more from the swing thoughts vault. swing thoughts #1578 & #1579

[garyinderry]

Double whammy swing thoughts.

Been struggling of late getting really really stuck when trying to hit draws. I was getting to the top of the swing and dropping the hands straight down and trying to swing out which left me super stuck. Fighting with the hands the try and rescue the face at the bottom. Real inconsistent stuff. Mostly big blocks with the big dog.


First thing I wanted to do was shallow the shaft. Realised if I got to the top of my swing and stopped. If I took my right hand off, the club wanted to fall in/ shallow. So the first thought hit me.

#1578 - stop gripping the right hand with so much pressure. I was throttling the club.
I did drills where I would take it to the top and stop. Let go with the right hand and let the club fall a bit.
Progressed to taking it to the top and concentrated on a real light grip pressure with them right hand.


Still with me? good. Then it progressed to trying a different hand path.

#1579 - hands move out, club head shallows.

As I get to the transition part of the swing I feel like the hands move out as the club falls back.

This feels mighty different to just dropping them straight down. The act of moving them out towards the ball assists in swallowing the club.



I will post some hand path videos here to show what I am on about. I had seen these before but it never really clicked in my head.


Ive had two range sessions since working this working this out and delighted to say I am back hitting the ball both ways at will. Last week with a gun to my head I would not have been confident turning the ball right to left.


I know some enjoy these ramblings so I hope it can turn on a light or two as it has done for me.


Anyway here some hand path videos for you to mull over.


Finally when I was working on the grip pressure the other night, I watched Greg Norman's chronicles of a champion golfer. On the Sunday when he was trying to win his first open, he said Jack Nicklaus told him one thing, ''think about your grip pressure'. so true jack. What a gent.

 

[garyinderry]

[video=youtube;ks3Dm8NyE8E]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ks3Dm8NyE8E[/video]


Really clear simple video showing the hand path moving out and the club swallowing.

 

[garyinderry]

[video=youtube;W3Nm1HpcCPU]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W3Nm1HpcCPU[/video]

Hands out, club shallow

 

[garyinderry]

[video=youtube;_xKtA4qdVY8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_xKtA4qdVY8&t=231s[/video]


Good one here. those who steeper the shaft may also be pulling the hands straight down.

So this is helpful for both the steep swipe across the ball types and the stuck know they should be hitting from inside but failing to do it right types.

 

[garyinderry]

[video=youtube;CYqoDN9n0G0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CYqoDN9n0G0&t=12s[/video]

Great demonstration here.

 

[Deleted member 21258]

This is something I have been working on the last few weeks, but for slightly different reasons.

My hands come to far away from the body on the way down swallowing the shaft, which then leads to high hands and the club cutting right across the ball at impact, in an attempt to get the clubface back to the ball.

Had to setup some foam pipe lagging(nearish) to hands at setup(well a foot to the right of impact) and initially was whacking it big time with my hands, now not so bad, still got a lot more practise to get rid of the big hands away from the body, but its coming. Getting masses of fats, as I have to relearn not to fully uncock the wrist to hit the ball.

I can already see a straight flight, but a massive work in progress and almost the opposite of your problem.

I have watched a lot of those athletic motion guys, very interesting vids they tend to upload.

 

[garyinderry]

This is something I have been working on the last few weeks, but for slightly different reasons.

My hands come to far away from the body on the way down swallowing the shaft, which then leads to high hands and the club cutting right across the ball at impact, in an attempt to get the clubface back to the ball.

Had to setup some foam pipe lagging(nearish) to hands at setup(well a foot to the right of impact) and initially was whacking it big time with my hands, now not so bad, still got a lot more practise to get rid of the big hands away from the body, but its coming. Getting masses of fats, as I have to relearn not to fully uncock the wrist to hit the ball.

I can already see a straight flight, but a massive work in progress and almost the opposite of your problem.

I have watched a lot of those athletic motion guys, very interesting vids they tend to upload.

Have you got any clips of your swing? sounds like an interesting action.


First day on the course with my new swing thoughts. Happy with some of the iron striking. Suffered with the driver a touch. Got stuck a few times. did drive a short par 4 so that was pleasing.

Should be a touch warmer tomorrow so I won't have ice cold hands. :rofl:

 

[Moquillo19]

I had a lesson as I thought I was losing distance in my old age (46)
Turns out over the years of no lessons that I'd stopped actually trying to HIT the ball as I'd been cosying my way round the course. Clubhead speed was way too low, standing too close and ball too far forward in the stance.............
In light of these new swing thoughts I've decided to narrow the three into one.
I'm just gonna hit the thing as hard as I can (with style, obviously) and hope the little bit of talent I've got can cope with it. I'm never lowering my handicap playing the way I've been playing so it's time to take it to the course!
Been going well so far.....We'll see what happens when the first qualifier of the year card is being marked. ne:

 

[USER1999]

I am amazed some of you guys can even hit a ball at all. I am too technical, but sheesh, wow, bamboozled.

 

[Deleted member 21258]

Have you got any clips of your swing? sounds like an interesting action.

It a pretty ugly action and has got worse over the last few months when I started speed training again to see if I could get my real swing speed closer to my practise swing speed. It turned into big pulls or slice with about a 6-7 out to in path and normal a very open clubface.

Havent got any of really recent, but this is 15-18 months ago iirc, which still shows the hands come fair to in front of the body, shaft not to steep in downswing and a 'smaller' cut across the body as I have to get the clubhead back to the ball, not pretty but used to be workman like on the course(I have only ever wished to have a repeatable swing tbh):-

[video=youtube;jYHZ9Q-UJR4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jYHZ9Q-UJR4[/video]

Looks like I have just got out of bed:rofl:

 

[Junior]

This is something I have been working on the last few weeks, but for slightly different reasons.

