garyinderry
Ryder Cup Winner
ill get a pic or two up of my dads old sticks that are sitting in the garage. there is a right intimidating 2 iron in there!
How the hell did they even get the ball round the course years ago?
- Thread starter G1BB0
- Start date
SyR
Challenge Tour Pro
They had better feel and shortgames!
ScienceBoy
Money List Winner
And more free time to develop them, at the turn of the century (before last) most members names began with:
Col the Viscount...
The Earl of...
Lord...
Admiral...
The Rt Hon...
General...
The Rev Cannon...
You can see how much the game has changed in the last 120 years, I doubt this changed much until the 1950s.
duncan mackie
Money List Winner
there have been a fair number of different handicapping systems - and systems would be a little too strong for some of them!
initially members handicaps were set by the course managers, who went on to become the professional golfers we know today. If you beleive everything you read you would think this still applies at one club in the world today (Augusta National) but most moved to some form of system. The key driver for change being the introduction of stroke play as a concept - everything started as matchplay singles / foursomes. (probably why it was faster then......only joking snelly). This was all around the mid 19th century. Towards the end of that century (1880s?) the clubs began to administer there members handicaps on the basis of the average of the best 3 in a year - interestingly this was then adjusted to the courses rating even then 'standard scratch'. All through this period you also have to remember that bogey (the likely score of a good member) then par (the likely score of a professional) were all discussed and debated along with course ratings - all in the absence of a national body. For the UK this came along in 1925, together with a national handicapping scheme (still based on the best 3 average) whilst the US had got it's act together about 20 years earlier with the same system but integrating course ratings. This first documented system had 10 rules
We had our system for a long time, with the handicap being adjusted to any difference between the course based and course played ratings (in the same way as the US system still does) but the review, and start of the modern system came in 1983. Here we borrowed from the Australian system and started to base handicaps on all returned medal scores. Handicaps were still based on par and adjusted to SSS differences when playing away.
2001 saw the UHS, as much as anything this was to unify the mens and ladies systems (the latter had changed a lot more than the mens noted above!) and it also broke the link with par to create a single handicap based on the SSS rather than adjusted to it - the US haven't done this (yet).
The other changes have really revolved around what constitutes 'a golfer' with the concept of 18 being a natural upper limit, then pressure for 24 because that was a natural against 3/4 alowance (18 again) and today it's 28 (under CONGU) but higher elsewhere.
Sorry if this is a bit muddled, and I have probably missed bits as well, but the essence is there.
philsh
Assistant Pro
My mate plays with clubs his dad bought in the 70s and always hits around 80-85. i've had ago with them and I don't know how he does it. I have put it down to skill. If your good your good, doesnt matter what the club is and how old as the cream always rises to the top. He hits it further with an old 70's driver than fellas with these new oversized drivers. Good to watch.
stevelev
Journeyman Pro
I've got a full set of 70's clubs and putter, even a leather bag and sleeve of Penfold balls if anyone fancies trying them against him..............
Philsh which track do you play @
AuburnWarrior
Tour Winner
I personally believe that the game nowadays is easier.
I grew up hitting hickory shafted clubs. I'm not ancient - they were given to me in the early 80s. I still own them. If you can hit one of them then you can hit anything - honestly.
Persimmon woods, bladed irons, blade putters and balata golf balls - real golf!
Balata golf balls were so soft it was like putting with a marshmallow! They were so soft that the pros used to change them after about three holes. They would, quite literally, stop being spherical. God help you if you thinned one! New balls please!
No, golf today with 460cc drivers, fairway woods the size of plates, hybrids, irons large enough to get SKY sports on, putters with more technology that the first rocket to the moon and balls that are hard but soft - it's a walk in the park now.......
And then there's GPS and electric trolleys.......
I grew up hitting hickory shafted clubs. I'm not ancient - they were given to me in the early 80s. I still own them. If you can hit one of them then you can hit anything - honestly.
Persimmon woods, bladed irons, blade putters and balata golf balls - real golf!
Balata golf balls were so soft it was like putting with a marshmallow! They were so soft that the pros used to change them after about three holes. They would, quite literally, stop being spherical. God help you if you thinned one! New balls please!
No, golf today with 460cc drivers, fairway woods the size of plates, hybrids, irons large enough to get SKY sports on, putters with more technology that the first rocket to the moon and balls that are hard but soft - it's a walk in the park now.......
And then there's GPS and electric trolleys.......
philsh
Assistant Pro
Stevelev - I play badly at Eccleston Park in Rainhill. Only just joined about a month ago. Is your profile pic at the practice bays in Eccleston by the putting green?
Imurg
The Grinder Of Pars (Semi Crocked)
Soooo.......
In what way are they nearly as good as modern irons then....?:mmm::ears::ears:
AuburnWarrior
Tour Winner
ScienceBoy
Money List Winner
Almost as good apart from not being forgiving, hitting the ball shorter and not spinning them as much...
Its all in the post mate
What I was trying to say was they are really not much different but you do notice they are not as playable as modern clubs when your game is off.
