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Steve williams again

Really can't believe how many people biting at Bombers posts.... so many gullible people out there.

On the topic, that example of the African-American guy being directed to the caddyshack is such a great example of people not understanding what racism actually is. The reason why the guys who worked at the club directed him to the caddy shack is not because they believed that black people are inferior and should be caddying instead of playing, it is because, in all likelihood, the vast majority of african-americans turning up to the golf club that day (and probably every day) were actually there to caddy.

Humans are very intelligent creatures (as hard as that is to believe sometimes....) and are very good at spotting patterns. The pattern of african-american showing up to caddy and white guy showing up to play is a very easy one to spot, in the same way that the guy who turns up in a brand new Bentley is there to play and the guy who shows up in the beat up old pick up truck is there to caddy.

Should they have assumed that the guy in question was there to caddy? Absolutely not. But does that make the act of doing so racist, not at all.

Now the Stevie Williams comment is completely different and is not as black and white (excuse the use of phrase). The fact is that what he said is no where near racist technically, but due to peoples assumptions and the connotations associated with his use of his words, what he said certainly comes across as racist (and actually, in my opinion, he probably did MEAN it in a racist way.... but that is another discussion.).

For example, if a kid called another kid in school a "ginger bellend" he would be told to stop bullying the kid for being ginger, but if that same kid called another kid a "blonde bellend" I highly doubt anyone would mention the fact that he was bringing up his blonde hair... This isn't because of the fact that he has said anything different, it is due to the fact that there are negative connotations attached to singleing out someone for being ginger, whereas there just isn't for blondes. It is still the same act of singling someone out for something that is different about them, but the difference in this example is how the comments are received by the people who hear them (which was argued about earlier in the thread and I agree that how a comment is received is completely irrelivant, and anyone who thinks differently is probably the kind of person who has no genuine understanding of what racism is.)

In Bermuda, where I'm from, there is overt and hidden racism all over the place (both white towards black and black towards white) but it is the lack of understanding of what is racist and what isn't that is really stopping people from moving forward. We will never, ever get to a stage where people do not notice the colour of someones skin, but what we should be aiming to do is get to a stage where people are not DISCRIMINATED AGAINST for the colour of their skin.
 
So is it all down the trouble with his knee, think not.

Tiger must have thought well of Steve to have him on the bag and as a result made him a millionaire, or did he just feel sorry for him or was it that he was the one who knew his game inside out and could take what Steve was telling him to be correct, yes Tiger hit the shots but Steve had an input as to club selection information on the greens etc.

Tiger sacked Butch and has now seen his golf slip down the slippery slope, changed to yet another coach & still can't find a swing so decided to sack the caddy.

I am not defending Steve over what he may or may not have said but without Steve it will be a long time before Tiger gets any form back.
 
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It could not give a toss about Tiger Woods or Steve Williams and sincerely hope I never have the misfortune of meeting either of them.

I do find it quite depressing though that this storm in a teacup warrants 11 pages of responses on this forum. It is a non-story really. A stupid caddy said something idiotic about a golfer/miser/slut and it becomes global news. Pur-lease.


I am even considering starting a thread on custom fitting or GPS devices as a diversionary measure. Is Ethan around?
 
Snelly, I agree that this story has been over-hyped, but I'm not sure I would call it a non-story. Golf has a terrible past in terms of its attitudes to race issues and so in the modern era, anything that contains a whiff of racism needs to be addressed and debated. That should be the least that a forward-looking sporting community would do.

Instead we have a raft of players, commissioners etc all dodging the issue, which looks terrible.

As for Steve Williams himself... he can bleat all he likes about context, setting, intent etc, but just the use of the word black as part of a wider insult is damning. The fact that it was there as an adjective close at hand when he reached for a word is telling. However pissed or over-excited I was, it is simply not a word that would be in my vocabulary because I'd never use it in that context. For him to describe Tiger as a black anything suggests to me he's done it before.
 
I now have to concede you're on the windup, you must be, either that or you are seriously detached from reality. After Woods split with Butch in 2004, he went on to win 31 times including 6 majors and 8 WGC events - hardly going downhill.
 
