Pin-seeker
Well-known member
:rofl::rofl: that's brilliant. Unlucky Scooter old boi
Mark King interview
- Thread starter fundy
- Start date
PhilTheFragger
Provider of Entertainment for the Golfing Gods 🙄
Remember the Muppet Babies
Spitting image if you ask me
BTatHome
Tour Winner
Only just saw this thread, and no idea if TM consider white to be a fashion statement but from rumours I read weeks ago (and pics to back it up) there is a white headed SLDR on the cards in the next couple of weeks.
D
Deleted member 15344
Guest
Heard the rumour as well but taken with a pinch of salt
Also got told that very very few people are buying the 430 SLDR and no one on tour is using one
bozza
Journeyman Pro
I also found it interesting when he said he wouldn't want Tiger Woods as one of their players or using their drivers as he doesn't hit fairways!
HawkeyeMS
Ryder Cup Winner
So they can build clubs that are straighter and longer for your average club golfer but not for the world number 1?
Hmmm
malek988
Challenge Tour Pro
did anyone see the undercover boss usa, were mark king went under cover?
Imurg
The Grinder Of Pars (Semi Crocked)
I wonder if anything else they've done to their clubs has been done in the name of Fashion rather than Technology.........
D
Deleted member 15344
Guest
If the club does the business it could be made in the name of flowers as far as im concerned
Always amazes me the reaction TM gets in regards marketing etc
Always amazes me the reaction TM gets in regards marketing etc
Imurg
The Grinder Of Pars (Semi Crocked)
Why does it amaze?
King has come out and said that the white head was purely a fashion statement and not, as the marketing bull said at the time, to aid alignment.....what else is fashion? The slots? How can you trust anything TM say anymore?
D
Deleted member 1740
Guest
When TM released the R1 wasn't all that design on top supposed to be better for alignment etc?
This interview confirms TM spout more rubbish about their new gear than Liverpoolphil does :ears:
This interview confirms TM spout more rubbish about their new gear than Liverpoolphil does :ears:
D
Deleted member 15344
Guest
It amazes me that people react to marketing ploys when i give people a bit more credit to think for themselves.
Have you ever bought a club purely on what the marketing says ?
Does it matter - surely you can think and judge for yourself and judge a club on its performance alone as opposed to some marketing guff which is more aimed towards the social society golfer.
I bought TM clubs - not because of any marketing but because of how they performed when i used them.
I dont care what they "lie" about in terms of marketing claims - i can think for myself and judge the club on its won merits.
chrisd
Major Champion
It could be worse, you could have opened the mag on the Benross page and saw the fact that they clearly picked the ugliest buggers off the forum!!
Imurg
The Grinder Of Pars (Semi Crocked)
What you or I can or can't do is irrelevent.
The marketing is there to sell the product, to sway people to their club instead of another brand - otherwise why bother with it?
If TM(or anyone else for that matter) are so sure their clubs are better than the opposition then why spend 5 times more on Marketing than R&D? Why not let people decide when they go and try the clubs? Because most people don't try before they buy!
Marketing is important - the fact that you pay little attention to it doesn't mean Average Mr Joe Public won't look at the advert and think "Oooh yeah - I'll have one of those, it's White and helps my alignment", pop straight off to AG with 300 notes in his hand and buy it without even trying it.
The people on this Forum are, by and large, well educated on fitting, trying and picking the best for their games - even though most of us change clubs at the drop of a hat.
We account for the minutest of percentages of the retail market - there are idiots out there who believe everything they read.
The marketing is there to sell the product, to sway people to their club instead of another brand - otherwise why bother with it?
If TM(or anyone else for that matter) are so sure their clubs are better than the opposition then why spend 5 times more on Marketing than R&D? Why not let people decide when they go and try the clubs? Because most people don't try before they buy!
Marketing is important - the fact that you pay little attention to it doesn't mean Average Mr Joe Public won't look at the advert and think "Oooh yeah - I'll have one of those, it's White and helps my alignment", pop straight off to AG with 300 notes in his hand and buy it without even trying it.
The people on this Forum are, by and large, well educated on fitting, trying and picking the best for their games - even though most of us change clubs at the drop of a hat.
We account for the minutest of percentages of the retail market - there are idiots out there who believe everything they read.
3565
Journeyman Pro
A question on Tom Wishon forum about 17* 1700 spin rate OEM claims, and Tom himself answers the question.
Re: Low spin driver heads
by TWW » Wed Feb 19, 2014 6:30 pm
golfclubbldr wrote:
Tom
I have been reading some about low spin heads with CG closer to the face. I have heard that the new recommended launch characteristics by an OEM company is 17* launch and 1700 spin. That would have to require a fairly substantial upward angle of attack with a normal driver.
What does this all mean to the average golfer that I fit, with zero to negative Angle of attack and out to in clubhead path? And how would you characterize the 919 THI head as far as low spin or high spin.
JOHN
This recent commentary from Taylor Made about the 17* launch and 1700 rpms spin is chiefly done to try to help market their Loft Up campaign to go with selling more of their currently offered SLDR driver model.
Purely from a theoretical standpoint, it can be said that 17* launch with 1700 spin is an ideal combination for distance. But the key word is "theoretical". From a PRACTICAL standpoint, as you said in your post, such launch numbers would require a very upward angle of attack which is simply impossible for 99+% of all golfers to even come close to. Even in TrackMan's research, for 100mph to 120mph clubhead speeds with +5* upward A of A, around 1700 rpms is optimum for spin, but the optimum launch runs from 12.4* at 100mph down to 10.3* at 120mph. So to get all the way up to 17* launch and still maintain 1700 spin would require something closer to a +10* upward A of A. And that is quite impractical - so impractical that this is why you can look at this Taylor Made 17/1700 campaign and label it as marketing, purely marketing in trying to fool golfers into spending their money for this latest SLDR driver.