Also I guess the 8 iron is actually equivalent to a modern PW so maybe the distance thing isn't so bad, the lower clubs are pretty big head wise but also relatively not very forgiving.
I could play with them and score well, they are also fun to hit but when the swing is off its game they are a nightmare. Where you would get a push shot with a modern iron with those it just goes nowhere...
S
Snelly
Guest
I still have a Persimmon Mizuno Pro Tour spec driver and I take it to the range for fun sometimes. It goes just as far as my new Ping driver and makes a very satisfying crunch rather than a sound like a dustbin lid being belted with a hammer.
I have also got a Mizuno bladed 1 iron that I still stick in my bag from time to time. It is a really nice club and I often use it off the tee when my timing is off through swinging too fast. It has to be timed properly to be hit well and it invariably helps me to get back to a steady rhythm.
I have also seen Bobmac hit some lovely 1 irons when we have played.
I think you play with what you are used to and you get used to what you play with. There are a lot of comments on this subject in this thread and others that point to new clubs being far easier to hit. Whilst I accept that this is true to an extent, I don't think that the difference is that big and most players could do just as well with bladed clubs or shafts that were not perfectly suited to their swings according to a computer.
As to whether clubs being easier to hit making the game more enjoyable, well I think that is a subjective point. Personally, I would rather hit a 3 iron over a 3 hybrid as I find it more satisfying and don't find one easier than the other. Some people may be the reverse of this I know.
That aside, my main point is that modern clubs don't make the game that much easier as if they did, the handicaps of players switiching from older clubs to new ones would drop accordingly and the fact is, they don't.
And scoring averages would be dropping as technology kicked in and the fact is, they aren't. Certainly not to any meaningful extent.
I have also got a Mizuno bladed 1 iron that I still stick in my bag from time to time. It is a really nice club and I often use it off the tee when my timing is off through swinging too fast. It has to be timed properly to be hit well and it invariably helps me to get back to a steady rhythm.
I have also seen Bobmac hit some lovely 1 irons when we have played.
I think you play with what you are used to and you get used to what you play with. There are a lot of comments on this subject in this thread and others that point to new clubs being far easier to hit. Whilst I accept that this is true to an extent, I don't think that the difference is that big and most players could do just as well with bladed clubs or shafts that were not perfectly suited to their swings according to a computer.
As to whether clubs being easier to hit making the game more enjoyable, well I think that is a subjective point. Personally, I would rather hit a 3 iron over a 3 hybrid as I find it more satisfying and don't find one easier than the other. Some people may be the reverse of this I know.
That aside, my main point is that modern clubs don't make the game that much easier as if they did, the handicaps of players switiching from older clubs to new ones would drop accordingly and the fact is, they don't.
And scoring averages would be dropping as technology kicked in and the fact is, they aren't. Certainly not to any meaningful extent.
6inchcup
Journeyman Pro
about 6 years ago i played in a charity game and everyone had to hire clothes and clubs from the 30's or 40's,plus fours long socks shirt and tie and a tweed jacket was the most uncomfortable garb i have ever wore for golf (including a dunlop shirt),irons that looked like butter knives,leather grips and shafts that were either to whippy or felt like brush steels and a small leather bag,no tee pegs allowed just a mound of sand and a driver that looked like a 5 wood,frustrating but fun and opened my eyes to how good the golfing heroes of the past must have been.
DaveM
Tour Winner
That sounds like my newest gear lol.
stevelev
Journeyman Pro
Sure is, you can see me trimming the rough most weekends there. And I'm not on a mower.
What are you of Philsh?
williamalex1
Money List Winner
i remember when they change to the larger 1.68 ball we use now , it seemed so big at the time , and could never get it to go as far as the smaller ball. or was that just me, and the holes seemed smaller too.my handicap never got back to 9.. its 15 now and rising.what was the old ball size ?
Foxholer
Blackballed
I know a couple of Pros who played with the 'small' ball. They reckon that, at the time, it was probably 2 clubs longer and possibly 30-40 yards longer on Drives.
And remember that Golf Course lengths have changed enormously over the years, but particularly in the last 20 years - Graphite shafts, Titanium heads and the Tiger Woods effect. The Old Course actually has a tee on the Eden and is 618yds! Oakmont had/has a 288 yard Par 3!
And remember that Golf Course lengths have changed enormously over the years, but particularly in the last 20 years - Graphite shafts, Titanium heads and the Tiger Woods effect. The Old Course actually has a tee on the Eden and is 618yds! Oakmont had/has a 288 yard Par 3!
MashieNiblick
Tour Winner
1.62 as opposed to 1.68 inches diameter for the American ball. Weight is the same.
I liked the bigger ball when it started to appear as I was just a kid and it looked a lot nicer and easier to hit.
Small ball was good in the wind and I suppose aerodynamically would go further (smaller surface area = less resistance?)
As I posted on another thread the Mizuno tour van guys got Chris Wood to hit an old persimmon driver, a T-Zoid and an MP650. He hit the MP650 anout 40-50 yards further than the older drivers.
