Is it worth it?

evahakool said:
Interesting thread, whilst most golfers would be grateful of help with rulesI'm sure that there will be some that think you are being to strict with the rules and come across as a " clever dick" which can put some people off from pulling players up on rules infringements.

Take yesterday as an example,I played in a comp. and one of my f/c tapped in a put whilst holding the flag on the green, as we were having a enjoyable round I didn't want to pull him up on this as he might have felt I was being a "clever dick". whilst walking to the next tee I told him of the ruling for future reference .

Now I know some will say I should have told him it was a penalty straight away, and that's the quandary that I'm sure other players have had also of not coming across as some kind of "clever dick"

Perhaps more needs to be done by clubs to insure players have a good grasp of the rules before entering competitions.

Having looked at the results last night I see that my f/c finished 4th in the h/c div. thus denying another player of a prize because I didn't call the penalty (we were playing in a 3ball and the other f/c was marking his card)
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One thing worse than being seen as a clever dick regarding the rules is being seen as a clever dick who gets it wrong.

Are you saying that the player you explained the "ruling" to was actually supporting himself on the flagstick? "Resting" it on the green i.e. simply allowing it to supports its own weight and none of yours is not a breach.

A little more information needed, I think, so we can decide which version of clever dick you were. :)
 
Colin L said:
One thing worse than being seen as a clever dick regarding the rules is being seen as a clever dick who gets it wrong.

Are you saying that the player you explained the "ruling" to was actually supporting himself on the flagstick? "Resting" it on the green i.e. simply allowing it to supports its own weight and none of yours is not a breach.


A little more information needed, I think, so we can decide which version of clever dick you were. :)
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Ok now I'm confused, the player in question held the flag with the bottom of it resting on the green which I thought was a penalty, how could I decide whether he was just resting it or using it as a support while putting?

If he was using it as a support and I said "that's a penalty " he could just turn round and say "no I was just resting it" so that's not very clear cut and could lead to some arguments.

So cleaver dick or not i will leave that for you to decide ;)
 
Some of these rules do make me wonder why they make things so confusing, just say for example I never saw him tapping in but turned round and he was bent down picking his ball out of the cup still holding the pin on the green.

So I would never know if he was resting or supporting, why can't it be clear cut and get a penalty for touching the flag on the green whilst putting?
 
evahakool said:
Some of these rules do make me wonder why they make things so confusing, just say for example I never saw him tapping in but turned round and he was bent down picking his ball out of the cup still holding the pin on the green.

So I would never know if he was resting or supporting, why can't it be clear cut and get a penalty for touching the flag on the green whilst putting?
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It takes time to take the flagstick away and place it n the ground, make the put and then fetch the flagstick and replace it.
 
Noticed yesterday in our friendly roll-up group that on the 2nd hole my PP teed up in front of the markers. Only just - but definitely ahead. He hit a shocker of a tee shot so didn't pull him but mentioned it to him before he teed off next tee - saying at the same time that I always teed up well behind the blocks - just to make sure. He continued to tee up close to the line - indeed teed up in front one further time though that time he noticed and re'teed. but why do some players insist upon teeing up so closer to the line inviting a breach.

Also saw a wonderful one shot penalty where FC under trees shot ball clattered the branches above and rocketing downwards hit his trolley bang on the start button and off it went - tipping over on the way as it was on a slope :)

We didn't have to pull him up on the penalty - he knew. But it was very funny moment.
 
SwingsitlikeHogan said:
Noticed yesterday in our friendly roll-up group that on the 2nd hole my PP teed up in front of the markers. Only just - but definitely ahead. He hit a shocker of a tee shot so didn't pull him but mentioned it to him before he teed off next tee - saying at the same time that I always teed up well behind the blocks - just to make sure. He continued to tee up close to the line - indeed teed up in front one further time though that time he noticed and re'teed. but why do some players insist upon teeing up so closer to the line inviting a breach.

Also saw a wonderful one shot penalty where FC under trees shot ball clattered the branches above and rocketing downwards hit his trolley bang on the start button and off it went - tipping over on the way as it was on a slope :)

We didn't have to pull him up on the penalty - he knew. But it was very funny moment.
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Apparently that inch is very very important. Makes the difference between par and birdie ;)
 
evahakool said:
Some of these rules do make me wonder why they make things so confusing, just say for example I never saw him tapping in but turned round and he was bent down picking his ball out of the cup still holding the pin on the green.

