garyinderry
Ryder Cup Winner
I may be wrong but I don't think that is even a recent statement. I think it was when he was released from prison.
Second Chances
- Thread starter bladeplayer
- Start date
Beezerk
Money List Winner
Two different types of crimes though, one is a pre meditated sex attack, the other a drunken car crash (not sure of the details of the Luke McCormick accident) however I'm not trying to say one is worse than the other.
I just can't see how you can have a convicted rapist playing pro football with all the exposure it brings.
FairwayDodger
Money List Winner
It was released this afternoon after Oldham withdrew their offer.
Beezerk
Money List Winner
For making a comeback in football, he can become a window cleaner for all I care.
shewy
Journeyman Pro
I actually think Harry Rednap had it spot on in his news conferance today. It's a hard one and I think all clubs should wait until the appeal is over,then he will be either a convicted rapist or a cleared one. If the conviction stands then nobody will go near him.
if he's cleared then by all means get your career going again.
if he's cleared then by all means get your career going again.
garyinderry
Ryder Cup Winner
So it was.
The whole thing is a mess. Even if he had waited till he was a completely free there would still be the same uproar.
Hacker Khan
Yurt Dwelling, Yoghurt Knitter
Rightly or wrongly yes, there will always be an element of that as that is human nature. People will always be more willing to give say a shoplifter a second chance than they will a rapist.
I know its semantics/splitting hairs but, "I do remain limited at present by what I can say due to the ongoing referral to the Criminal Cases Review Commission and whilst I continue to maintain my innocence, I wish to make it clear that I wholeheartedly apologise for the effects that night in Rhyl has had on many people, not least the woman concerned."
Cause and effect...
In my view, he's arguing with the interpretation the jury have made. He doesn't deny what went on, only the that it is being deemed as rape. However, the law is pretty clear on the responsibility, irrespective of how anyone wants to interpret it.
For what its worth, if he'd accepted the judgement, held his hands up and shown remorse I'd be all for him playing again - second chance. And I don't subscribe to the role model excuse some make to say he shouldn't play. "Done the time..." No one should have to wear sack cloth and ashes for life, although I would agree that dependent on the crime there are places someone shouldn't work, e.g. a paedo in a children's home.
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garyinderry
Ryder Cup Winner
If it were up to me he wouldn't be fit to play football by the time he got out. The length of sentence for rape is a joke.
By the same measure, I don't make the rules and as they stand he should be allowed the freedom to work as any other. We cannot change this because it conflicts with our own moral compass.
By the same measure, I don't make the rules and as they stand he should be allowed the freedom to work as any other. We cannot change this because it conflicts with our own moral compass.
Rooter
Money List Winner
Probably not shopkeepers...
lobthewedge
Challenge Tour Pro
I understand why, given the current news story, but considering all the grey areas concerning the events, his conviction and outstanding appeal; Ched Evans is a poor example to use when debating the rights and wrongs of giving criminals a second chance.
Personally I believe these things should be dealt with on an individual basis, some people are deserving and others sadly aren't.
Personally I believe these things should be dealt with on an individual basis, some people are deserving and others sadly aren't.
PhilTheFragger
Provider of Entertainment for the Golfing Gods 🙄
Taking Evans out of this for a minute, the issue is a convicted criminal being able to return to work after serving time.
My take on this depends on whether the crime was "work "related or not, For instance an accountant being convicted of fraud needs to find a new career as nobody will ever trust him again,
Contrast that with the same accountant being convicted of GBH or rape after a drunken night out, Not related to his job at all, therefore he should be able to return to that same line of work after his sentence.
Now bring Evans back into the arguement. He didnt commit any crime ON THE PITCH, therefore his crime has nothing to do with his work. It is purely the fact that footballers are seen as "role models" that is keeping him out of a job. Which I feel is wrong.
Lets also ask the question of what happens to him if he cannot return to football. he is young, fit, healthy and unskilled, he could learn a trade, or he could easily end up on the dole being supported by the tax payer....
OR
he could return to football, not be a burden on society and able to make a sizable contribution to a rape charity
If we as a society are unwilling to give our ex convicts a second chance, then we might as well throw away the keys
It will be interesting to see what the Criminal Case Review Board come up with, I just wish they would get on with it
My take on this depends on whether the crime was "work "related or not, For instance an accountant being convicted of fraud needs to find a new career as nobody will ever trust him again,
Contrast that with the same accountant being convicted of GBH or rape after a drunken night out, Not related to his job at all, therefore he should be able to return to that same line of work after his sentence.
Now bring Evans back into the arguement. He didnt commit any crime ON THE PITCH, therefore his crime has nothing to do with his work. It is purely the fact that footballers are seen as "role models" that is keeping him out of a job. Which I feel is wrong.
