Striking two balls at the same time

#41
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rulie

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backwoodsman said:
Does 'in play' have anything to do with it? Most 'wrong balls' on the course aren't in play but they are still wrong balls? (Otherwise the wrong ball rule is a nonsense)
So, what about my thoughts in #26?

Eg. Player knows (can see) 'other ball' is there
Other ball is in very close proximity to players ball.
Whilst 'other ball' is a movable obstruction, it is still 'a ball' (ie a wrong ball which you are not allowed to make a stroke at without penalty
To hit own ball, player knows they'll have to also hit other ball - ie can't hit own ball without intending to hit 'other ball' as well

So is the player making a stroke at a wrong ball? Should there be a penalty.

Ps - only asking, not arguing.
Click to expand...
General Penalty for stupidity!
Which ball did the player intend to make a stroke at?
 
#42
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rulefan

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backwoodsman said:
Does 'in play' have anything to do with it? Most 'wrong balls' on the course aren't in play but they are still wrong balls? (Otherwise the wrong ball rule is a nonsense)
So, what about my thoughts in #26?

Eg. Player knows (can see) 'other ball' is there
Other ball is in very close proximity to players ball.
Whilst 'other ball' is a movable obstruction, it is still 'a ball' (ie a wrong ball which you are not allowed to make a stroke at without penalty
To hit own ball, player knows they'll have to also hit other ball - ie can't hit own ball without intending to hit 'other ball' as well

So is the player making a stroke at a wrong ball? Should there be a penalty.

Ps - only asking, not arguing.
Click to expand...
Even if they believe they may/will hit the other ball, their intent is to make a stroke at their ball in play. That the other ball is also a wrong ball is irrelevant. The Rule (15.2a) only requires the interfering object to be a Movable Obstruction. Which it is by definition.
 
#43
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backwoodsman

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rulie said:
General Penalty for stupidity!
Which ball did the player intend to make a stroke at?
Click to expand...
Possibly intended to hit both balls? If the balls are so close, they may claim they only intended to hit their own ball, but they knew couldn't hit one without hitting the other - ie couldn't 'not intend' to hit the second ball as not physically possible?
 
#44
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rulie

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backwoodsman said:
Possibly intended to hit both balls? If the balls are so close, they may claim they only intended to hit their own ball, but they knew couldn't hit one without hitting the other - ie couldn't 'not intend' to hit the second ball as not physically possible?
Click to expand...
Sounds like you are suggesting they purposely played a wrong ball? i can't imagine a player ever doing that. Perhaps a second general penalty for stupidity.
We should get out of this rabbit hole. Questions have been answered.
 
#45
Colin L

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backwoodsman said:
Possibly intended to hit both balls? If the balls are so close, they may claim they only intended to hit their own ball, but they knew couldn't hit one without hitting the other - ie couldn't 'not intend' to hit the second ball as not physically possible?
Click to expand...
The player could even knowingly hit the stray ball first so that it knocked his own ball forwards without his clubhead making contact with his ball. See Clarification 10.1a(2) Other Material May Intervene Between Ball and Clubhead During Stroke. But who in their right mind would do that?
 
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#47
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backwoodsman

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Colin L said:
The player could even knowingly hit the stray ball first so that it knocked his own ball forwards without his clubhead making contact with it. See Claarification 10.1a(2) Other Material May Intervene Between Ball and Clubhead During Stroke. But who in their right mind would do that?
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Remember, we talking about golfers here ... :)
 
#48
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salfordlad

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Steven Rules said:
The suspense is eatng at me. I am struggling to think what the other piece of rules detail might be. All I can think of is that you might have in mind the unlikely possibility that the stray ball is actually the ball in play of another player playing on the course. I assume that's not what you're thinking of?
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It's the issue I covered in #37 that Colin expanded on in #39. Interference with another ball is going to be 15.2a treatment, not 15.2b. Another piece of nuance where the language of the Rules and plain English do not fully align.
 
#49
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rulie

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Imo, it's best to offer potential answers to the situation upfront instead of asking for readers to guess what you're referring to. :sneaky:
 
#53
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salfordlad

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rulie said:
Imo, it's best to offer potential answers to the situation upfront instead of asking for readers to guess what you're referring to. :sneaky:
Click to expand...
I still can't quite fathom why this comment would come from someone that, more than I, poses rules questions that you clearly know the answers to.
 
#54
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rulie

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Yes, there is no doubt that I've asked such questions, with the intent of encouraging posters to read and learn by providing them with some other thoughts and a bit of guidance to deal with the situations being reviewed. Things that I will continue to do. There are still things for all of us to learn from each other about Rules and presentation thereof. We are all learners, not experts.
 
#55
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rulie said:
Yes, there is no doubt that I've asked such questions, with the intent of encouraging posters to read and learn by providing them with some other thoughts and a bit of guidance to deal with the situations being reviewed. Things that I will continue to do. There are still things for all of us to learn from each other about Rules and presentation thereof. We are all learners, not experts.
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Fully agree. Steven brought a nice live action video here that raised some interesting rules questions, initial discussions went part way to the answer and I simply noted there were further angles that hadn't yet been explored. This also was with the intent of encouraging posters to read and think about the rule that had been raised, precisely the same objective as Steven's original post.
 
#57
garyinderry

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I once watched my mate hit a shot from the fairway, he caught it that fat a ball under the ground exploded out and 2 balls went in the air along with a sod of turf.

My brain couldn't process what was happening for a couple of seconds.

The penny dropped and we were falling about laughing.
 
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