EU Referendum

[bobmac]

Maybe someone can correct me if I'm wrong...........

Britain pays £13bn into the EU ever year.
Britain gets £4.5bn back.

So if Britain left the EU, they would have £8.5bn a year (£23m per day) more to spend on the NHS, Armed forces, teachers, housing, pensions, wages etc.......

Still, at least we know the money we paid in wasn't wasted


[video=youtube;VBbj2WR1POA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VBbj2WR1POA[/video]

Where do I vote?

 

[CheltenhamHacker]

Maybe someone can correct me if I'm wrong...........

Britain pays £13bn into the EU ever year.
Britain gets £4.5bn back.

So if Britain left the EU, they would have £8.5bn a year (£23m per day) more to spend on the NHS, Armed forces, teachers, housing, pensions, wages etc.......

Still, at least we know the money we paid in wasn't wasted

You're wrong. Not a cats chance in hell we would have that extra money, which is actually a drop in the ocean compared to the total government spend. If we vote out, you wouldn't notice a single change as a result of extra "money" coming back from the EU, largely because it would be diverted into legal costs, worsening trade deals etc etc.

The economy would suffer from a Leave vote. Even the top Leave campaigners admit that. To pretend otherwise is to bury your head in the sand.

 

[Deleted member 18121]

You're wrong. Not a cats chance in hell we would have that extra money, which is actually a drop in the ocean compared to the total government spend. If we vote out, you wouldn't notice a single change as a result of extra "money" coming back from the EU, largely because it would be diverted into legal costs, worsening trade deals etc etc.

The economy would suffer from a Leave vote. Even the top Leave campaigners admit that. To pretend otherwise is to bury your head in the sand.

There is no proof of a single thing you say, no one KNOWS what will happen at all....its all smoke and mirrors.

I hope we get out. Masters of our own destiny, that's what we fought for.

 

[bobmac]

You're wrong. Not a cats chance in hell we would have that extra money, which is actually a drop in the ocean compared to the total government spend. If we vote out, you wouldn't notice a single change as a result of extra "money" coming back from the EU, largely because it would be diverted into legal costs, worsening trade deals etc etc.

The economy would suffer from a Leave vote. Even the top Leave campaigners admit that. To pretend otherwise is to bury your head in the sand.

And the money that is wasted?

 

[MegaSteve]

Hopefully they'll be giving some extra time to those that can't get to their polling station today, due to current foul weather, to cast their vote.. After all they awarded some extra time to those that left it to the very last minute to register to vote...

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

So much for EU democracy. The President of the EU has openly stated that there will be no further reforms of current EU legislation although many of the leaders of country's in the EU (and the people who voted him in) have stated that reforms are required. This included the controllers of the EU, Germany and France.

And I thought that this was something that MEPs were paid to decide.

Just saying.

Did you actually listen to what Juncker said.

He said 'no more renegotiation - out is out'. Don't forget that this referendum is actually only advisory. Juncker knows that, so when he says 'no more renegotiation - out is out' what he is saying is that if we vote to Leave then don't think you can then come to us and 'try it on', using the mandate of a referendum Leave result as a leverage for renegotiating further changes.

Oh I know Leave will spin this to mean 'no more renegotiation ever' but Leave are a disingenuous and duplicitous lot, The Leave motto might well have been... 'If it sounds like it could be true - then that will do'

And so it has come to pass - Leave spinning a statement into something it's not.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

You're wrong. Not a cats chance in hell we would have that extra money, which is actually a drop in the ocean compared to the total government spend. If we vote out, you wouldn't notice a single change as a result of extra "money" coming back from the EU, largely because it would be diverted into legal costs, worsening trade deals etc etc.

The economy would suffer from a Leave vote. Even the top Leave campaigners admit that. To pretend otherwise is to bury your head in the sand.

And just for arguments sake accepting the £23m a day figure and turning it on it's head. That's 30p a day each of us pays for the benefits of being in the EU and a single market. Not a lot is it...less than the price of my i newspaper or a bag of crisps every two days.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

There is no proof of a single thing you say, no one KNOWS what will happen at all....its all smoke and mirrors.

I hope we get out. Masters of our own destiny, that's what we fought for.

Masters of our own destiny except that the financial markets determine our fiscal and monetary policy and our new trading partners determine what we have to do (give away) to partner with them. 'Take back control' - just another way of saying 'there's them and there's us'. And so on 'control' and 'sovereignty' Leave have presented us with a chimera.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

There is no proof of a single thing you say, no one KNOWS what will happen at all....its all smoke and mirrors.

I hope we get out. Masters of our own destiny, that's what we fought for.

Tell you what though - it's a hell of a lot easier to predict where you are going to be if you know where you are starting from and have a reasonable understanding of uncertainties going forward. Today we know that, but if we vote Leave then tomorrow we will know neither.

