What is the best way to have 30+ hcaps in Comps.

[oltimer]

We are now getting a few 30-40 handicappers playing in Comps, with howls of protest from some members stating they can`t compete against those with 2 shots per hole.
What is the best or allowable way to retain a max of 28 for prize winning purposes in Comps. Do we/can we- state max 28 allowable for prize winning purposes, or alternate being to issue them with two handicaps,
a) a Playing hcap which is adjusted according to scores returned and b) a Competition Playing Handicap of a lesser amount ie 28..
Need some help here please am getting stressed out trying to read the Congu manual on the laptop.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

The best way is to allow them to play of the Handicap the system has allocated to them based on their scores - they have that Handicap for a reason , you don’t need to manufacture rules to ensure they can’t compete

Why should someone who has been given a HC of 35 been told to play to 28 only - that dismisses the whole idea of HC’s above 28

 

[jim8flog]

It is no different to a scratch player saying that they cannot compete against a player getting a shot a hole.

We have taken the simple view we either put a handicap limit on a competition and players with a handicap higher than that cannot play in it (even at the highest handicap allowed) or a competition is open to players with any handicap. (that is the CONGU view). So far nobody with a handicap higher than 28 has won any competition.

It is why they have the higher handicap in the first place it is what they need in order to compete and have a chance.

We just let the complainers keep on complaining and one day they will get the point.

 

[oltimer]

Thanks for response, Congu Appx O - page 90 `A` Playing Handicaps and Competition Hcaps , also last para on page 91, is this out of date or is it me unable to grasp it.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Is that not more to do with people playing of different tees but in the same Comp

 

[rulefan]

This what CONGU have to say:

Dec.1(j) Limitation of handicaps in Qualifying Competitions
Q. May an Affiliated Club impose a limit of handicap to some of their Qualifying Competitions e.g. insist that a player with a Playing Handicap of 27 competes from a handicap of 18?
A. This is contrary to the spirit of the UHS. Players must be allowed to play from their established handicap.
The player must play off full handicap and the correct Playing Handicap must be used when calculating the Competition Scratch Score. The organising Committee may then adjust the scores for the purpose of awarding prizes for the competition

 

[oltimer]

Rulefan- tnks, yes get Q & A, its the bit you underlined that am unsure the way to do this.

 

[jim8flog]

Thanks for response, Congu Appx O - page 90 `A` Playing Handicaps and Competition Hcaps , also last para on page 91, is this out of date or is it me unable to grasp it.

Appendix O is all about players paying from different tees in the same comp (normally mixed sex competitions) rather than players with varying handicaps.

 

[oltimer]

Jim8 - tnks, my mistake

 

[Fish]

If your just trying to keep the moaners happy, then divisionalise your winners into handicap catergories. The higher than 28 will be competing against themselves in a Cat5 division or split your field into 4 equal divisions based on the amount in the field.

 

[Colin L]

What is the best way to have 30+ hcaps in Comps?
By ensuring that your handicapping is as accurate as possible so that everyone is playing on a level footing in a handicap competition.
By welcoming the opportunity to make all but a few of your competitions inclusive.
By categorising prizes as mentioned above.
By having handicap limits on appropriate competitions i.e. not permitting anyone holding a handicap above the limit to enter.
By making a draw by categories if it's felt that it is not a great idea to put a 36 handicapper in the same flight as two scratch players. (Where players just enter through the normal booking system you can just leave them to make their own groups as usual.)

 

[jim8flog]

Looks like there is going to be a clash between COGU and the R&A

from the new the Comiittee Procedures Rule book

Handicap Limits

The Committee may set restrictions and/or limits on the handicaps eligible for entry or use in a competition. These may include:

• Setting upper or lower limits on handicaps.
• In team formats, such as Foursomes or Four-Ball:
  • Limiting the maximum difference between partners’ handicaps. The Committee may also choose to reduce the handicap for the player with the higher handicap to meet the requirement, or
  • Limiting the maximum total handicaps of partners. The Committee may also choose to reduce the handicap for one or both players to meet the requirement.

 

[rulefan]

Rulefan- tnks, yes get Q & A, its the bit you underlined that am unsure the way to do this.

What computer system does your club use? They may provide a facility, otherwise it is an easy manual process.
But the competition must be set up with full handicaps

 

[rulefan]

Looks like there is going to be a clash between COGU and the R&A

from the new the Comiittee Procedures Rule book

Handicap Limits

The Committee may set restrictions and/or limits on the handicaps eligible for entry or use in a competition. These may include:

• Setting upper or lower limits on handicaps.
• In team formats, such as Foursomes or Four-Ball:
  • Limiting the maximum difference between partners’ handicaps. The Committee may also choose to reduce the handicap for the player with the higher handicap to meet the requirement, or
  • Limiting the maximum total handicaps of partners. The Committee may also choose to reduce the handicap for one or both players to meet the requirement.

Interesting, I'll check with EG but I suspect separate calculations for handicap purposes will in effect be exempted.

Just found this in Unauthorised Local Rules.
As a general principle, when a player is playing a round that is to be posted for handicapping purposes, he or she is required to play that round under the Rules of Golf. If the Committee authorizes players to play under Local Rules that differ significantly from the Rules of Golf, the player may not be permitted to post the score for handicapping purposes. For allowable exceptions, consult the rules or recommendations contained within the Handicap System operating in the local jurisdiction.

 

[oltimer]

Thanks to all the experts, you haven`t solved the problem of the moaners but at least now know what can or cannot do, your contributions are very much appreciated.

 

[duncan mackie]

Thanks to all the experts, you haven`t solved the problem of the moaners but at least now know what can or cannot do, your contributions are very much appreciated.

You can't solve that problem.

It's not actually a problem. Just advise the moaner to enter scratch events....and when they come back with something along the lines of that being silly because they are an 8 (for example) handicap player not a scr one you can ask them why that argument doesn't apply to a higher handicap player.

There's one other accomadation you can make as a competition committee, play more medal competitions. In general these aren't favourable to the higher handicaps at all!

 

[TerryA]

The whole idea with the increased limits on handicaps is to encourage more higher handicap players to enter competitions. We are trying to make the game more inclusive and encourage all levels of competitors. This is negated if you introduce handicap limits to competitions. As one of the contributors said, introduce divisions within the competion, this will then appease the moaners but still include the higher handicaps.

 

[rulefan]

As with all of us CONGU only got sight if the Committee Procedures Document on Wednesday.
They will be going through it and making some changes to the CONGU book for 2019, but it is unlikely their view will change with this.
Players should still be allowed to compete from their true and allocated handicap. They hope to have something for the end of the month.

 

[higgins340s]

We are now getting a few 30-40 handicappers playing in Comps, with howls of protest from some members stating they can`t compete against those with 2 shots per hole.
What is the best or allowable way to retain a max of 28 for prize winning purposes in Comps. Do we/can we- state max 28 allowable for prize winning purposes, or alternate being to issue them with two handicaps,
a) a Playing hcap which is adjusted according to scores returned and b) a Competition Playing Handicap of a lesser amount ie 28..
Need some help here please am getting stressed out trying to read the Congu manual on the laptop.

keep the women's comps separate from the mens

 

[rulefan]

keep the women's comps separate from the mens

why?