South West Trains

[HomerJSimpson]

Got to love SWT. This morning with the overnight snowfall the train to work turned up about 10 minutes late (not unusual on a normal day) and no problems at all. We've had no further snow at all during the day and I thought I'd check the website on the off chance (don't usually and not sure why I did) and lo all the Reading - Waterloo trains either cancelled or delayed (with no estimated time of departure). How can that be? In the end I got HID to drive as the roads around the Thames Valley are actually pretty good.

I bet that even without any further snow there will be a shedload of delays and cancellations tomorrow when I try and get to work.

 

[Toad]

Homer,

The biggest problem we have had all week with the snow is traincrew being unable to get to work.

We then have to shuffle crews around to cover the main commuter services and the knock on effect is that the majority of crews are out of place, by this I mean we have a crew in Aberdeen when they should be in Glasgow etc.

We then have no one available to work the crews next booked workings in Glasgow so it has to be cancelled.

The next biggest problem for us anyway is that the trains air pipes freeze causing the brakes to apply, unfortunately all you can do is sit and wait for them to thaw, on average this has taken 45 minutes.

As you can imagine if it is -10 outside as it was today, and you have a train travelling at 90mph with wind chill it must be nearer to -30 I guess.

Now despite asking people not to travel due to the extreme weather, the trains have been busier than usual!! This is because people are reluctant to drive their car but they still expect the railway to run to time with no cancellations.

It has been a nightmare on the railway since Sunday up here with no signs of it improving, we are desperate for a big thaw but will then have to contend with flooding its a vicious circle my man.

John.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Funnily enough I'm not complaining and HID picked me up anyway so I was fine. What I couldn't understand was how the trains were running at 7.00am and crewed and as the day progressed (with less snow) they weren't.

I can understand a train being taken out of service with frozen brakes etc and wouldn't have a problem if it was just one but when the whole service seemed to have ground to a halt from mid-afternoon onwards it seemed a bit strange.

To be honest throughout the cold snap the trains have been pretty good and in general the Waterloo-Reading line is one of the better services anyway

 

[Toad]

Homer,

The main problem is all of the early morning trains get away on time but crews end up stranded elsewhere due to late running.
The trains with frozen brakes are stuck on the track until the air pipes thaw, with every other train heading in the same direction waiting for it to get on the move again.

As crews can work around 5 hours before they have a break the problems with displaced crews start to appear later in the day hence your problems in the mid afternoon.

All train operating company's try their hardest to get every single train running on time with no cancellations as the penalty for late running is massive, each minute of delay caused by ourselfs costs on average £80, one train can have a knock on affect to numerous trains adding up to thousands of minutes over the course of one journey equalling fines in the tens of thousands.

Hope this explains the what and why of delays and cancellations at this time and believe me we don't like delays anymore than you do mate.

Cheers
John

 

[HomerJSimpson]

John,

Thanks for that. Like I say not knocking the crews and the line I use is pretty good most of the year. Just found it frustrating. Would have preferred it the other way round with no trains (or imminent sign of any for a few hours) this morning and I could have tried to blag the day off instead. Ho hum. Just the cold snap and freezing fog to contend with tomorrow and no golf to look forward to either

 

[AuburnWarrior]

now despite asking people not to travel due to the extreme weather..

But people still have to get to work!! It's fine saying that people shouldn't travel but when you've got a Manager telling you that you have to get in - what do you do??

It's time the train companies realise that snow isn't a freak occurance anymore. We've had snow in London twice this year - January and now in November/December so ALL the train companies need to be investing HEAVILY in winter equipment to keep the trains running.

Perhaps a trip to Canada/Russia is in order, see how they cope.

I apologise for ranting but we've had 12" of snow MAX and it's like the end of the world on the railways.

 

[Toad]

I don't have a problem with people travelling but they have to understand that the trains may be late or cancelled, they could also refrain from hurling abuse at staff just because the train is a little late.
I also believe the road network ground to a complete halt due to the snow, at least we kept the trains running with a few delays and cancellations that were mostly caused by staff unable to get to work via the roads

As for investing in winter equipment what do you suggest?

The trains are designed to operate in our climate and are usually extremely reliable but when the tempature drops to -10 and below as it has been in Scotland then you are bound to experiance some minor problems.

 

[SammmeBee]

I also believe the road network ground to a complete halt due to the snow, at least we kept the trains running with a few delays and cancellations that were mostly caused by staff unable to get to work via the roads

Nonsense, scaremongering by the police and radio/media kept people off the roads today and probably from going to work - at least that'll give them a story on Monday as to why the country is going to financial ruin.....

 

[Toad]

LOL

I wish it was nonsense then we would not have had all the roads blocked by fallen trees and jack knifed lorries.
We have had over 2feet of snow in most areas and with gritters concentrating in attempting to keep the major roads open the majority of A+B roads have been left untreated and are unpassable.

 

[AuburnWarrior]

I don't have a problem with people travelling but they have to understand that the trains may be late or cancelled, they could also refrain from hurling abuse at staff just because the train is a little late.
I also believe the road network ground to a complete halt due to the snow, at least we kept the trains running with a few delays and cancellations that were mostly caused by staff unable to get to work via the roads

As for investing in winter equipment what do you suggest?

The trains are designed to operate in our climate and are usually extremely reliable but when the tempature drops to -10 and below as it has been in Scotland then you are bound to experiance some minor problems.

The staff were very visable by their absence!! All we wanted was information - where were the staff??