So I would never know if he was resting or supporting, why can't it be clear cut and get a penalty for touching the flag on the green whilst putting?
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the rules are clear cut - you are making them complicated, and from your previous post potentially confusing others and creating myths!

there is no rule that says you can't put holding the flagstick

equally there is no rule that says that you can't hold another club, hold your glove, putter cover etc when putting

there are rules about the unusual use of equipment (14-3), and they would cover the use of any of the above in an unusual manner when putting. In the same way as using another club to steady yourself when putting, you would be in breach of 14-3 if you used the flagstick - this seems very straight forward and logical to me! Given that most people in most conditions are able to stand up without the support of an extra club or stick it is blindly obvious if someone is using the flagstick or their equipment, to achieve this in practice.
 
As many know ive been getting frustrated by people in my club regarding rules etc

The knocking a leaf one been the most recent , i was pretty sure of the answer and had it confirmed on here to be sure (many thanks) and tried to inform members accordingly , to no avail .

We had a big inter club final on Sat (which we lost) and there was a ruling required from the GUI rules official on this very subject , he explained the ruling and stated no penalty to be applied .. (in our favour as it turned out , not that it mattered in the end)

Nope they still wont accept it ... it was brought up in the club house afterwards and i was asked my opinion , i just said lads forget it , i told ya the rule , i showed ya the rule and the GUI guy told the managers and players the rule and ye still dont agree ..

the reply was well its a stupid (expletive of choice) rule , i just said i dont make them i just play by them

So whats the point .. so once again IMO ...No its not worth it ..
 
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duncan mackie said:
the rules are clear cut - you are making them complicated, and from your previous post potentially confusing others and creating myths!

there is no rule that says you can't put holding the flagstick

equally there is no rule that says that you can't hold another club, hold your glove, putter cover etc when putting

there are rules about the unusual use of equipment (14-3), and they would cover the use of any of the above in an unusual manner when putting. In the same way as using another club to steady yourself when putting, you would be in breach of 14-3 if you used the flagstick - this seems very straight forward and logical to me! Given that most people in most conditions are able to stand up without the support of an extra club or stick it is blindly obvious if someone is using the flagstick or their equipment, to achieve this in practice.
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and if you don't actually see the moment a PP taps in whilst holing the flag then you simply trust him that he did not break the rule. Whether he broke the rule or not only he knows.
 
evahakool said:
Some of these rules do make me wonder why they make things so confusing, just say for example I never saw him tapping in but turned round and he was bent down picking his ball out of the cup still holding the pin on the green.

So I would never know if he was resting or supporting, why can't it be clear cut and get a penalty for touching the flag on the green whilst putting?
Click to expand...

You just trust that he didn't breach the rule. Really simple. Same as you trust your FC/PP every time he addresses the ball. You trust he does not touch it and if he did he'd tell you. Golf collapses without trust and honesty.
 
SwingsitlikeHogan said:
You just trust that he didn't breach the rule. Really simple. Same as you trust your FC/PP every time he addresses the ball. You trust he does not move it and if he did he'd tell you. Golf collapses without trust and honesty.
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FTFY

Otherwise totally agree.

If you feel he may not know the rule and there may have been a breach, then you ask.
 
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Last week I had a "yes it is worth it" moment for a change. Friendly knockabout and found myself under a tree on the 18th. Was trying to work out if I had a full swing shot or just punch it out. Reckoned I had the full swing version so took a practice swing and didn't strike said tree. In returning my club from the top of the backswing in a rather cackhanded manner I knocked a leaf off the tree.

PP said "you'd be in trouble if you were out with"...insert names of many rules "experts" here. I explained the rule in regards of one leaf among thousands or not (the former in this case) but she was kind of insistent as in the past others had been with her. I told her that I would dispute any penalty applied in this circumstance and she was keen to know more - refreshing. I checked the "Decisions" book in the changing rooms and couldn't find a set decision BUT in the introduction to the section on improving lie, stance or intended swing etc it clearly stated what I'd been telling her. She was delighted and wrote down the page number for future reference.

On that note...something I was less sure about. My actual practice swing cleared the tree but after the swing I touched it. So even if it were the last leaf on a tree would it have been a penalty?
 
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