My hands come to far away from the body on the way down swallowing the shaft, which then leads to high hands and the club cutting right across the ball at impact, in an attempt to get the clubface back to the ball.

Had to setup some foam pipe lagging(nearish) to hands at setup(well a foot to the right of impact) and initially was whacking it big time with my hands, now not so bad, still got a lot more practise to get rid of the big hands away from the body, but its coming. Getting masses of fats, as I have to relearn not to fully uncock the wrist to hit the ball.

I can already see a straight flight, but a massive work in progress and almost the opposite of your problem.

I have watched a lot of those athletic motion guys, very interesting vids they tend to upload.

Interesting action Darren , are you on the right forum ?????? :rofl::rofl:

 

[Deleted member 21258]

Whoops :rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:

 

[garyinderry]

It a pretty ugly action and has got worse over the last few months when I started speed training again to see if I could get my real swing speed closer to my practise swing speed. It turned into big pulls or slice with about a 6-7 out to in path and normal a very open clubface.

Havent got any of really recent, but this is 15-18 months ago iirc, which still shows the hands come fair to in front of the body, shaft not to steep in downswing and a 'smaller' cut across the body as I have to get the clubhead back to the ball, not pretty but used to be workman like on the course(I have only ever wished to have a repeatable swing tbh):-



Looks like I have just got out of bed:rofl:

Clear that you will struggle with pulls and slices depending on the face coming in.

This video here will help with a different beginning to the back swing. You get into your position at the top because of zero arm rotation. It is like you try to keep the club face looking at the ball through the entire swing. Not dissimilar to Homers swing before he went for that lesson with Golf Monthly.

This may help. Give it a whirl and see what happens.

[video=youtube;iFGNuTQIURM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iFGNuTQIURM&t=196s[/video]

 

[garyinderry]

So here is idea 2 to attack the same issue. Rotate the left arm going back the right arm will fold. The body just works like that.

[video=youtube;Px50pNlcqPo]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Px50pNlcqPo[/video]

 

[bobmac]

So here is idea 2 to attack the same issue. Rotate the left arm going back the right arm will fold. The body just works like that.

[video=youtube;Px50pNlcqPo]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Px50pNlcqPo[/video]

I really really don't agree with 99% of that video

eg

3:38 to 3:47 he basically flattens the left wrist

 

[Deleted member 21258]

Clear that you will struggle with pulls and slices depending on the face coming in.

This video here will help with a different beginning to the back swing. You get into your position at the top because of zero arm rotation. It is like you try to keep the club face looking at the ball through the entire swing. Not dissimilar to Homers swing before he went for that lesson with Golf Monthly.

This may help. Give it a whirl and see what happens.

I agree and it is something I do on purpose, always found when I rotate on the way back, my clubface control goes mental with no consistently, just don't know what is coming could be a very closed or open clubface. But I am always up for playing around with the swing, and may give it another go and see what happens. Having toe down of more than 4-5 degrees on average with irons really isn't helping due to hand path.

I can get the flying right elbow, whichever way I rotate the arm.

The Homer reference, Chrisd said that to me in Kent last week, you two ganging up on me:rofl:, I always thought I had a compact free flowing swing until I say it on video, shocking

 

[garyinderry]

I really really don't agree with 99% of that video

eg

3:38 to 3:47 he basically flattens the left wrist

What don't you really like? is it the arm rotation?

You can be a through as you like. There isn't enough of this type of discussion on here anymore. Its all learning to me so I enjoy reading about it.

 

[bobmac]

The golf swing happens too fast for someone to think about too many things at once.
Where your hands are/flatten the swing/rotate the upper arm/pivot round the left shoulder/transfer the weight/turn inside the left foot and balanced finish.

Good luck with all that.

Impossible to do that on the range, even impossibler on the course.

To change/improve your swing the change must be

1. easy to remember
2. easy to do on the course
3. make sense
4. produce improvements quickly
5. improve the fault.
6. produce better scores.

Sounds obvious but is often forgotten in the technical talk these days with launch monitor numbers and umpteen youtube videos promising the holy grail.

To get back to basics it's all about

1.how you hit it (the contact)
2.where you hit it (the direction)

1. If your duffing and topping, you're probably swaying. Keep your head still
2. If your direction is off it's either your swing path, clubface direction (grip) or often both.

Some people use a very technical approach to teaching which is fine if you are that way inclined.
I prefer to use feel more.

For example....
Techy Pro tells you how to stop an out to in downswing by listing where 10 things should be during the backswing and downswing.
If you get it all right, it works.

Feely pro will put down 2 headcovers and say swing in such a way that you miss the headcovers. If you get it right, you will get all 10 things in the right place without even knowing what they are.

So my approach is to give a golfer one FEELING on the course that he or she knows works and makes sense.
That way there is less chance the golfer will revert back to the old swing.

What was the question again?

Oh yes...don't rotate your upper arm or you'll swing it round your rump.

 

[garyinderry]

Fair enough. what would you do with Darren? he gets into a funky position at the top and its likely he will end up hitting the head covers out into the grass over and over.

 

[bobmac]

Fair enough. what would you do with Darren? he gets into a funky position at the top and its likely he will end up hitting the head covers out into the grass over and over.

It's definitely funky but he gets it back on the downswing and is is actually pretty good through impact.
I don't think he'd hit the headcovers at all