match Play May Have Stroke Cancelled by Opponent
When both players of a side play from outside the teeing area in a Four-Ball match, only the last stroke played may be cancelled under Rule 6.1b.For example, in a Four-Ball match with Side A-B playing Side C-D, if Player A and Player B both play from outside the teeing area with Player A playing first followed by Player B, Side C-D may cancel the stroke of Player B, but not Player A.Rule 6.1b requires that cancelling the stroke must be done promptly. This also applies if Player A and Player B both played when it was either Player C's turn or Player D's turn to play during play of the hole."

 

[YandaB]

Not covered in Rule 6 but 23.6. See 23.6/3
"When Side in Match Play May Have Stroke Cancelled by Opponent
When both players of a side play from outside the teeing area in a Four-Ball match, only the last stroke played may be cancelled under Rule 6.1b.For example, in a Four-Ball match with Side A-B playing Side C-D, if Player A and Player B both play from outside the teeing area with Player A playing first followed by Player B, Side C-D may cancel the stroke of Player B, but not Player A.Rule 6.1b requires that cancelling the stroke must be done promptly. This also applies if Player A and Player B both played when it was either Player C's turn or Player D's turn to play during play of the hole."

Thank you @salfordlad , for those less familiar with the rules, 23.6/3 can be found in the clarifications (I believe that the slash will tell you that but it was too subtle for me until I went searching).

 

[Colin L]

The slash is indeed the clue. This one is needed because although the Rule tells us that the opponent has to require the cancellation promptly, it isn’t necessarily clear what that precisely means in a four ball. Why the Rule doesn’t say before another stroke is made I know not.

 

[backwoodsman]

Not covered in Rule 6 but 23.6. See 23.6/3
"When Side in Match Play May Have Stroke Cancelled by Opponent
When both players of a side play from outside the teeing area in a Four-Ball match, only the last stroke played may be cancelled under Rule 6.1b.For example, in a Four-Ball match with Side A-B playing Side C-D, if Player A and Player B both play from outside the teeing area with Player A playing first followed by Player B, Side C-D may cancel the stroke of Player B, but not Player A.Rule 6.1b requires that cancelling the stroke must be done promptly. This also applies if Player A and Player B both played when it was either Player C's turn or Player D's turn to play during play of the hole."

Thanks.
I'd looked at Rule 6. And the clarifications of rule 6. And I'd also looked at Rule 23. But I didn’t look at clarifications of rule 23.