bobmac
Major Champion
The vast majority of trouble is at the front/corners of the green which will catch any mishits. Aim for the back of the green and your mishits may carry the trouble.
What resources would you recommend to learn course management?
- Thread starter AdamW
- Start date
The vast majority of trouble is at the front/corners of the green which will catch any mishits. Aim for the back of the green and your mishits may carry the trouble.
clubchamp98
Journeyman Pro
I assumed most people would realise it’s for second shots .
But not all obviously.
I didn’t say it was a tee shot.!!!
pendodave
Tour Rookie
If you were to listen to the podcast I recommended....
After a whole stack of analysis by clever people, anyone other than Adam Scott should aim for the middle of the green and take it from there. Only exception is if there is a particularly egregious hazard in one direction or another. At my course, for example, a long miss is almost always much worse than a short one, which runs counter to many suggestions...
D
Deleted member 1147
Guest
Play with someone similar to you, but better.
Try to find someone who hits a similar distance, who has similar strengths and weaknesses, hits the same shot shape and isn't just a hit and hope player.
Look at what clubs they hit off tees, what shot choices they make, when they go for it or lay up, when they hit lob shots or chip & runs etc
I was lucky; I found two players in their 50's, so about 15 years older than me. They play off scratch & 2, they used to play off +4 and scratch, so only age and injury has slowed them down.
I played a lot of games with them, and learnt from their experiences & recommendations, and by watching how they go about playing. They aren't as serious about the game as they used to be, but still knock it around in the low 70's at worst.
This has helped me no end improve my thinking on the course - just need to execute the shots now!
Try to find someone who hits a similar distance, who has similar strengths and weaknesses, hits the same shot shape and isn't just a hit and hope player.
Look at what clubs they hit off tees, what shot choices they make, when they go for it or lay up, when they hit lob shots or chip & runs etc
I was lucky; I found two players in their 50's, so about 15 years older than me. They play off scratch & 2, they used to play off +4 and scratch, so only age and injury has slowed them down.
I played a lot of games with them, and learnt from their experiences & recommendations, and by watching how they go about playing. They aren't as serious about the game as they used to be, but still knock it around in the low 70's at worst.
This has helped me no end improve my thinking on the course - just need to execute the shots now!
Grant85
Head Pro
Every Shot Counts by Mark Broadie.
but be careful - you could easily take out of this that you should try and bomb every drive and get as far down every hole as possible. The book makes it clear this is true for the elite players. There is also carefully considered info on handicap golfers and that in many cases it is important to play away from trouble.
I would say as a simple philosophy, laying up on longer holes can be a very valuable tactic.
Anything approaching a 200 yard shot is going to be tricky for a lot of amateurs to hit accurately. Chances of getting on the green, even with a good shot might not be high. And difficultly level of the shot is also high.
Hit a 7 iron... leave yourself 50 yards or so. Even hit a 9I / wedge and leave yourself 90 to 70 yards?
And a wide mid or short iron is not going to be as wayward as a wide hybrid or fairway wood.
You will get huge satisfaction from hitting a decent 7 iron and wedging on and you are not under pressure so more likely to make good contact. Albeit accepting a likely 2 putt bogey, but occasionally getting down in 2 from short of the green.
Obviously this is more a strategy for teen-handicaps. But certainly helped me massively and now the tactic is to work out the occasional holes when you can 'go for it' without putting yourself in much trouble.
but be careful - you could easily take out of this that you should try and bomb every drive and get as far down every hole as possible. The book makes it clear this is true for the elite players. There is also carefully considered info on handicap golfers and that in many cases it is important to play away from trouble.
I would say as a simple philosophy, laying up on longer holes can be a very valuable tactic.
Anything approaching a 200 yard shot is going to be tricky for a lot of amateurs to hit accurately. Chances of getting on the green, even with a good shot might not be high. And difficultly level of the shot is also high.
Hit a 7 iron... leave yourself 50 yards or so. Even hit a 9I / wedge and leave yourself 90 to 70 yards?
And a wide mid or short iron is not going to be as wayward as a wide hybrid or fairway wood.
You will get huge satisfaction from hitting a decent 7 iron and wedging on and you are not under pressure so more likely to make good contact. Albeit accepting a likely 2 putt bogey, but occasionally getting down in 2 from short of the green.
Obviously this is more a strategy for teen-handicaps. But certainly helped me massively and now the tactic is to work out the occasional holes when you can 'go for it' without putting yourself in much trouble.
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Curls
Journeyman Pro
You've driven into nasty rough, about 180 yards from the front, on a tough hole with a tricky well-protected green. What do you do?
If you're a low h/c then popping a ball sideways out of thick rough is the sensible move, because you back yourself to put the next one on the green and even bogey on a tough hole isn't the end of the world, you can birdie the next 3 in a row.
But what if you don't have that ability? If you struggle to hit that green from 170 then this isn't your go-to option. You think to yourself, "if I don't get this up to around the 100 marker I haven't a hope of making bogey here let alone par". You take the low percentage shot and muck it up, now you're worried, panic, and next thing you're walking off with an 8.
Course management is huge but your options are dependent on ability. Playing for a bogey might easily result in a triple. A playing lesson with a good pro should be a good experience if you discuss what it is you want from the lesson first. What's your ambition? Is it to play better with the game you have, or to play better? Cos those are different paths and your enjoyment of the game is all that matters, so choose whichever one you're happiest with.
