Is cheating in golf a common thing?

[LincolnShep]

I haven't witnessed any cheating yet - but I'm only in my first year of club membership. I can sympathise with your position, as a new member at a club it's important to make friends; calling people out for cheating is something that might cause a situation that we'd all rather avoid. You may well be naming and shaming a pair of perpetual offenders which would be relatively low risk; or they might be the most popular and respected people at the club and you find yourself having to defend what you saw to a load of people who are the offenders' best friends. It's very hard.

I'm glad I haven't been put in that situation yet but it will probably happen one day.

Shep

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

I haven't witnessed any cheating yet - but I'm only in my first year of club membership. I can sympathise with your position, as a new member at a club it's important to make friends; calling people out for cheating is something that might cause a situation that we'd all rather avoid. You may well be naming and shaming a pair of perpetual offenders which would be relatively low risk; or they might be the most popular and respected people at the club and you find yourself having to defend what you saw to a load of people who are the offenders' best friends. It's very hard.

I'm glad I haven't been put in that situation yet but it will probably happen one day.

Shep

If you think someone has done something wrong you call it at the time - even if just by asking 'out of curiosity'. If they haven't done anything wrong they will be able to correct your (mis)understanding of the rule and no harm done. If they can't convince you you just ask them what to do as you are unsure. They should then tell you what to do on the card and who the two of you should speak with to sort it out and get full clarification when you get in.

If you FC did wrong and was DQd as a result of you raising an issue I doubt you'll find many, if any, folk castigating you. You did the right thing. We all - each and every one of us - know it's what we should do when in doubt - it is a lot harder to do it in practice and we should all applaud the player who actually does it.

 

[Ian_Bristol]

Well I would be well annoyed if I played my best round of golf and was paired up with these two people and came in second to one of them, I have no doubt that I may have missed a shot off my score if I was having a bad hole but no way would I do it on purpose, to cheat in a friendly is one thing ( still no excuse ) but to do it when there is money involved they should be shot on the 18th green for all to see.

 

[keithc33]

Well I would be well annoyed if I played my best round of golf and was paired up with these two people and came in second to one of them, I have no doubt that I may have missed a shot off my score if I was having a bad hole but no way would I do it on purpose, to cheat in a friendly is one thing ( still no excuse ) but to do it when there is money involved they should be shot on the 18th green for all to see.

I like this solution Ian, ha

 

[daverollo]

The one thing that lifts golf above most other sports is its honesty, integrity and etiquette. The pair you played with displayed none of those qualities, quite the reverse. They demonstrated no respect for you, the game or the other competitors taking part that day.

You absolutely should report them, only from the fact that one of them has 'won' money to spend in the pro shop under complete and utter false pretenses. If they had shot well above handicaps, it wouldn't wind me up as much, but the fact one of them was claiming a victory in their category, shocking.

 

[UlyssesSky]

I didn't feel I had the right to question two long term members, golf clubs can be very click click and it wouldn't have been a great start to my membership.

Totally understand you and must admit I probably would have done the same.

Sadly, experience shows that when stuff like that get's reported, it's often the one who blew the whistle that is facing negative consequences, not the person who actually did something wrong.

It's not unlikely the reactions could be something like "how can you do this to such a long-standing, well respected member?" or something like that.
If the guy and his mate stick together and claim your accusations are false, you'll not only be a whistle-blower but also a liar (unless you can find someone else to confirm you're saying the truth)...

Not exactly the best start in a new club...

To make matters even worth, if you reported it now, you'd be (rightfully) accused of not making him change the scores before he signed and handed in his scorecard, since now he'll not only get a couple of penalty strokes but hast to be DQd...


I'd seek an (unofficial) conversation with one of the board members you know and try get a feel about how this would be received at the club.
Even if you then finally decide not to report it, you'll know you have back up next time you see something like this on the course and then can address the matter directly.

 

[chrisd]

Totally understand you and must admit I probably would have done the same.

