Public sector strikes

[hovis]

As I said the vast majority of us, both public and private sectors, are in this together.

But are we in this together? If david cameron said mps pension contributions are going up by 5% too then i would happy take my extra 120 a month in contributions to number 10 myself but thats not the case and makes this pill a very bitter one to swallow

 

[Deleted member 18588]

But are we in this together? If david cameron said mps pension contributions are going up by 5% too then i would happy take my extra 120 a month in contributions to number 10 myself but thats not the case and makes this pill a very bitter one to swallow

Well there are only 650 MP's so they are hardly representative. But then they are public sector employees so who knows?

With politicians of all persuasions it has always been "do as I say, not as I do!".

 

[williamalex1]

It's the same in the military - lots of pen pushers

Also in the NHS far too many pen pushers .

 

[SocketRocket]

it is nice and i busted my balls to get that job
Yes they do shaft us all mate but perhaps the grief they get from unions stops them shafting us all as much.

You are not shafted, you guys get a good basic salary when trained and can earn much more through promotion, just like we all have to. The difference with you is you get a pension that most can only dream of but they have to subsidise it for you.

I believe you do a good job that people respect you for but you are not exactly rocket scientists and are asking for too much. It's no good people banging on about politicians and bankers getting more, if they think its that easy then no one is stopping them from doing it themselves.

I repeat my point that no one is asking you to work beyond 60, currently Firefighters tend to retire at 55, this is much to early, if you have not done the full qualifying years then you wont get the full pension, thats the same for everyone. Most other people will have to work to 67 before they get a pension.

 

[williamalex1]

But are we in this together? If david cameron said mps pension contributions are going up by 5% too then i would happy take my extra 120 a month in contributions to number 10 myself but thats not the case and makes this pill a very bitter one to swallow

Percentage rises only make the differential worse, give everyone the same increase £20,£30,£40 a week or whatever but the amount should be the same .

 

[Old Skier]

currently Firefighters tend to retire at 55, this is much to early, if you have not done the full qualifying years then you wont get the full pension, thats the same for everyone. Most other people will have to work to 67 before they get a pension.

IMO, having tried to do the job (bloody striking firemen), running around fighting fires with all that gear on even for a 50 year old must be tough going. It's time for the ambulance and fire service to become one as per the sceptic model. That way, there would be ample jobs less physically demanding as people age.

 

[hovis]

You are not shafted, you guys get a good basic salary when trained and can earn much more through promotion, just like we all have to. The difference with you is you get a pension that most can only dream of but they have to subsidise it for you.

I believe you do a good job that people respect you for but you are not exactly rocket scientists and are asking for too much. It's no good people banging on about politicians and bankers getting more, if they think its that easy then no one is stopping them from doing it themselves.

I repeat my point that no one is asking you to work beyond 60, currently Firefighters tend to retire at 55, this is much to early, if you have not done the full qualifying years then you wont get the full pension, thats the same for everyone. Most other people will have to work to 67 before they get a pension.

Do people not read posts? When have i said i dont get paid enough and when have i said i want to retire at 55? I have said that i physically cant ride a fire engine when im 60. But to get my full term in i now have to as there will be no sideway moves. So bottom line is I'll do a compulsory fitness test when I'm 60 and according to the governments own findings i am almost certain to fail. Then i get sack and my pension will be destroyed. Funnily enough that saves the government 80k per sacked fire fighter.

And with all respect you dont know what your talking about regarding money for promotion. The pay increase from fire fighter to crew manager is nominal. To get into the big bucks you need station manger and up. So thats 280 fireman in my brigade after 7 jobs

 

[hovis]

It's time for the ambulance and fire service to become one as per the sceptic model. That way, there would be ample jobs less physically demanding as people age.

This is already on the cards. Its like you've been a fly on the wall

 

[hovis]

I repeat my point that no one is asking you to work beyond 60, currently Firefighters tend to retire at 55, this is way too early .

Really, have you ever wore full fire kit and breathing apparatus in 700 degree heat whilst performing arduous tasks. This takes us out "most people retire at 67" group.

Your also looking at it the wrong way. How would you feel about 5 60 year old fireman turning up to your house whilst your wife and kids are stuck inside?

 

[rosecott]

So bottom line is I'll do a compulsory fitness test when I'm 60 and according to the governments own findings i am almost certain to fail. Then i get sack and my pension will be destroyed.

The sack?

Sounds to me like early retirement with immediate pension - or have I got it wrong?

 

[hovis]

The sack?

Sounds to me like early retirement with immediate pension - or have I got it wrong?

Early forced retirement is correct. Pretty much get half what you would have
Imagine being 1 year from the finish line! Ouch!