Give them 6-9 months and the SLDR will be history and something else will have taken its place in the marketing hype.
As to the 919, we consider it a medium spin driver, definitely not high. I'm going to do an article in the next ETECHreport about how way too many golfers have become OCD with spin numbers, WAY TOO MUCH.
Sadly way too many people hit shots on a launch monitor, see their spin is over 3000, ignore the launch angle and smash factor, and then obsess how to get their spin under 3000 to be like the tour players have. This is SO WRONG. First of all, only the Doppler Radar launch monitors can even read spin with decent accuracy. Second, 98% of the time the golfers are hitting RANGE BALLS when they get their spin number from an inaccurate launch monitor.
Launch angle is KING when it comes to optimizing a driver for any golfer. And launch angle is most influenced by the loft. So if you focus on finding the right loft that brings about the best launch angle for a golfer's clubhead speed and angle of attack, you simply do not worry about spin because if a golfer has a spin problem it will be caused far, far more by swing errors than by anything related to the equipment.
Tom Wishon
Re: Low spin driver heads
by TWW » Wed Feb 19, 2014 6:30 pm
golfclubbldr wrote:
Tom
I have been reading some about low spin heads with CG closer to the face. I have heard that the new recommended launch characteristics by an OEM company is 17* launch and 1700 spin. That would have to require a fairly substantial upward angle of attack with a normal driver.
What does this all mean to the average golfer that I fit, with zero to negative Angle of attack and out to in clubhead path? And how would you characterize the 919 THI head as far as low spin or high spin.
JOHN
This recent commentary from Taylor Made about the 17* launch and 1700 rpms spin is chiefly done to try to help market their Loft Up campaign to go with selling more of their currently offered SLDR driver model.
Purely from a theoretical standpoint, it can be said that 17* launch with 1700 spin is an ideal combination for distance. But the key word is "theoretical". From a PRACTICAL standpoint, as you said in your post, such launch numbers would require a very upward angle of attack which is simply impossible for 99+% of all golfers to even come close to. Even in TrackMan's research, for 100mph to 120mph clubhead speeds with +5* upward A of A, around 1700 rpms is optimum for spin, but the optimum launch runs from 12.4* at 100mph down to 10.3* at 120mph. So to get all the way up to 17* launch and still maintain 1700 spin would require something closer to a +10* upward A of A. And that is quite impractical - so impractical that this is why you can look at this Taylor Made 17/1700 campaign and label it as marketing, purely marketing in trying to fool golfers into spending their money for this latest SLDR driver.
Give them 6-9 months and the SLDR will be history and something else will have taken its place in the marketing hype.
As to the 919, we consider it a medium spin driver, definitely not high. I'm going to do an article in the next ETECHreport about how way too many golfers have become OCD with spin numbers, WAY TOO MUCH.
Sadly way too many people hit shots on a launch monitor, see their spin is over 3000, ignore the launch angle and smash factor, and then obsess how to get their spin under 3000 to be like the tour players have. This is SO WRONG. First of all, only the Doppler Radar launch monitors can even read spin with decent accuracy. Second, 98% of the time the golfers are hitting RANGE BALLS when they get their spin number from an inaccurate launch monitor.
Launch angle is KING when it comes to optimizing a driver for any golfer. And launch angle is most influenced by the loft. So if you focus on finding the right loft that brings about the best launch angle for a golfer's clubhead speed and angle of attack, you simply do not worry about spin because if a golfer has a spin problem it will be caused far, far more by swing errors than by anything related to the equipment.
Tom Wishon
D
Deleted member 15344
Guest
And those are the idiots that they will target to ensure they sell as much stuff as possible to get as much profit as possible - standard business practice i would have thought.
If people are buying their stuff then they are doing it right - they are a very popular brand with both amateurs and pros alike - they are no different to your callaways or your nikes of the world
So White was fashion - i liked it.
Its funny very funny - anytime TM is mentioned or their clubs are mentioned etc - the reaction is funny
Do TM make good stuff - in my opinion yes they do. Does it matter if Mr Joe Public buys it because he saw the advert ? No - thats the whole idea of the advert - same with the adverts of all the other Golf Club manufacturers.
Lots of high horses around when TM release either a marketing ploy or another club - you would think they would be the only brand to do it - they arent.
Imurg
The Grinder Of Pars (Semi Crocked)
But, to my knowledge, the likes of Nike, Callaway, et al haven't come out and said that what they told us about their new club was effectively lies....
What about the slots on the woods and irons...?
Do they do what TM say they do or are they just Fashion?
If they're just fashion then TM are lying about their products and I, for one, ain't gonna trust 'em no more!
What about the slots on the woods and irons...?
Do they do what TM say they do or are they just Fashion?
If they're just fashion then TM are lying about their products and I, for one, ain't gonna trust 'em no more!
D
Deleted member 15344
Guest
You dont use TM clubs anyway
Nike etc havent been asked have they
Who knows about the slots on the irons etc - they havent said that they were just fashion but im not sure anyone (well most )would really care as long as they like the club and it works for them.
When did anyone ever trust marketing campaigns anyway.
davidy233
Tour Rookie
Don't give a damn about their marketing - my new irons will be speedblades because I tried half a dozen different options and they were miles ahead of anything else for me - further more accurate - tried their drivers Jetspeed didn't suit me but sdlr is still in the mix along with big Bertha
Or maybe I should have gone for titelist because that would make me a good golfer
Or maybe I should have gone for titelist because that would make me a good golfer
Imurg
The Grinder Of Pars (Semi Crocked)
So why spend more than 200 million a year on them...?
They must work or the Shareholders would have something to say......