Monty,

It is only a story because it is about Woods and it involves the word black which in this day and age, hyper-accelerates any news item. I bet there were much worse things said at this event that haven't been reported. I bet it wouldn't have been a barrel of laughs at this gig for feminists either!

An ex-girlfriend of mine was a beautiful black girl and I am certain that she would have said the same as me - storm in a teacup. Move on.

BTW, I would love to know what Chris Rock thinks of this...
 
Monty,

It is only a story because it is about Woods and it involves the word black which in this day and age, hyper-accelerates any news item. I bet there were much worse things said at this event that haven't been reported. I bet it wouldn't have been a barrel of laughs at this gig for feminists either!

An ex-girlfriend of mine was a beautiful black girl and I am certain that she would have said the same as me - storm in a teacup. Move on.

BTW, I would love to know what Chris Rock thinks of this...

Agree that the way in which this was propelled into the headlines was artificial, but once it is there, by whatever means, the sport has a duty to deal with the issues it raises. It took too long for any offical reaction.

I'm sure there were all sorts of dodgy comments made at that event that went unreported, but that does not excuse what Williams said. He still said it.

For me the fact that Williams can caddy for Tiger for all that time, but when doling out an insult throws in an adjective relating to his race, betrays a deeply suspicous attitude.
 
Probably so HE, but would it have been as widely publicised?

Probably not.

But Williams himself would know that given the recent controversy, his words regarding Tiger are being scrutinised. Yet he said it any way... the guy is a tool.

I don't buy this idea that press hype is entirely to blame. Yes the flames are being fanned by the level fo coverage, but he said what he said... the media didn't make him.
 
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Don't like Williams, and he is obviously still very bitter with Tiger, but don't think he is a racist. Might just have surfaced whilst he was working for Tiger all those years.
 
You dont need to be a robe wearing red neck with a pointy hat to be a racist. I think there are varying levels of racism, what he said was definitley a racial slur, so that makes him a racist otherwise he would not have come out with that kind of crap.

But does he go round after work with his mates and fire bomb ethnic minorities, or does he make coloured people sit at the back of the bus probably not.

Like others have said in any other walk of life this kind of thing is totally unacceptable and I cant believe he has got away with it.
 
Racism is alive and well in golf and the tour seem to be happy for it to continue....not only that but Williams thought it was all rather funny......

Caddie Steve Williams called the backlash over the racially insensitive remarks he made about his former boss Tiger Woods over the weekend "absolutely ridiculous" in an interview with New Zealand's Newstalk ZB radio on Monday morning.

"It's kind of like a locker room environment—everyone's just having a good time. My comments were by no means the worst comments that were passed. There was a lot of profanity and a lot of other kind of remarks, but just because I make a remark regarding my former employer, it gets blown way out of proportion and it's absolutely ridiculous."

During a caddie banquet in Shanghai, Williams was asked on stage why he gloated following Adam Scott's victory at the Bridgestone Invitational shortly after Woods fired Williams. He replied, "My aim was to shove it right up that black ***!"

In the radio interview, Williams disagreed that "all the jaws dropped at the same time" as some reports said, and he cited a "difference of opinion" between those present at the banquet and media reports afterward.

"It was a fun sort of thing and everyone laughed their heads off. So, I mean, what you read is absolutely ridiculous."
 
Look, racism, sexism and homophobia are rife in golf and it is our duty to clear them out

There is massive statistical correlation with the appaling dress codes in golf.

Get rid of the racist, sexist and homophobia by getting rid of the dress code thinking that goes with it.

Bring in no collars and jeans like Sir Nick Faldo is wearing in another golf magazine this week
 
The original comment was totally unacceptable and bad enough in itself. His attempts to justify what he said just make it worse and show how arrogant, stupid and out of touch he is.

How could any self respecting Tour Pro be happy to have him carrying their bag?
 
Look, racism, sexism and homophobia are rife in golf and it is our duty to clear them out

There is massive statistical correlation with the appaling dress codes in golf.

Get rid of the racist, sexist and homophobia by getting rid of the dress code thinking that goes with it.

Bring in no collars and jeans like Sir Nick Faldo is wearing in another golf magazine this week

Interesting theory lol - good wind up mate
 
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