Fitting - is it worth it?

[Deleted member 15717]

mmm....putting aside the sort of fitting you get retail chains or similar establishment, even most club pro's, then I would have to contest this.

There are a number of highly specialised fitters across the land...individuals who have years of experience and in depth knowledge of shafts/shaft technology who absolutely should be able to charge for a fitting. These are not the guys who will run through shaft after shaft after shaft looking at LM stats to determine the best choice, but rather folks who can watch you swing your current club and know, simply from observing tempo, transition and how you deliver the club to the ball, which two or three shafts are going to be a best fit...only then do they turn to a LM for fine tuning comparison and looking at "numbers". They are able to do the same with club heads.

These folks are like magicians, but because of what they do they are not necessarily the cheapest and as such will fall victim to the golfer who wants a fitting and then shops online to get his clubs....taking advantage of the fitter who gets no reward for his time, knowledge and experience.

Why dont they drop their prices then? (I can hear folks at the back muttering)

The sort of fitters I am talking about will invariably offer their customers additional services....once a fit is decided upon they will build a test club for the customer to go away and try out, potentially tweaking things based on feedback given. Only once the customer is satisfied will a full set be built. Additionally they will then offer further fine tuning for several months...so if in practical use the golfer finds that his clubs might be delivering a bit of a yardage gap (consistent yardage gaps are not simply a case of ensuring that lofts are evenly spaced) then the fitter will invariably make adjustments to rectify things. I'm afraid you dont get this with any of the major retailers as standard and even the club pro who is probably on fine margins will struggle to justify such after care unless it is fundamentally clear that the original fit was "bad".

This is what proper club fitting is all about and folks who provide such services absolutely should charge for their pre-purchase fitting time...and almost always will knock the fitting cost of the end price of the clubs.

Whilst launch monitors are a wonderful thing they are so widely available now that any old bod can set themselves up as a fitter with no real knowledge of the process...this often undermines the efforts of the truly skilled club fitters.

This.

Go to a brand independent fitter who knows what they are doing. I had a wood fit at (then) Golf Principles (now Club Champion) in Basingstoke. What an experience it was. Jason, the owner/fitter, had so much knowledge and experience, he would almost instinctively know if something would work within 2 swings, and change it out. I asked him to not tell me what he was putting in my hand, and he just gave me things to hit, narrowing the choices.

 

[Backsticks]

But do they have any significant impact on your score at the end of the round?

Yes, thats the question that the fitting industry never answers. It goes down a rabbit hole of numbers, rpm, launch angles, kick points, swing weights, etc. But is castles in the air. A self contained universe for believers who tumble into it, and can then no longer see the wood for the trees.
I dont think the fitters are charlatans even - they have drank their own kool aid, and do actually believe what they are preaching.
As an industry, it has never backed up its fundamental claim, that fine tuning club specs will influence golf performance. But doesnt need to in a way - it has a large enough base of followers in the faith who dont ask the question, to sustain itself commercially.

 

[Slab]

Yes, thats the question that the fitting industry never answers. It goes down a rabbit hole of numbers, rpm, launch angles, kick points, swing weights, etc. But is castles in the air. A self contained universe for believers who tumble into it, and can then no longer see the wood for the trees.
I dont think the fitters are charlatans even - they have drank their own kool aid, and do actually believe what they are preaching.
As an industry, it has never backed up its fundamental claim, that fine tuning club specs will influence golf performance. But doesnt need to in a way - it has a large enough base of followers in the faith who dont ask the question, to sustain itself commercially.

I watched a club fitting vid on YT last week (Finch at Ping) where the fitter used software to compare his swing with different iron shafts with the difference shown as strokes gained per round
i.e shaft A verses shaft B will provide a stokes gained of 1.16 shots per round

There must be a level of player where such gains are measurable like this, i'm not sure its club golfers, interesting to watch though

 

[Crow]

I watched a club fitting vid on YT last week (Finch at Ping) where the fitter used software to compare his swing with different iron shafts with the difference shown as strokes gained per round
i.e shaft A verses shaft B will provide a stokes gained of 1.16 shots per round

I'd love to see the formula behind that claim.

 

[IanM]

Yep... too many variables to come up with stats like that.

But, you will play better with something that makes you feel more confident and something that isn't making life harder for you.

 

[nickjdavis]

Yep... too many variables to come up with stats like that.

But, you will play better with something that makes you feel more confident and something that isn't making life harder for you.

and thats what the best fitters do....they provide you with clubs that work with you, not against you.