Lets also ask the question of what happens to him if he cannot return to football. he is young, fit, healthy and unskilled, he could learn a trade, or he could easily end up on the dole being supported by the tax payer....
OR
he could return to football, not be a burden on society and able to make a sizable contribution to a rape charity
If we as a society are unwilling to give our ex convicts a second chance, then we might as well throw away the keys
It will be interesting to see what the Criminal Case Review Board come up with, I just wish they would get on with it
chrisd
Major Champion
FairwayDodger
Money List Winner
I don't think the "role model" argument is entirely spurious, but there may be too much being made of it.
However, what Evans and the clubs that have considered signing him are discovering is that professional footballer is a high profile job. Amongst other things, clubs need to attract a level of sponsorship to be able to operate. Businesses don't sponsor clubs out of the goodness of their hearts, they do it to raise their profile, to associate themselves with something the public find desirable or admirable. And clubs need fans to support them, to "invest" their time and money to follow the team. Public opinion is therefore vital and Evans is poison.
In terms of second chances, I don't think there really needs to be ban on clubs signing him (although it also wouldn't bother me if the FA did establish some sort of "fit and proper" test for players) but I think any club that did would be pretty stupid to do so unless/until his image improves significantly. Judging by his statement today I think that penny might finally have dropped but too late, in my opinion.
Hacker Khan
Yurt Dwelling, Yoghurt Knitter
Kind of facetious question but I think one worth making, what if the accountant had been convicted of rape as he was a sober serial rapist? Is there a difference in severity of a rape conviction? Would they still be able to return to work?
bluewolf
Money List Winner
Hammer meet nail..
Football is a Public Relations Business now.. It's one of the downsides of the vast amounts of money in the modern game. You may not like it, but Mr Evans is now realizing that whilst he may be obliged a second chance, there isn't a football club around that will give him one unless they are completely financially independent.. If you dance with the devil!!
PhilTheFragger
Provider of Entertainment for the Golfing Gods 🙄
I think a sober serial rapist would be getting a huge prison sentence, and if still considered a risk to the public at the end , they should not be released
FairwayDodger
Money List Winner
Bad example anyway, I'm pretty sure a convicted rapist accountant would lose their practising certificate.
Hacker Khan
Yurt Dwelling, Yoghurt Knitter
But the point I am making is that just applying the 'everyone should be given a second chance if it is not directly work related' rule to all situations is very problematic to me. In general I agree that if you've done your time, show signs of remorse and/or indicated you are willing to change then you should get a second chance. But there are some cases where morally (and this is a moral and to some extent commercial situation he is in now, as legally he has not been stopped from playing football in this country) people will not be comfortable with someone convicted of horrible crimes against a person being able to do certain things. And this to me is one of them.
For what its worth, the more I read up on this case the worse it looks for the police and claimant. Evans while silly does look to have been unjustly convicted.
http://www.chedevans.com/ the girl has had a previous allegation of rape lodged, tweeted that she was going to get off on holidays, get matching cars etc.
Police had decided upon rape 15 mins after the initial conversation with her when all she wanted to report was a stolen handbag and phone (which she had left outside the takeaway). The police asked her what she did the previous night then went straight to rape investigation. Her alcohol levels were zero when tested (she had consumed 2 glasses of wine and a couple of large vodkas but nothing to make her properly steaming drunk) though Cocaine and others were found though, in a 19 year old?
There are a couple of videos on there from hotel CCTV which discredits the prosecutions claim that she was incapable of practically anything, wearing high heels, she is able to bend over and pick up a pizza box from the path better than I could sober...all sounds very iffy.
I dont know nor really warm to Evans but I cant help but think he has been dumped upon simply for being a footballer and a bit thick.
http://www.chedevans.com/ the girl has had a previous allegation of rape lodged, tweeted that she was going to get off on holidays, get matching cars etc.
Police had decided upon rape 15 mins after the initial conversation with her when all she wanted to report was a stolen handbag and phone (which she had left outside the takeaway). The police asked her what she did the previous night then went straight to rape investigation. Her alcohol levels were zero when tested (she had consumed 2 glasses of wine and a couple of large vodkas but nothing to make her properly steaming drunk) though Cocaine and others were found though, in a 19 year old?
There are a couple of videos on there from hotel CCTV which discredits the prosecutions claim that she was incapable of practically anything, wearing high heels, she is able to bend over and pick up a pizza box from the path better than I could sober...all sounds very iffy.
I dont know nor really warm to Evans but I cant help but think he has been dumped upon simply for being a footballer and a bit thick.
