Olly has been a clueless Captain. Discuss

Tiger

Tiger

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I don't know that much about golf. I also wasn't in Medinah speaking to and watching the players at close quarters. Heck I can't even get into our Tolly team let alone boast the kind of Ryder Cup record Olazabal has. But despite all of that some of his decisions have been mind boggling: persisting with an out of sorts Westwood, pairing Hanson & Lawrie, leaving Poulter on the bench on Friday Afternoon... AND I might add these aren't things I thought with the benefit of hindsight. These were questions I was thinking when the pairings were announced. I also look at the team and as a whole they seem quite flat, with the exception of the inspirational Poulter.

I think Olly would probably have performed better at a home Cup but if Monty was in charge I have a feeling it would be a lot closer. Your thoughts...
 
Tiger said:
I don't know that much about golf. I also wasn't in Medinah speaking to and watching the players at close quarters. Heck I can't even get into our Tolly team let alone boast the kind of Ryder Cup record Olazabal has. But despite all of that some of his decisions have been mind boggling: persisting with an out of sorts Westwood, pairing Hanson & Lawrie, leaving Poulter on the bench on Friday Afternoon... AND I might add these aren't things I thought with the benefit of hindsight. These were questions I was thinking when the pairings were announced. I also look at the team and as a whole they seem quite flat, with the exception of the inspirational Poulter.

I think Olly would probably have performed better at a home Cup but if Monty was in charge I have a feeling it would be a lot closer. Your thoughts...
Click to expand...

I disagree, too many of the team are just not playing their best and the USA team are, its that simple.
 
Poulter apart, I dont think I have seen any of the European team looking really pumped up, unlike several of the Americans. I have also been expecting Europe to miss putts and the US to hole theirs and generally thats how to turned out.
 
I agree that some of the pairings are a bit odd, Westwood and molinari being stand out for me as both a bit iffy with the flat stick.
I don't think monty would have made that much of a difference though, the us team has putted well and the course suits them.
Let's just hope they give it a good run today.
I was pleased to see Lawrie and colsearts, I think that was a good pairing as was Mcilroy and poults. So some good, some bad, maybe clueless is a bit harsh. Think he perservered with Westwood as he is the most experienced player and rightly or wrongly they thought he'd find form.
 
Ollie's had a very strong team to call on.
He could have put anyone out with anyone.
The fact is that the majority of the Euro team simply haven't played well enough whereas the majority of the US team have.
Although Faldo wasn't a good Captain, he suffered a similar fate - his players didn't play well enough.
And to say that the Captain has to get the team up for the RC - if anyone needs to have someone else get them up for playing in the RC then they have no business being a Professional Tournament Golfer.

Our best players simply haven't performed. They can still turn it around but all 12 have to play their part.
 
I think that's a bit harsh. Mainly we've been eclipsed by a great USA team and inspired strategy by DL3 setting up the course for the strengths of his team. To a large extent it has come down to the putting; USA seem to hole everything while too many of our guys struggled.

Olly has made some strange decisions. Westwood/Molinari seemed a strange pairing straight away and then persisting with an out-of-sorts Westwood was wrong. I couldn't understand playing Lawrie in fourballs but not foursomes; I think he's an ideal foursomes player. I also would have expected to see Hanson play yesterday - he wasn't actually bad in his match just got blitzed by some amazing USA golf.

That said, I think he got it right with McIlroy/Poulter, I liked Lawrie/Colsaerts even though they didn't get the win and I think he's called it right for the singles today - we need points early or it'll go very flat so put the strugglers out towards the end with the most likely of our "bottom 4" as last man.... just in case it's still on.
 
I think it is a case of having 12 good stroke play golfers but only 5 or 6 good matchplay golfers, when a few of them arent playing at their best then the results will be telling. I dont think it matters an awful lot who plays against who today, matchplay ignores world rankings. So as far as Olly being a bad captain? tosh, he has a world class team of vice captains with him who help him make sound decisions based on inside information, for us to criticise without knowing what they know is daft.
 
I think the biggest difference is that David Love III has actually thought put a strategy which means his team have an edge. Couple that with setting out the course to suite his players and that's why they are ahead. Olly has made some decisions that haven't worked for him, but team USA have played their socks off on days 1&2 to get the lead. I wonder if they will have enough left in the tank to take them across the line. Looking at some of the European players faces last night, they were drained mentally I thought. It'll be interesting to see how the first few matches start off. If the Americans can play like they did, no tactics by Olly would have been any use, we were just outclassed. Today might just be a little different I think.
 
DCB said:
I think the biggest difference is that David Love III has actually thought put a strategy which means his team have an edge. Couple that with setting out the course to suite his players and that's why they are ahead. Olly has made some decisions that haven't worked for him, but team USA have played their socks off on days 1&2 to get the lead. I wonder if they will have enough left in the tank to take them across the line. Looking at some of the European players faces last night, they were drained mentally I thought. It'll be interesting to see how the first few matches start off. If the Americans can play like they did, no tactics by Olly would have been any use, we were just outclassed. Today might just be a little different I think.
Click to expand...