 

[Hacker Khan]

Maybe someone can correct me if I'm wrong...........

Britain pays £13bn into the EU ever year.
Britain gets £4.5bn back.

So if Britain left the EU, they would have £8.5bn a year (£23m per day) more to spend on the NHS, Armed forces, teachers, housing, pensions, wages etc.......

Still, at least we know the money we paid in wasn't wasted


[video=youtube;VBbj2WR1POA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VBbj2WR1POA[/video]

Where do I vote?

I suspect we would be spending a lot of that money on sorting out our legal system, propping up the economy if any of the forecasts by the independent economic forecasters are to be believed and many other agreements and benefits that we get as being part of the EU, should we vote to leave. Whilst the argument people always use of 'if we didn't do that we could use the money to do this' sounds persuasive, in reality I am sure it is not that easy and there is not a big pot of money that will go the the NHS if it does not go to teaching for example. I do agree that there will be potentially more money available, but to me that is ignoring the value of being in the EU and the cost of regaining that 'value'. Kind of like the saying 'the price of everything but the value of nothing'.

But I do agree the Strasbourg thing is ridiculous and is something that should be reformed. Perhaps naively I hope that if we do vote to remain the the EU will look at how close they have come to losing one of the 3 major players in the EU and start some genuine reforms and get rid of silly practices like this.

 

[Hacker Khan]

I'll tell you one thing, depending on which way the vote goes, either SILH or SocketRocket will wake up tomorrow knowing that they have wasted a hell of a lot of key strokes and time posting in this thread, just to be on the wrong side of history.

 

[MegaSteve]

Did you actually listen to what Juncker said.

I can't speak for Old Skier but I'd prefer not to listen to someone who speaks in the manner he does... ie Gun against the head take it or leave it...

And, what is a supposed leftie like yourself doing listening to someone who [allegedly] is happy to help folk with tax avoidance...

 

[FairwayDodger]

Sadly Karen it's not just Boris. He is one of many of the old boys network, and quite a few now are simply 'career politicians' with little first hand experience of the real world. This debate has really made me lose faith in the integrity of our leaders.

Agreed but the report focussed on boris and even I was taken aback by just how brazen he was.

 

[Crazyface]

Remain. Now then everyone if we vote to leave the EU we will probably go into a recession.

Er just what have we had for the last 5 years whilst we have been in, golden money showers????????

I've just a had my first pay rise in 5 years 1.5%. Greece are in a mess and the EU is pumping money in there as fast as it can. Spain and Portugal are not far behind. Just why the hell are we propping up lazy useless countries?

 

[Hobbit]

Where's George Osbourne gone since his suggestion of a bullying budget? He's all but disappeared since 57 Conservative MP's have told him they would vote against it. Dead man walking??

 

[Hacker Khan]

Where's George Osbourne gone since his suggestion of a bullying budget? He's all but disappeared since 57 Conservative MP's have told him they would vote against it. Dead man walking??

I suspect it is similar to the Gove effect at the last election. In that he is not liked by a vast majority of the electorate, who may possibly vote the opposite of whatever he says, just because it is George Osborne. That is why Gove was removed from his position of secretary of state for education and was very rarely used in the last election campaign. Basically he was electoral poison.

And if I was very paranoid I could argue Gove is getting his revenge on Cameron now by doing what he is doing. But I appreciate that takes me into the realms of paranoia so I do not endorse that suggestion.

 

[Hobbit]

I suspect it is similar to the Gove effect at the last election. In that he is not liked by a vast majority of the electorate, who may possibly vote the opposite of whatever he says, just because it is George Osborne. That is why Gove was removed from his position of secretary of state for education and was very rarely used in the last election campaign. Basically he was electoral poison.

And if I was very paranoid I could argue Gove is getting his revenge on Cameron now by doing what he is doing. But I appreciate that takes me into the realms of paranoia so I do not endorse that suggestion.

He's behind you!

 

[Crazyface]

I'll tell you one thing, depending on which way the vote goes, either SILH or SocketRocket will wake up tomorrow knowing that they have wasted a hell of a lot of key strokes and time posting in this thread, just to be on the wrong side of history.

And be able to say "told you so"

 

[Doon frae Troon]

Top 3 performers for the Remain campaign.

Nigel Farage [by a long way]
Michael Gove
Boris Johnson

Notice that the leavers kept IDS locked up in a box.

 

[ColchesterFC]

When the campaign started I was in favour of Remain but by the end of the campaign I was undecided and if I had been able to vote would have made my mind up on the way to the polling station. Now I am almost hoping for a vote to Leave. Can you imagine just how smug Cameron will look tomorrow if the vote is to Remain. It's almost worth knackering the economy just so we don't have to see that. I wonder if the Queen will be "purring" tomorrow when he phones to tell her the result?