If you're a low h/c then popping a ball sideways out of thick rough is the sensible move, because you back yourself to put the next one on the green and even bogey on a tough hole isn't the end of the world, you can birdie the next 3 in a row.
But what if you don't have that ability? If you struggle to hit that green from 170 then this isn't your go-to option. You think to yourself, "if I don't get this up to around the 100 marker I haven't a hope of making bogey here let alone par". You take the low percentage shot and muck it up, now you're worried, panic, and next thing you're walking off with an 8.
Course management is huge but your options are dependent on ability. Playing for a bogey might easily result in a triple. A playing lesson with a good pro should be a good experience if you discuss what it is you want from the lesson first. What's your ambition? Is it to play better with the game you have, or to play better? Cos those are different paths and your enjoyment of the game is all that matters, so choose whichever one you're happiest with.
jim8flog
Journeyman Pro
Putting it in simple terms if you play the same course regularly. Work out on each hole where a good missed shot will be and where a bad missed shot will be and try to avoid the latter.
Golf would be a very easy game if we hit it where we intended to hit it every time.
Golf would be a very easy game if we hit it where we intended to hit it every time.
clubchamp98
Journeyman Pro
Nicklaus says this in his book.
“ stand behind the green and look at the hole backwards”
Most trouble is short and facing you on your shot.
Grant85
Head Pro
Yep - agree with this. You have to always consider what's the worst result if I play this shot?
And while it's not nice to be in a defensive mindset, you have to make a defensive decision but a positive swing.
How many people have you seen electing to lay up in front of a burn rather than trying to go for the heroic carry. And then messing up the lay up?
I played foursomes with a guy last year. I was the higher handicap (albeit not much in it), but drove the ball really well that day. On both par 5s I'd put us in good position - but they were really tricky par 5s to go for. Both times I told him to play the shot he was comfortable with and both times he elected to lay up... and both times he completely messed up the shot. I'd guess if he was playing his own ball he wouldn't have layed up and both times made a poor swing to put us in trouble.
clubchamp98
Journeyman Pro
Laying up is a tough shot .
You still need to pick your target and the club to hit this target.
A lot just hit it and don’t concentrate properly.
Curls
Journeyman Pro
So true. If laying up I imagine a green on the fairway and a pin in the middle of it, and aim for that. In my minds eye there’s a green there.
Jacko_G
Blackballed
Course management.
Just play golf. You will learn from your mistakes and you'll also learn from others.
Just play golf. You will learn from your mistakes and you'll also learn from others.
clubchamp98
Journeyman Pro
I practice my 80yd wedge more than any other shot.
So if I need to lay up I work out what I need to hit to leave me 80yds.
The only time this changes is if there is a hazard at 80yds.
Grant85
Head Pro
Some layups are tougher than others, but the level of difficulty in hitting a hitting a hybrid to a green compared with a short or mid iron to a much bigger target, is not really comparable.
Appreciate some longer holes are designed with bunkers or hazards to make a lay-up awkward but for the most part I just think amateur golfers don't want to hit a lay-up. The majority will just hit their longest club, even if they know it won't get there and even if they know there's trouble near the green and there's a wide fairway 100 yards away from where they are.
SwingsitlikeHogan
Major Champion
For every shot...
“Play the shot you‘ve got the greatest chance of playing well, and play the shot that makes the next shot easy”
I really think that these few words encapsulate a lot of what we're sharing here...
(for the OP) So say you are not far short right of the green in 2 on a par 4 - but you are in quite deep rough with a greenside bunker to go over if playing to the green. But the shot is quite difficult for you and obviously risky - as you are not so good at these lob type shots out of deeper rough - and the bunker sand is hard to play out of. You might get up and down in 2 for your 4 - but actually your hope is on the green and 2 putts for a 5. But plop it short into the bunker...6 or even 7 loom on the horizon.
The alternative is to chip out sideways with little risk, to a spot short of the green that gives a hazard free line to the flag, and you know that your bump and run chipping is pretty good - it would be an easy shot for you. So you play the low risk chip out - and the easy bump and run onto the green to reasonably close - and hole the putt...it's a 5. It was never going to be a 4 - but it was very unlikely ever to be a 7. You played to one of your strengths - the bump and run. You hit the straightforward shot out of the rough that you needed to hit to give you that next shot. And you executed. And we know that when we successfully execute a plan we feel good. And on we go to the next challenge with a little spring in the step.
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D
Deleted member 1147
Guest
Probably because it’s easier to get up and down from closer to the target
clubchamp98
Journeyman Pro
That’s not always the case.
I would rather have an 80yd shot than 40yds.
You can spin and control the longer shot imo.
But we’re not all the same.
Birdie2
Club Champion
Play a game called keep it on the fairway. A good place to start with this is using a 5 iron on every par 4 or 5 to tee off with. It doesn't t have to be a 5i, but a club you are comfortable you will get it in play with. You'll be suprised by what you score when you take out the equation of hazards and oob off of the tee.
Aussie Swinger
Newbie
I recommend you go to YouTube and watch “Golf Sidekick”. He plays courses that are not short, but rarely hits driver on more than 40% of his tee shots and shoots low 70’s. He talks you through his thinking on each hole and how to take your ego of having to mash it down the fairway 300 yards to score well. And he’s entertaining to watch.
Crazyface
Tour Winner
Look before you hit the ball???? It's what I tell the wife. Seems to work.