I agree DCB,Lawrie looked like his erse was already ridden when he was interviewed last night.I got the feeling he just wanted to get out of there and he was spent.
 
Persevering with Westwood,and not playing Lawrie in the foursomes really does raise some questions about Olly's "strategy" or lack of it.At the end of the day its about how well the players play,but we could of been in a better position today had the choice of players/partnerships been different imo.
 
Does the captain really have that much of a bearing on the outcome? I believe that he has to be a good motivator and has to have the respect of the players ( I believe Olazabal has, don't think Faldo did) But do tactics really come into it that much.

I reckon any one of the European team can beat any one of the Americans on their day and vice versa, they just have to go out there, and believe in themselves.

Olazabal can't hit their shots for them.

Does any one else think the whole tactical thing is played on a bit by Sky to make the tournament sound more in depth and interesting.

We all know what the game is like, some days your on fire and other days you feel like you've never held a club before,the game ebbs and flows

For me, most of the Americans have been on their game and holed some amazing putts, and most Europeans havnt. Olazabal can only do so much, and what about ALL the vice captains, there's a lot of Ryder cup experience there. Again, they can't hit the shots for them.

We need blue on the board ASAP today and Maybe the tide will turn and we can at least make a contest of it.
 
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How easy to blame Olly...it's really a lot more simple than that. We have GOT to change the selection process and allow 4 no hell maybe even 5 wildcard/captains picks, because there are players in the team who are there on early 2012 form who by their own admission are playing average golf. I think the captain should in all honesty be allowed to pick the 12 players he wants, and do away with points altogether, the best players will ply their trade worldwide, and to make them slaves to the Euro Tour is very small minded , I think Kaymer is a casualty of not playing in the USA more, as is Westwood, maybe both will review that in 2013. The days of the Euro Tour holding a gun to the heads of the big names heads is over...maybe this one sided RC shows that, and as for saying Olly can't motivate them! If you can't motivate yourself as a pro golfer for something like this then go run a little driving range in Brataslavia or somewhere!!! Please do NOT blame it on Olly as some want to do...not the players I must stress...not yet anyway...not till the tell all books are written!
Even if we win the system of selection has to be revised, it is, and has been crap for too long, if we get the rogering we've had in the first 2 days then maybe the stuffed shirts of the Euro Tour might put down the brandy, wake up nd actually make a sensible change before next time.
 
Disagree its Ollys fault.
Olly is very well respected by the players.
Do you think Olly had to motivate Poulter.
Not a chance,seeing the Americans whooping and hollering,im sure gets right up Poulters nose,as it does most on here.
I would like to see a bit more passion in some other players.
Even a commentator,i think it was Bruce Critchley moaned about Poulters celebration last night.
Is he for real.
Yes to us he seems to have made a couple of bad decisions,but he sees them practicing every day,and
his seconds are feeding him information too.
Davis love has made some bad decisions and pairings too,just look at Woods and Stricker,yet he has
stuck with them.
As for putting Woods out last,ridiculous.
Woods will probably win because its singles,he not a team player,never will be.
 
Hmmmmm.......................

Interesting question, is Olly at fault? the players? or does it just work out that way when your opposition simply plays better than you?


One defining thing gets on my tits more than anything else and that is players leaving their putts short when their partner has already secured the half, Mcilroy's effort on the 18th last night was one HUGE example of that.

for all the brilliance/luck or whatever you want to call it from the Americans over the 1st two days and the apparent uselessness of the European team (or certainly many of it's players) I find it surprising that we are only 4pts behind! Yes Poulter played fantastic to secure a point last night and Colsearts 1st days play was sensational but other than that it's really surprising that we're not just stuck on 2pts considering that we've made about 15 birdies compared to the USA's 400,000,000 birdies :whistle:
 
JustOne said:
Hmmmmm.......................

Interesting question, is Olly at fault? the players? or does it just work out that way when your opposition simply plays better than you?


One defining thing gets on my tits more than anything else and that is players leaving their putts short when their partner has already secured the half, Mcilroy's effort on the 18th last night was one HUGE example of that.

for all the brilliance/luck or whatever you want to call it from the Americans over the 1st two days and the apparent uselessness of the European team (or certainly many of it's players) I find it surprising that we are only 4pts behind! Yes Poulter played fantastic to secure a point last night and Colsearts 1st days play was sensational but other than that it's really surprising that we're not just stuck on 2pts considering that we've made about 15 birdies compared to the USA's 400,000,000 birdies :whistle:
Click to expand...



Wouldnt want to be your partner,i would get right on your tits[smiley]
 
OK then, here we are as in the majority of sports when a team doesn't perform to expectations the manager gets it in the neck. He has automatic selection to contend with and not too many wild card picks to play with. Everyone of the team is a top class player with the ability to go out and win against anyone else in the field. Sometimes you win a match, sometimes you lose. Putts not dropping...well there's something new. We all have those days. The trouble is we are not on home soil, we are playing target golf which suits the Yanks, had it been in Europe it would have been played at a course with lots of rough and probably a bit more wind and rain. conditions more suited to our style of play. Let's not have a witch hunt here. Olly has been superb in Ryder Cups and doesn't deserve to be lambasted . Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose.
 
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