How’s your moral compass

BiMGuy

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Lets assume there are zero implications and no-one would EVER find out.

You find a quid on floor do you keep it or drop it in a charity tin for example?

What about a crisp 20 pound note blowing in the leaves?

An envelope with 500 quid in, how are you feeling now?

OK, 5 grand in an envelope, how are your morals now?

Watch No Country for Old Men before making a decision!
 

stefanovic

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I do enjoy listening to Richard Dawkins. Sam Harris is another good one.
Steven Pinker another.
“The scriptures present a God who delights in genocide, rape, slavery, and the execution of nonconformists, and for millennia those writings were used to rationalize the massacre of infidels, the ownership of women, the beating of children, dominion over animals, and the persecution of heretics and homosexuals. Humanitarian reforms such as the elimination of cruel punishment, the dissemination of empathy-inducing novels, and the abolition of slavery were met with fierce opposition in their time by ecclesiastical authorities and their apologists. The elevation of parochial values to the realm of the sacred is a license to dismiss other people’s interests, and an imperative to reject the possibility of compromise.”
― Steven Pinker, The Better Angels of Our Nature: Why Violence Has Declined

You could go on forever about how much damage has been done by religious texts which have held up progress and social reform, but I'm just going to highlight the 10 Commandments and its directive 'thou shalt not covet'. Supposing this had been replaced by 'thou shalt not take slaves'. Enough said.
 

Hobbit

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Lets assume there are zero implications and no-one would EVER find out.

You find a quid on floor do you keep it or drop it in a charity tin for example?

What about a crisp 20 pound note blowing in the leaves?

An envelope with 500 quid in, how are you feeling now?

OK, 5 grand in an envelope, how are your morals now?

The quid would end up in my pocket.

I found a €20 note blowing in the wind about a month ago. I asked around the club, and someone put their hand up for it.

The latter two would get handed in without a second thought.
 

GreiginFife

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Lets assume there are zero implications and no-one would EVER find out.

You find a quid on floor do you keep it or drop it in a charity tin for example?

What about a crisp 20 pound note blowing in the leaves?

An envelope with 500 quid in, how are you feeling now?

OK, 5 grand in an envelope, how are your morals now?

I had a somewhat similar scenario in December. I don't often visit bank branches as I do all on-line but needed to deposit some cash in my lad's account. When I left the branch and turned to walk along the street there was a "deposit envelope" lying on the ground which was clearly not empty and had been filled in as having £1500 in it.

Not even a consideration in my mind, took it straight in to the front desk and handed it in. That could have been some old dear's savings (or even my Dad's) that they've dropped.
 

Rooter

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I had a somewhat similar scenario in December. I don't often visit bank branches as I do all on-line but needed to deposit some cash in my lad's account. When I left the branch and turned to walk along the street there was a "deposit envelope" lying on the ground which was clearly not empty and had been filled in as having £1500 in it.

Not even a consideration in my mind, took it straight in to the front desk and handed it in. That could have been some old dear's savings (or even my Dad's) that they've dropped.


It's the things you do when no one is watching that define you.
 

Fade and Die

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Lets assume there are zero implications and no-one would EVER find out.

You find a quid on floor do you keep it or drop it in a charity tin for example?

What about a crisp 20 pound note blowing in the leaves?

An envelope with 500 quid in, how are you feeling now?

OK, 5 grand in an envelope, how are your morals now?


Depends....Last year i found a big fat wallet in the local co-op, it had a wad of £50s in it that would choke a donkey. Couldn't find a contact number in it, so just handed in to Customer services. Also last year playing a round on my own, hooked a tee shot into the woods on my left, reloaded and fired the next one down the fairway, walking up the fairway I was in two minds weather to have a look for the 1st ball, had a look behind me and the course was quiet so i thought I would have a little look, found the ball about 12ft into the trees laying next to a crisp £20 note! Trousered it. :LOL:
 

Ser Shankalot

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It's a fascinating topic. Philosophers (not just golfers) have been debating the source of morals for thousands of years.

I personally believe (again just my belief) that it's inherent in our DNA, like natural selection and evolution. Sort of both individuals and human societies and cultures win which have the right balance of morality, ambition and adaptability - the latter 2 important for progress and resilience but the first is important to ensure we don't destroy ourselves in the process. Maybe it's a law of the universe, like other aspects of evolution. And we (individuals or society) can choose to filter morality through a prism of philosophy, rationality, science, politics, religion, spirituality or whatever, then the test is simply does that particular prism work to help maintain balance and advance that particular society. Those prisms that don't work will either be replaced or self-destruct, or the society that follows that bad prism will lose out to a "better and more balanced" competitor in the future.

But I think trying to individualize it and debate whether one specific person's source of morality at any given point in time is better than another's is pointless.

Saying all that, it would be pretty funny if there were Pearly Gates but instead of St Peter we were met by Thor and his hammer.
 