 

[Voyager EMH]

Vast majority of my good scores seem to happen in good weather.

Thinks, "Nice out there. Looks like a 1.16 strokes gained day today."
But only if I keep using the same clubs.

 

[Voyager EMH]

and thats what the best fitters do....they provide you with clubs that work with you, not against you.

Never had any of those. All clubs have done exactly what I've told them to do. Sometimes it has been my instructions that have not been very good.

 

[Voyager EMH]

I would hate to be a 12 year old golfer again. New clubs every 6 months would be required. What a pain!

 

[Orikoru]

I watched a club fitting vid on YT last week (Finch at Ping) where the fitter used software to compare his swing with different iron shafts with the difference shown as strokes gained per round
i.e shaft A verses shaft B will provide a stokes gained of 1.16 shots per round

There must be a level of player where such gains are measurable like this, i'm not sure its club golfers, interesting to watch though

I watched that video, and while I don't doubt the benefits of a fitting, I did wonder how on earth they come up with a number like that. There has to be a fair amount of total guesswork involved.

 

[harpo_72]

To be fair fitting must be horrendously hard.
You have a club golfer who will deliver you all kinds of randomness and you’re looking for a data set to guide you.
Then you have a professional who can just adjust in a few swings .. so you get a minimal data set ..

Then when this has happened the club golfer goes on a forum and states these don’t work and so’n’so did not fit me correctly etc …

 

[Deleted member 15717]

You have a club golfer who will deliver you all kinds of randomness and you’re looking for a data set to guide you

you'd probably be surprised at how consistent club golfers will deliver a club, ball on ball. Speeds will stay somewhat consistent, path will stay somewhat consistent. Strike may move about, but the actual delivery of the club will be pretty similar throughout

 

[HomerJSimpson]

However like the randomness of golfers, I have had a some very random fittings and it does take a trained and knowledgeable fitter to make it a successful and two way process. From several negative experiences I would always avoid using AG for a fitting

 

[Deleted member 15717]

However like the randomness of golfers, I have had a some very random fittings and it does take a trained and knowledgeable fitter to make it a successful and two way process. From several negative experiences I would always avoid using AG for a fitting

100%. would avoid AG for a fitting like the plague.

 

[Orikoru]

100%. would avoid AG for a fitting like the plague.

They are free, so it's fine to do one if you just want to try out a bunch of new clubs. Just ignore the numbers and fitter's suggestions that's all.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

100%. would avoid AG for a fitting like the plague.

And yet lots on here have had very good fittings. I had two very poor fittings at their Bird Hills (Maidenhead) and Camberley stores and so while I wouldn't be adverse to wandering along to try some clubs if I couldn't find them elsewhere (my pro can be slow at getting some demo models in via Foremost) I definitely wouldn't want any of them to try and fit me again. I had been fitted by a trained Ping fitter when I got the I25's and they were green dot and one fitter had me so much flatter it was ludicrous especially with my delivery at that time

 

[road2ruin]

They are free, so it's fine to do one if you just want to try out a bunch of new clubs. Just ignore the numbers and fitter's suggestions that's all.

I agree, I've used AG to try and get an idea of which clubs I like the feel, look, sound of etc. I then ignore the fact that my present driver went 230 carry whilst the potential new purchase when 290 on the AG screen!

 

[Deleted member 30522]

Smoke and mirrors then?

Even the best professionals would be hard pressed to hit 2 identical shots for one hole, let alone a full round.

Fitting is a marketing con for most club golfers. They end up with the clubs they knew that they wanted before the fitting but the fitter tells them that they're just right for them now. They then go out on the course and hit all the same shots they were hitting before.

IMHO of course.

As someone who was a fitter once upon a time, you're correct, it's just your opinion, and i'm afraid, not very accurate at that

 

[Deleted member 30522]

I agree, I've used AG to try and get an idea of which clubs I like the feel, look, sound of etc. I then ignore the fact that my present driver went 230 carry whilst the potential new purchase when 290 on the AG screen!

...and what did your current driver do on the AG screen?

 

[Backsticks]

As someone who was a fitter once upon a time, you're correct, it's just your opinion, and i'm afraid, not very accurate at that

The Fitting Illusion relies on the principle that different inputs, in club spec, will give different output, in shot quality. And it may even be valid. But the difference in outcome is never quantified, even in any sense, by fitters. And so is smoke and mirrors. They cannot backup the fundamental claim of the industry. A fun process for some maybe to talk arcane golf twaddle and buy into a dream. But back in reality, it is not worth a second or a penny.