 

[SocketRocket]

I would just like to make the point that Public Sector Pension funds have never been raided as they have never had any money in them, the pensions are paid from taxation. The current deficit in these funds is £550 Billion and rising, how can this continue?

There have been a number of references here to Gordon Brown and Politicians raiding these funds. How could they raid a fund that has a £550 Billion deficit? It was private pensions that were affected by his stopping tax relief on pension fund dividends.

If public sector expect the people in the private sector to pay more tax to subsidise their pensions then they need to wake up. How can you expect people with little or no pensions to prop them up.

We are broke, we have a national debt of £1.5 Trillion and growing rapidly. Does anyone honestly believe the answer to this is to stop MP's having a wage increase and tax banker bonuses. Also, does anyone honestly believe a new Labour government will fix these issues?

 

[hovis]

You didnt answer my question! You must be a mp

 

[Deleted member 18588]

So bottom line is I'll do a compulsory fitness test when I'm 60 and according to the governments own findings i am almost certain to fail. Then i get sack and my pension will be destroyed. Funnily enough that saves the government 80k per sacked fire fighter.

Sorry hovis but I cannot see where your pension will be destroyed.

Currently your Scheme Normal Retirement Age is 55 and under the proposed changes it will be 60. This is still much earlier than most employees.

Also if you leave service early you will still retain Preserved Benefits based upon your period of Pensionable Service and your Pensionable Earnings at the date of leaving.

 

[JCW]

The right to strike is a right won by workers when the rich called the shots , it is at times abused same as the rich abused the rights of workers , I was a member of ASLEF for 35 years , very powerful union that look after our conditions for years , but us the workers made it a strong , we moved on from our all out strike in 1982 from low pay to be some of the top earners . Its not easy being a teacher , have you any idea what the kids of today are like to teach , I always knew it was school holidays during my train driving days as we had an increase in train windows broken by kids throwing stones during this period , not to mention rubbish place on tracks to derail trains , good luck to anyone who feel they are not being treated right , 2 sides to every story so good luck to them

 

[hovis]

Sorry hovis but I cannot see where your pension will be destroyed.

Currently your Scheme Normal Retirement Age is 55 and under the proposed changes it will be 60. This is still much earlier than most employees.

Also if you leave service early you will still retain Preserved Benefits based upon your period of Pensionable Service and your Pensionable Earnings at the date of leaving.

Most ff's are on the new pension scheme that is 60. And for the 100th time we dont want a golden handshake and retire to spain. The strike is about job protection. When im not able to ride a fire engine i want the opportunity to complete my term in another position. This will no longer happen. Imagine loosing a 80k lump sum if you failed a fitness test 6 month before your end date. They'll boot me out and i can kiss goodbye to that

 

[SocketRocket]

Really, have you ever wore full fire kit and breathing apparatus in 700 degree heat whilst performing arduous tasks. This takes us out "most people retire at 67" group.

Your also looking at it the wrong way. How would you feel about 5 60 year old fireman turning up to your house whilst your wife and kids are stuck inside?

Yes I have actually in the RN.

People run marathons at 60 you do people in their sixties a disservice but the point is that 60 is retirement age, you dont need to work beyond it. As suggested previously the Brigade and Paramedics should be combined like in other countries.

 

[hovis]

Yes I have actually in the RN.

People run marathons at 60 you do people in their sixties a disservice but the point is that 60 is retirement age, you dont need to work beyond it. As suggested previously the Brigade and Paramedics should be combined like in other countries.

There is no way on gods earth a 60 year old man is going to endure those conditions. And running a marathon is child's play compared with making a rescue in a gas tight suit.
Thats also if we make 60. The Governments own professor found only 40% of male ff's would pass the proposed fitness tests at 53 and around 48 years old for a woman

So you happy with 60 year old fireman turning up at your house? Good luck to you

 

[SocketRocket]

There is no way on gods earth a 60 year old man is going to endure those conditions. And running a marathon is child's play compared with making a rescue in a gas tight suit.

So you happy with 60 year old fireman turning up at your house? Good luck to you

So its OK in your eyes if he's 55 then. Why not push for retirement at 40? Many Firefighters are not fit at 35 but they are not being put out of work.

60 is the full retirement age for the armed forces and Police. Why do you guys think you are something special? Stop making up silly examples of what might happen and be honest that this is all about Money and putting your feet up early.

 

[hovis]

So its OK in your eyes if he's 55 then. Why not push for retirement at 40? Many Firefighters are not fit at 35 but they are not being put out of work.

If a ff can't pass a fitness test at any age he shouldn't be sent to help your family. But common sense has to come into it. The fitness test is agest and the governments findings proved that. It works on v02 max. Even a very fit 60 year old would be certain to fail.
We want job related fitness tests