duncan mackie
Money List Winner
they have - see earlier post.
as you go on to say though, in this case it's 'call the official'
Peter Whiteford DQ'd!
- Thread starter Bobmysterkaymer
- Start date
they have - see earlier post.
as you go on to say though, in this case it's 'call the official'
HawkeyeMS
Ryder Cup Winner
But the pro game and the club game are already different. There is no-one standing down my fairway looking for my ball when I knob it into the rough, there aren't a load of people trampling down the rough to give me a decent lie when I find it and there aren't any grandstands or spectators around the green for me to bounce back into play off of when I hit a big old slice
Yer Maw
Head Pro
Rules officials should not be using tv footage as any blatant cheating is picked up by playing parters/crowd etc. Using TV means inconsistency in the application of the rules. The pro game is slow enough and they seem to be accepting ridiculous slow play now which is worse in my mind. Jason Day, what a farce. If players agree no infringement and the ref concurs with those involved then that really should be it and nothing gained.
I assume the ball wasn't on the green as the ball moving after address rule has changed hasn't it???
I assume the ball wasn't on the green as the ball moving after address rule has changed hasn't it???
duncan mackie
Money List Winner
The new exception to 18-2b (which applies all over the course not just on the green) wouldn't have applied here as it wasn't known, or virtually certain, that the player didn't cause the ball to move - there seems no debate over that.
Yer Maw
Head Pro
Can I get this right as your wording confuses me. If the player didn't cause the ball to move then I thought the ball was replaced with no penalty as an outside 'agency' caused the ball to move? Or was it his addressing of the ball that caused it to move and thus a penalty?
Ethan
Money List Winner
In that decision, the question posed said that the competition had closed. Obviously the 72 holes had no been completed, but perhaps The Committee took the view that the round was completed, hence their discretion was reduced?
duncan mackie
Money List Winner
" Q - A competitor returns his score card. It later transpires that the score for one hole is lower than actually taken due to his failure to include a penalty stroke(s) which he did not know he had incurred. The error is discovered before the competition has closed...."
It wouldn't make sense in relation to a competition that has closed when the breach is discovered because no penalty would be applied (in the situation under discussion)
duncan mackie
Money List Winner
If the player didn't cause the ball to move then the ball is played as it lies without penalty.
Yes, in this case it seems accepted that the player addressing the ball caused it to move. This requires the ball to be replaced and a penalty is incurred.
So playing Devil's advocate, you're happy that a rule is broken, i.e. that xxxxxx people around the world see a rule broken? Can you imagine the controversy if its known that the winner broke a rule? That would seriously harm the game and send the wrong message out to millions around the world that play, i.e. an 'accidental' nudge out of a divot scrape is ok.
As it stands the right thing was done by applying the rules. But in fairness its a harsh rule. What benefit did he gain? None. And ideally change the rule to a 2 shot penalty, not DQ'd, but still allow TV reporting/adjudication.
bladeplayer
Money List Winner
how can the rules of golf be the same world wide if some are allowed tv replays & some are not ?? so now you can be punished if your ufortunate enough the camera was showing you at that time ? let the players decide , if they are in agreement then kick on, if they cant agree then ask for a rules offical , can see televised comps geting longer & longer as players in the slightest doubt will be calling rules oficials & using tv coverage more & more .. so much for the spirit the game was built on & boasts about eh ? bull
Being spotted on camera or not doesn't mean the rule has or hasn't been broken. Does it even matter if its on camera or not? If its broken its still broken whether its spotted or not. Are you saying that just because the rule is broken, and only the camera and people at home spot it it shouldn't count as broken?
Its about posting a true score, not one with the odd penalty shot not counted.
"If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?"
bladeplayer
Money List Winner
Sorry mate what i was trying to say was for years this game was built up to what it is now by the honesty of the players involved , it has always been good enough , as golfers week in week out we are responsible for refereeing ourselves now all of a sudden that is no longer accepted , even at top level .. professional golf world wide has to be played by the same rules under the same competition rules , some use tv replays some dont , how is that equal? what if someone stands up & says if you are going to use slow mo tv to review my shot im entitled to ask you to veiw every shot played on slow mo to see if their ball moved or not , same rules for all .. should only be used if the players involed cant make a decision . if not their word will be taken for it .. if they cheat & its shown on camera the whole world will know this person won by cheating or is a cheat, this trial by armchair golfer has to stop , if you are going to implement tv replays then all the shots have to be viewed by an official or it is not an equal rule ..
FairwayDodger
Money List Winner
I phoned the SPL to complain about one of rangers disallowed goals yesterday. I'm sure they'll be revising the result any time now..... :mmm:
Blade, You're right, the game is what it is because of what's gone before. And it is a great game because of that inherent honesty. The armchair referee isn't a new phenomenon but it does ensure the right result in the event of a rules infringement that's been missed by the player.
Harrington spoke about it last year far better than I, and that was after he'd been spotted and subsequently DQ'd. He said no player wants to win a tournament by missing adding in penalty shots, and it is up to the player to assess the lie and if there is a possibility of the ball moving they shouldn't ground the club.
Is it fair and equal? In an ideal world every infringement would be spotted but it isn't an ideal world. But what is important is every one that is spotted is reported so that the right winner, 2nd, 3rd etc is declared. The alternative is for the wrong players to be declared winner etc, which is just plain wrong.
Will more and more players ask for their shots to be checked? Persoanlly I don't think they would, and nor can I see the tour approving of it.
Harrington spoke about it last year far better than I, and that was after he'd been spotted and subsequently DQ'd. He said no player wants to win a tournament by missing adding in penalty shots, and it is up to the player to assess the lie and if there is a possibility of the ball moving they shouldn't ground the club.
Is it fair and equal? In an ideal world every infringement would be spotted but it isn't an ideal world. But what is important is every one that is spotted is reported so that the right winner, 2nd, 3rd etc is declared. The alternative is for the wrong players to be declared winner etc, which is just plain wrong.
Will more and more players ask for their shots to be checked? Persoanlly I don't think they would, and nor can I see the tour approving of it.
So what happens if the guy calls for a ruling, the official says he's happy there has been no infringement. He carries on and hands in his card and then TV shows the player and official were wrong. Does he still get pinged retrospectively and D/Q'd or does the ruling given on the course still stand irrespective then of what TV may show
It happened on the Asian tour last autumn. The player get's DQ'd, and I guess the ref goes back to being a travel rep....
Imurg
The Grinder Of Pars (Semi Crocked)
Surely if the Official has made a ruling they have to stick to that ruling regardless of whether it's right or wrong..?
If you can overturn an Official's word then there's no point in having them on the course.
JT77
Tour Winner
I think john parramore (think thats how to spell it) was saying this morning that if your unsure, call an official.
I read that if you call a ref and they give a ruling that ruling stands regardless of tv replays.
Not 100% sure, but think thats right
I read that if you call a ref and they give a ruling that ruling stands regardless of tv replays.
Not 100% sure, but think thats right
MashieNiblick
Tour Winner
Hmm, I always thought the referee's decision was final.
Rule 34-2 - Referee’s Decision
If a referee has been appointed by the Committee, his decision is final.
Decision 34-2/2 Referee Authorises Player to Infringe a Rule
"Q. In error, a referee authorised a player to infringe a Rule of Golf. Is the player absolved from penalty in such a case?
A. Yes. Under Rule 34-2, a referee's decision is final, whether or not the decision is correct"
I suppose it depends if the official was actually a duly appointed "referee".
duncan mackie
Money List Winner
could you advise the incident event/player? this seems somewhat strange and whilst I remember well a couple of incidents at the same event last year, they don't fit this profile.
