Official WHS Survey

[D-S]

The gentlemen of the Chipping Forecast promising a deep dive on WHS upcoming, including input from England Golf. Watch that space.

I would expect NCG to get stuck into it soon also. Their earlier ones were very good.

Our committee has finalised their proposal, going to explain the situation openly, and propose to continue the categories for the competitions it was introduced for this year with the 0.95, but go with 0.9 multiplier for three board handicapped comps and 3 other trophies, with a committment to review the situation again in a years time. The bulk of other competitions to remain without categories with 0.95. So quite a mix, but hard to keep everyone happy.

Have they run the 0.9 playing handicap allowance past their governing body?

 

[IanM]

The gentlemen of the Chipping Forecast promising a deep dive on WHS upcoming, including input from England Golf. Watch that space.

I was suprised about how little they knew. They should come on here!

 

[Voyager EMH]

I was suprised about how little they knew. They should come on here!

They might be already here.

 

[PJ87]

I'm slowly starting to go off whs due to how poorly they rated my own course and others around

If I hit a 97 round my place I get a score diff of 25.7 which to get 97 for me there Is good shooting.. (best is 89 years ago, average about 95?) anyways my old club a 97 gets you 23. It's such an easier course it's unreal

Starting to think the ratings team haven't got a clue how to rate a course or the formula is broken

The idea was to stop handicaps being oh I'm a 7 on my track but it's easier I'm more like an 11.. to making them relatable

I went back to my old course after a night shift hit 98 got a 24 differential and just laughed.

Does make your handicap travel ridiculous well

Makes our single digits look even better . Mates off 7 he must be really a 4 handicap.

 

[AussieKB]

The formula is based on a US course, a lot of course in OZ the ratings are just plain wrong,
some are rated hard and I get extra shot or two which are not.

But the big difference is when you go out into the country in WA and play on sand greens,
you always lose shots, I have had to play off scratch at one of them, and I am not scratch.

The formula should have been altered for every Countries conditions, another fault with WHS, IMO.

 

[Dunesman]

Have they run the 0.9 playing handicap allowance past their governing body?

I dont know specifically, but they are open about it being not standard, and so why doing it only for the handful of competitions that have becone contentious, keeping the majority unchanged. So as a trial like we had categories this year for the first time, and a compromise or mix of solutions to try to keep different groups all reasonably happy. They are keeping the categories for some other competitions.
All to be approved by the members, but given the small minority that usually attend our AGM, normally anything proposed is approved, as those attending are more or less the same hard core group and their friends running things anyway. I dont think they are too worried about a very modest club being drummed out or losing its course rating or whatever for 6 competitions if thats what you mean.

 

[RichA]

I'm slowly starting to go off whs due to how poorly they rated my own course and others around

If I hit a 97 round my place I get a score diff of 25.7 which to get 97 for me there Is good shooting.. (best is 89 years ago, average about 95?) anyways my old club a 97 gets you 23. It's such an easier course it's unreal

Starting to think the ratings team haven't got a clue how to rate a course or the formula is broken

The idea was to stop handicaps being oh I'm a 7 on my track but it's easier I'm more like an 11.. to making them relatable

I went back to my old course after a night shift hit 98 got a 24 differential and just laughed.

Does make your handicap travel ridiculous well

Makes our single digits look even better . Mates off 7 he must be really a 4 handicap.

Is it true across the board or is it just you?
Most of my lot and I have migrated to a different course over the last year. It's rated harder than our old course due to more water and greenside bunkers, yet most of the guys who were 5 shots worse than me are now 5 shots better than me. I was expecting the same but something about the set-up just doesn't suit my game.

 

[PJ87]

Is it true across the board or is it just you?
Most of my lot and I have migrated to a different course over the last year. It's rated harder than our old course due to more water and greenside bunkers, yet most of the guys who were 5 shots worse than me are now 5 shots better than me. I was expecting the same but something about the set-up just doesn't suit my game.

Prob just us , they came back to rerate apparently and gave some guff about not enough bunkers , I mean the greens have more slopes than san francisco, always windy , gorse bushes not far into the rough.

But that's the thing the CR itself has us rated pretty tough 71.8 for a par 72 off the whites (74.3 off the blacks) but the slope being so ridiculously low makes it impossible

Of my best 8 scores 3 are from away clubs and I only played 4 away in the last 20! My best on there is a 91 which got me a 19 score diff, if I hit 91 at mine I'd be delighted (think that's my best off whites , 89 was yellows) would get me a 19.5, at the other course I mentioned it would get you 17.9!!! I'm sorry raters .. top meadow is not harder than woolston manor golf club , and neither as as tough as ours

 

[IanM]

I go away for a few days and Banchory has "gone. "

What did I miss?

 

[wjemather]

Prob just us , they came back to rerate apparently and gave some guff about not enough bunkers , I mean the greens have more slopes than san francisco, always windy , gorse bushes not far into the rough.

