Rules Question

[Ronnoc1980]

Hi

I have a question if a player marks his ball on the putting green with his pitch repairer and then requires it does he have to replace his ball and remark or can he mark his pitch tool with another marker ?

Thanks

 

[Lucasme76]

Hi

I have a question if a player marks his ball on the putting green with his pitch repairer and then requires it does he have to replace his ball and remark or can he mark his pitch tool with another marker ?

Thanks

Simple answer is he will need to replace the ball, remove the pitch repairer then remark his ball with another marker.

 

[duncan mackie]

Hi

I have a question if a player marks his ball on the putting green with his pitch repairer and then requires it does he have to replace his ball and remark or can he mark his pitch tool with another marker ?

Thanks

As far as I am concerned this would be fine, analagous with a player moving a ball marker that interferes with a players line - do you replace the ball, move the ball then remark or mark the position of the marker with a clubhead (usually) and move the marker? I believe the latter is standard practice.

 

[Colin L]

My immediate thought was it's not a problem provided you put down the marker before you lift the pitch mark repairer. Then Lucas made me think I must be overlooking something so I did a quick trawl through the relevant rules and decisions. There's nothing to suggest I was overlooking anything. Perhaps the key question is whether at any point in changing the markers, the position of the ball has been left unmarked. It hasn't, so I would hold to my immediate thought and agree with Duncan.

 

[Ronnoc1980]

My immediate thought was it's not a problem provided you put down the marker before you lift the pitch mark repairer. Then Lucas made me think I must be overlooking something so I did a quick trawl through the relevant rules and decisions. There's nothing to suggest I was overlooking anything. Perhaps the key question is whether at any point in changing the markers, the position of the ball has been left unmarked. It hasn't, so I would hold to my immediate thought and agree with Duncan.

Thanks all for the response,

If a player marks their marker though and not the ball surely the ball could then be replaced in the wrong place maybe up to an inch either side? Then if say it just makes it to the hole would indeed it have been the case if marked correctly?


I would never pull someone for it but it happens in a match and I just wanted to know the rule.

 

[Colin L]

You could be very accurate in marking the same spot (click on image for larger size).

 

[Ronnoc1980]

You could be very accurate in marking the same spot (click on image for larger size).

View attachment 6157

Sorry maybe I have not been clear so the pitch mark tool was stuck in the ground behind the ball the marked either behind or to the Sid with a tee stuck tip down in the ground.

I think this leaves a lot of room for error when replacing the ball.

 

[bladeplayer]

Thanks all for the response,

If a player marks their marker though and not the ball surely the ball could then be replaced in the wrong place maybe up to an inch either side? Then if say it just makes it to the hole would indeed it have been the case if marked correctly?


.

Just wondering here ... Are you not obliged to reverse the process when marking & replacing & a ball . ie place the marker behind the ball and lift the ball , then place the ball in front of the marker & lift the marker .. in this case to ensure ball being returned to same place would you not be expected to replace the pitch mark repairer and lift the ball marker , then place the ball in front of the pitch repair marker then lift it ?? in appreciate there would only be millimetres in the difference but would this not be the proper course to take ???

 

[Colin L]

Sorry maybe I have not been clear so the pitch mark tool was stuck in the ground behind the ball the marked either behind or to the Sid with a tee stuck tip down in the ground.

I think this leaves a lot of room for error when replacing the ball.

Any kind of marking leaves a lot of room for error: it's up to the player to make sure he marks accurately.

If you have a pitchmark repairer stuck in and then place a coin or round marker behind it so that it is touching the repairer and centred between the prongs, I really can't see any inaccuracy. Perhaps my first diagram wasn't clear. Here's what I mean with a little perspective.

 

[Ronnoc1980]

Hi

I am loving the diagrams but my question is not really if its indeed possible to accurately mark a ball with a pitch tool. It's along the lines of what Bladeplayer said is it ok to mark your mark and replace your ball or should you replace the marker then the ball.

 

[Colin L]

Well, I thought I was answering this by showing that the second marker could be placed very accurately

If a player marks their marker though and not the ball surely the ball could then be replaced in the wrong place maybe up to an inch either side? Then if say it just makes it to the hole would indeed it have been the case if marked correctly?

No matter, Duncan answered the question of whether you could just put a new marker down and lift the previous one in post #3 and I followed up in post #4. We are both saying you can.

Hope that helps.

 

[duncan mackie]

Hi

I am loving the diagrams but my question is not really if its indeed possible to accurately mark a ball with a pitch tool. It's along the lines of what Bladeplayer said is it ok to mark your mark and replace your ball or should you replace the marker then the ball.

sorry I'm back late, Committee meetings can drag....

you should definitely reverse any process, I was responding to your question as to whether, under the rules, you could mark the marker and remove it - the new marker only marks the position of the old one, not the position of the ball; exactly the same as when you mark a marker (with a club head) to move it out of someones way.

if you want a reference you should use 20-1/16 which includes "When moving a ball or ball-marker to the side to prevent it from interfering with another player's stance or stroke, the player may measure from the side of the ball or ball-marker. In order to accurately replace the ball on the spot from which it was lifted, the steps used to move the ball or ball-marker to the side should be reversed."

 

[Ronnoc1980]

Thanks for this that clears it up nicely

 

[rulefan]

Hi

I have a question if a player marks his ball on the putting green with his pitch repairer and then requires it does he have to replace his ball and remark or can he mark his pitch tool with another marker ?

Thanks

I have it from the R&A that the ball should be replaced whilst the old marker is replaced by the new. However, they agreed that an unorthodox alternative would be acceptable. ie To mark marker #1 with marker #2. Then put marker #3 where marker #1 was.
Certainly the old marker cannot simply be lifted (even for a second) before replacing it with the new, as the ball would be unmarked for that second.

 

[North Mimms]

Sorry maybe I have not been clear so the pitch mark tool was stuck in the ground behind the ball the marked either behind o to the Sid with a tee stuck tip down in the ground.

I think this leaves a lot of room for error when replacing the ball.

Pitch tool? Tee peg?
I know you can theoretically use anything , but the ideal thing is called a ball marker for a reason!

 

[Colin L]

Steady on, there. I often use a pitchmark tool or long tee for marking when well out of the line of other players because they are the ideal things for saving me having to bend down so far.

 

[Tommo21]

Pitch tool? Tee peg?
I know you can theoretically use anything , but the ideal thing is called a ball marker for a reason!

Yes, In a bounce game fine, but just mark the ball with a coin or proper marker when playing comps. Never leave yourself open to any doubt or question.

 

[Colin L]

There is no doubt or question: you can mark your ball in a competition with a tee, pitch mark repairer, pencil - whatever you like as long the ball is accurately marked.

 

[Tommo21]

There is no doubt or question: you can mark your ball in a competition with a tee, pitch mark repairer, pencil - whatever you like as long the ball is accurately marked.

and replaced.......

 

[Colin L]

Well, that really goes without saying .... but didn't.