Sadly, experience shows that when stuff like that get's reported, it's often the one who blew the whistle that is facing negative consequences, not the person who actually did something wrong.

It's not unlikely the reactions could be something like "how can you do this to such a long-standing, well respected member?" or something like that.
If the guy and his mate stick together and claim your accusations are false, you'll not only be a whistle-blower but also a liar (unless you can find someone else to confirm you're saying the truth)...

Not exactly the best start in a new club...

To make matters even worth, if you reported it now, you'd be (rightfully) accused of not making him change the scores before he signed and handed in his scorecard, since now he'll not only get a couple of penalty strokes but hast to be DQd...


I'd seek an (unofficial) conversation with one of the board members you know and try get a feel about how this would be received at the club.
Even if you then finally decide not to report it, you'll know you have back up next time you see something like this on the course and then can address the matter directly.

at this late stage I'd probably do this too!

But you MUST do something

 

[keithc33]

Totally understand you and must admit I probably would have done the same.

Sadly, experience shows that when stuff like that get's reported, it's often the one who blew the whistle that is facing negative consequences, not the person who actually did something wrong.

It's not unlikely the reactions could be something like "how can you do this to such a long-standing, well respected member?" or something like that.
If the guy and his mate stick together and claim your accusations are false, you'll not only be a whistle-blower but also a liar (unless you can find someone else to confirm you're saying the truth)...

Not exactly the best start in a new club...

To make matters even worth, if you reported it now, you'd be (rightfully) accused of not making him change the scores before he signed and handed in his scorecard, since now he'll not only get a couple of penalty strokes but hast to be DQd...


I'd seek an (unofficial) conversation with one of the board members you know and try get a feel about how this would be received at the club.
Even if you then finally decide not to report it, you'll know you have back up next time you see something like this on the course and then can address the matter directly.

Good advice, I think this will be the route I take. Its to late now to report them but at least I can be prepared if it happens again. Also, if I do mention their names then maybe they can catch them out some other way!!

 

[keithc33]

I have a meeting with a few of the board members next week as I am hoping to do some work for the club, this will be the perfect opportunity to say something.

I often put my name down wit people I dont know and thankfully this is the first time I have come across cheating.....hopefully the last too

 

[chrisd]

I have a meeting with a few of the board members next week as I am hoping to do some work for the club, this will be the perfect opportunity to say something.

I often put my name down wit people I dont know and thankfully this is the first time I have come across cheating.....hopefully the last too

I think cheating deliberatey is mercifully pretty rare and I applaud you for being prepared to say something to make your club aware

 

[UlyssesSky]

Also, if I do mention their names then maybe they can catch them out some other way!!

I wouldn't necessarily mention their names...

Two thoughts:

1. If you discuss this matter more like an 'imaginary example', you can get a feeling of how things like that are dealt with in the club, without having to actually report them. Because by telling someone who is in an official position about the incident including the names of the people involved, that's basically what you're doing. Plus doing it behind closed doors rather than publicly, where the accused could defend himself, might not be too well received.
Remember - you did wrong as well by not reporting it right away, so a little sensitivity might be advised.

2. By telling him the names you put him in the same kind of dilemma you find yourself in right now: he then would have knowledge of a breach of the rules, and, as a club official, might feel obliged to take action as well as wanting to spare you and the other member the trouble this would inevitably entail.
Keep his conscience clear by treating it like a hypothetical scenario...

 

[Jacko_G]

I see no or little point in reporting it after.

You call it there and then and if there is an issue you then refuse to sign the card at the end.

 

[gregers]

I see no or little point in reporting it after.

You call it there and then and if there is an issue you then refuse to sign the card at the end.

to a point,but surely the op can use this as an exercise.
by saying you wernt sure on the ruling at the time(as you are new)and decided to check up on the rules and have since found that your initial thoughts were correct and now you have some knowledge have decide to have a chat with someone high up in the pecking order.just to make sure you yourself dont get branded with the same brush.