But that's the thing the CR itself has us rated pretty tough 71.8 for a par 72 off the whites (74.3 off the blacks) but the slope being so ridiculously low makes it impossible

Of my best 8 scores 3 are from away clubs and I only played 4 away in the last 20! My best on there is a 91 which got me a 19 score diff, if I hit 91 at mine I'd be delighted (think that's my best off whites , 89 was yellows) would get me a 19.5, at the other course I mentioned it would get you 17.9!!! I'm sorry raters .. top meadow is not harder than woolston manor golf club , and neither as as tough as ours

Your Course Rating suggests it's quite long. Your Slope Rating hints at relatively short general rough (<2") making for easier recovery.
I'd also guess it's fairly flat with reasonably wide fairways, decent sized greens that are open in front, and few trees or crossing obstacles that come into play.

 

[PJ87]

Your Slope Rating hints at relatively short general rough (<2") making for easier recovery.
I'd also guess it's fairly flat with reasonably wide fairways, decent sized greens that are open in front, and few trees or crossing obstacles that come into play.

Our rough is very long in the main, the first cut is first cut. Guess we need to re rate before cutting it again

Greens are big but like I said very slopey so if you hit it doesn't mean it's staying there

No trees but in front of greens pot bunkers on a few holes

 

[wjemather]

Our rough is very long in the main, the first cut is first cut. Guess we need to re rate before cutting it again

Greens are big but like I said very slopey so if you hit it doesn't mean it's staying there

No trees but in front of greens pot bunkers on a few holes

Your club will have completed a form stating the height of the general rough cut. This will have been verified by the raters on the day. Any extreme rough is rated as an obstacle.
Slopy greens affect scratch and bogey golfers almost equally so their difficulty value is seen in the CR more than the Slope.

 

[PJ87]

Your club will have completed a form stating the height of the general rough cut. This will have been verified by the raters on the day. Any extreme rough is rated as an obstacle.
Slopy greens affect scratch and bogey golfers almost equally so their difficulty value is seen in the CR more than the Slope.

That is the problem we do suffer from , our course effects bogey and scratch golfers equally so our slope is lower

I personally think the score differential formula is flawed because of this

 

[Voyager EMH]

I go away for a few days and Banchory has "gone. "

What did I miss?

Not a lot.

 

[Bdill93]

That is the problem we do suffer from , our course effects bogey and scratch golfers equally so our slope is lower

I personally think the score differential formula is flawed because of this

There's something in this - my home course despite being re-rated already just doesn't compute well with WHS.

Its very easy in the summer (bog in winter), we have low par (69) and low CR (I think this is 67.1 or something)

A gross 77 (8 over par) is a 9.2 diff - as a side note I'd say CR-PAR has really balanced comp scoring across the board

However - its such an easy track that getting low at our course is - well - pretty easy! There's 4/5 driveable par 4's for the big hitters in the right conditions, 3 if conditions are fair, every par 3 is shorter than 160 and both our par 5's are 450 yards max.

There's about 3 holes where if you drive it 220/240 you're hitting a long club into the green, everything else is a mid iron and I'm not a long player.

I go elsewhere and approaches are 20-40 yards longer but the courses are rated similarly in slope and my shots aren't increased, just all seems a bit weird to me.

 

[PJ87]

There's something in this - my home course despite being re-rated already just doesn't compute well with WHS.

Its very easy in the summer (bog in winter), we have low par (69) and low CR (I think this is 67.1 or something)

A gross 77 (8 over par) is a 9.2 diff - as a side note I'd say CR-PAR has really balanced comp scoring across the board

However - its such an easy track that getting low at our course is - well - pretty easy! There's 4/5 driveable par 4's for the big hitters in the right conditions, 3 if conditions are fair, every par 3 is shorter than 160 and both our par 5's are 450 yards max.

There's about 3 holes where if you drive it 220/240 you're hitting a long club into the green, everything else is a mid iron and I'm not a long player.

I go elsewhere and approaches are 20-40 yards longer but the courses are rated similarly in slope and my shots aren't increased, just all seems a bit weird to me.

when I travel to other courses in the main I score very well.. this is a combination of their greens seeming much easier (only one break for example inside of 2-3 per putt) more open, shorter .. majority of my good scores (ie my lowest ones) come at other clubs where if I scored that same score at mine id be in the average marks

get a lot more points away from home

 

[Bdill93]

when I travel to other courses in the main I score very well.. this is a combination of their greens seeming much easier (only one break for example inside of 2-3 per putt) more open, shorter .. majority of my good scores (ie my lowest ones) come at other clubs where if I scored that same score at mine id be in the average marks

get a lot more points away from home

If you ever fancy a single digit differential then pop up to Worcester

 

[PJ87]

If you ever fancy a single digit differential then pop up to Worcester

I'm in!

Does it do ham egg and chips

 

[Bdill93]

I'm in!

Does it do ham egg and chips

Actually no, we used to but they've recently had a menu switch up!

 

[PJ87]

Actually no, we used to but they've recently had a menu switch up!

thats it. im out! i only travel for the food lol