Swinglowandslow

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Lets assume there are zero implications and no-one would EVER find out.

You find a quid on floor do you keep it or drop it in a charity tin for example?

What about a crisp 20 pound note blowing in the leaves?

An envelope with 500 quid in, how are you feeling now?

OK, 5 grand in an envelope, how are your morals now?

Yes, good dilemma.....
You would be surprised what the law of theft by finding says about your scenario.
What does disappoint me is what I understand the position of the Police is about this nowadays. (Maybe Billyboots can clarify)
As I understand it now, the police do not take in found property; nor do they record lost property.
They used to do that, but not now. I believe finders of property are invited to trace the owners themselves?

So, to my mind, the latter two scenarios would have been handed in to the Police, but if that is not now possible, to whom would you hand it in.
I suggest no one.( unless found in certain circumstances, e,g, in entrance to bank;in hotel corridor etc)
But, outside in a street say?
Keep it and record that fact and tell people who might assist (in order to find the owner )some information, but ensure that vital facts are kept to yourself that the rightful owner would know. E.g tell nearby shops something valuable has been found in case anyone enquires.Any subsequent claimant should know exactly what.
And they say the Police force has modernised for the better!
 

Robster59

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Yes, good dilemma.....
You would be surprised what the law of theft by finding says about your scenario.
What does disappoint me is what I understand the position of the Police is about this nowadays. (Maybe Billyboots can clarify)
As I understand it now, the police do not take in found property; nor do they record lost property.
They used to do that, but not now. I believe finders of property are invited to trace the owners themselves?

So, to my mind, the latter two scenarios would have been handed in to the Police, but if that is not now possible, to whom would you hand it in.
I suggest no one.( unless found in certain circumstances, e,g, in entrance to bank;in hotel corridor etc)
But, outside in a street say?
Keep it and record that fact and tell people who might assist (in order to find the owner )some information, but ensure that vital facts are kept to yourself that the rightful owner would know. E.g tell nearby shops something valuable has been found in case anyone enquires.Any subsequent claimant should know exactly what.
And they say the Police force has modernised for the better!
It seems to be a thing now to post finds such as this on Social Media, albeit with minimal information, although I would imagine you would be inundated with people claiming it is theirs, so you have to leave off any unique identifying information.

When I first started working, we were paid in cash every week. I was walking down the yard at our factory when I spotted a wage packet on the floor. It was a full weeks wages they'd just received. I looked to see if there was a wage slip inside with a name on, but it wasn't there. I handed it in to the office, and, as it turns out, it belonged to a bloke I knew very well. It would have been easy to walk off with someone's wages, but not something that I would do.
 

SwingsitlikeHogan

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Lad at the till in the shop/pub gives you too much change / the restaurant misses something from your bill. Do you give the change back / point out what's missed from the bill? Always. I don't want to carry around any feelings of guilt, no matter how small or apparently insignificant, and so I avoid picking any up. And if I do find myself having any feelings of guilt I try and deal with them as soon as possible.
 

Hobbit

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Lad at the till in the shop/pub gives you too much change / the restaurant misses something from your bill. Do you give the change back / point out what's missed from the bill? Always. I don't want to carry around any feelings of guilt, no matter how small or apparently insignificant, and so I avoid picking any up. And if I do find myself having any feelings of guilt I try and deal with them as soon as possible.

I always correct someone if they give me too much change. Some business owners charge the employees for shortfalls.
 

Tashyboy

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Lets assume there are zero implications and no-one would EVER find out.

You find a quid on floor do you keep it or drop it in a charity tin for example?

What about a crisp 20 pound note blowing in the leaves?

An envelope with 500 quid in, how are you feeling now?

OK, 5 grand in an envelope, how are your morals now?

A guy I knew who was low on the moral scale ( no longer With us ) once bought an house. Whilst doing it up he found a serious amount of money. The house was formerly used To distribute drugs. He spent said money. A Couple of months later. Some unsavoury characters came knocking on his door wanting a “ package”. Unfortunately he was to thick to convince said unsavoury characters that other folk had taken the money. His life was hell for a year or so.
The guy I knew, at his funeral his son who gave his started by saying “ I know some of you are here to make sure he has died”.?
 

SaintHacker

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Depends....Last year i found a big fat wallet in the local co-op, it had a wad of £50s in it that would choke a donkey. Couldn't find a contact number in it, so just handed in to Customer services. Also last year playing a round on my own, hooked a tee shot into the woods on my left, reloaded and fired the next one down the fairway, walking up the fairway I was in two minds weather to have a look for the 1st ball, had a look behind me and the course was quiet so i thought I would have a little look, found the ball about 12ft into the trees laying next to a crisp £20 note! Trousered it. :LOL:
Absolutely disgraceful behaviour!

You know full well you should have played it and not put it in your pocket!;)
 

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