 

[JCW]

His friend marked his card, they play together every week, as you can imagine I haven't played with them since!!

HI, you got to report it as its the right thing to do to ensure fair play for the others in the comp , you may find he is already known for it , ask around in a round about way .......................EYG

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Have only ever witnessed two blatent cheating

1. In a board comp I was paired with a 1 HC - he was arrogant beyond belief - first he laughed when he saw I had a plugged ball in a bunker then laughed when I didn't get out first time. So on out drivable 17th he went for it but could clearly see it was missing right and going to go down into the rubbish - anyway we search for ages - came to 5 mins and I said you need to go back and play another - he said ok and then found his original right out in the open at a place right near my bag and an area we had searched - I challenged him and said I had searched there and it wasn't there - the other guy in the group failed to back me up and he signed his card - I immediately went to a committee member and nothing could be done as the other guy wouldn't back me up - it was clear blatent cheating

2. In a Pro Am with our Pro both me and my playing partner knew that we had beaten the Pro by a shot - ( he had a mare with his short game ) - when the results happened he was announced as the winner !! His score was not what we thought it was - we were unsure what to do as they weren't "official" pro ams. The other PP spoke to the Pro the next day and he was adamant his scoring was correct.

 

[JCW]

Have only ever witnessed two blatent cheating

1. In a board comp I was paired with a 1 HC - he was arrogant beyond belief - first he laughed when he saw I had a plugged ball in a bunker then laughed when I didn't get out first time. So on out drivable 17th he went for it but could clearly see it was missing right and going to go down into the rubbish - anyway we search for ages - came to 5 mins and I said you need to go back and play another - he said ok and then found his original right out in the open at a place right near my bag and an area we had searched - I challenged him and said I had searched there and it wasn't there - the other guy in the group failed to back me up and he signed his card - I immediately went to a committee member and nothing could be done as the other guy wouldn't back me up - it was clear blatent cheating

2. In a Pro Am with our Pro both me and my playing partner knew that we had beaten the Pro by a shot - ( he had a mare with his short game ) - when the results happened he was announced as the winner !! His score was not what we thought it was - we were unsure what to do as they weren't "official" pro ams. The other PP spoke to the Pro the next day and he was adamant his scoring was correct.

His ball may well have been there , I don`t really blame the other guy for not backing you as maybe he was unsure about the whereabouts of the 1 h/c golfer`s ball . maybe he just did not want to get involved , has this 1 h/c guy , got form , if he is like that then there must be whispers about him , if it was me i would not sign his card if i was marking it , only ever done this once in the algarve in a comp .................EYG

 

[Region3]

For no.1, if you'd just told him his 5 minutes were up could you not stop him playing the 'found' ball as it was found after his time was up?

 

[Deleted member 15344]

For no.1, if you'd just told him his 5 minutes were up could you not stop him playing the 'found' ball as it was found after his time was up?

I was pretty new to golf then and didn't know the full ins and outs of the rules - now that's exactly what I would don

 

[chrisd]

Have only ever witnessed two blatent cheating

1. In a board comp I was paired with a 1 HC - he was arrogant beyond belief - first he laughed when he saw I had a plugged ball in a bunker then laughed when I didn't get out first time. So on out drivable 17th he went for it but could clearly see it was missing right and going to go down into the rubbish - anyway we search for ages - came to 5 mins and I said you need to go back and play another - he said ok and then found his original right out in the open at a place right near my bag and an area we had searched - I challenged him and said I had searched there and it wasn't there - the other guy in the group failed to back me up and he signed his card - I immediately went to a committee member and nothing could be done as the other guy wouldn't back me up - it was clear blatent cheating

What about the fact you had timed the search and it had gone past 5 minutes?

 

[Deleted member 15344]

What about the fact you had timed the search and it had gone past 5 minutes?

What about it ?