The roads looked OK to me. Slow but OK.

I would think some form of filament could be installed in the track to keep it warm - stop them from freezing.

Purchase trains that operate in a colder climate??

As I said, snow and freezing temperatures appear to be the norm now - time to re-think our approach to winter.

 

[surefire]

It's time the train companies realise that snow isn't a freak occurance anymore. We've had snow in London twice this year - January and now in November/December so ALL the train companies need to be investing HEAVILY in winter equipment to keep the trains running.

Perhaps a trip to Canada/Russia is in order, see how they cope.

I apologise for ranting but we've had 12" of snow MAX and it's like the end of the world on the railways.

In that case, we would have a forum post moaning about the increased ticket prices, for no visible return on the railways.

All the gear to deal with these conditions is going to cost money.

For the sake of maybe 2 weeks a year of snow, I'd rather have cheaper travel for the other 50 weeks of the year myself.

Same applies to road infrastructure etc...

 

[SammmeBee]

LOL

I wish it was nonsense then we would not have had all the roads blocked by fallen trees and jack knifed lorries.
We have had over 2feet of snow in most areas and with gritters concentrating in attempting to keep the major roads open the majority of A+B roads have been left untreated and are unpassable.

Have you actually been out or just listening to the BBC (in between apologising for the 2018 debacle?)...M25, A3, M3 we all fine today as were the A roads....only proper side roads need care but all were perfectly passable....

 

[Toad]

The cold track is not a problem it is the build up of snow, in todays world of litigation everyone is scared to make a mistake, so train running is suspended if the depth of snow is 200mm above the hight of the rail.
There has been instances where a build up of snow in front of a train has lifted it off the track.

Other countries have different rules and procedures and they need heavier trains with snow ploughs etc to enable them to run, as you rightly said our conditions are nothing compared to the likes of Canada for example so how often would we need such mesures, the cost then becomes an obstacle why spend millions of taxpayers money on trains that are only required for a few weeks of the year.

The only time we have problems is when the tempature drops significantly lower than normal but then so does everyone else who operates a form of public transport be it buses, trains or planes.

 

[Toad]

Not seen any news report as I started at 04:30 this morning and was at work until 18:30 trying to keep the trains running

Besides all the roads you have listed are in England where you had a light dusting of snow and thankfully I don't work in that area.

 

[SammmeBee]

Besides all the roads you have listed are in England where you had a light dusting of snow and thankfully I don't work in that area.

So your points in relation then to SWT are......??

 

[SwingSlow]

Can't comment on SWT as I'm in Essex, but scariest announcement I remember on the Liverpool Street line was that our train was delayed because they had to find a driver that knew the way.

I thought that was what the tracks were for - I never realised they actually steered the things.

 

[Toad]

Before you added your tuppenceworth I was simply explaining to Martin some of the problems we were experiencing up here, and that the same issues may have been also affecting the services being operated by his local train operator.

As before the majority of problems are being caused by staff unable to get to their workplace due to the same reason why so many other people were leaving the car at home, poor road conditions or an unwillingness to travel.

 

[Toad]

Swingslow,

Drivers have certain route knowledge specific to the depot they work from, they are required to know the routes they work over intimately for example all speed changes, curvature, gradients and braking points for each station, trespass risk areas, location of all signals and junctions amongst other things, this makes it impossible and illegal for a driver without the required route knowledge to drive over a route he has not been fully assessed for.

 

[SammmeBee]

Swingslow,

Drivers have certain route knowledge specific to the depot they work from, they are required to know the routes they work over intimately for example all speed changes, curvature, gradients and braking points for each station, trespass risk areas, location of all signals and junctions amongst other things, this makes it impossible and illegal for a driver without the required route knowledge to drive over a route he has not been fully assessed for.

Did you teach Bob Crow everything he thinks he knows??!!

 

[SyR]

My SWT to London was 40 mins late this morning. Most of that delay was due to them not being able to couple the two halves of the train at Southampton. We went without the back half in the end. We also got delayed for a bit as they let a stopping service got ahead for a while and there was the usual wait outside Waterloo for a free platform. It took a few mins to open the doors at Waterloo as they had iced up.

The way home was chaos. I left early from work as I saw the arrivals to Waterloo were very delayed. I got to Waterloo at 4pm, all trains were showing delayed or cancelled. Only two trains were showing as having platforms assigned and they were both rammed full of people. The concourse was so full I waited on a platform. A really garbled announcement said something about Weymouth and platform 6. There was a stampede as hundreds of people rushed to platform 6 only to find the 5 car train was full.

The lack of information was the worst part. I finally got out by standing on a platform with two empty trains and got on the first one that announced it was leaving. It was full within a minute but didn't leave for another 30 mins for unknown reasons. The guard wasn't sure what stations it would call and only told us when we stopped at the second stop. It only took me part way to Southampton but that was better than staying at Waterloo. I changed at Winchester and had to wait in the staffless station until finally a Southampton train turned up. I got home at 8:30, so about 5 hours door to door for a 1:45 mins trip.

I doubt I'll risk repeating this tomorrow given an emergency timetable is in operation and the last time I travelled when an emergency time table was in place I spent over 7 hours on the train and ended up back where I started without getting to work.

Despite all of the above, I don't blame the train companies for the delays although communication could be a lot better. The real problem is that so many people have to commute to London as so many jobs are there but the house prices are crazy. If my company were set up better for letting us work at home, then I wouldn't have even bothered, but they only provide email access from home.