Brexit - or Article 50: the Phoenix!

[Deleted member 1147]

Dyson has stated that Brexit was NOT the reason !!

In the immortal words of Mandy Rice Davies:
“he would say that wouldn’t he?”

 

[Deleted member 1740]

Perhaps Mr Dyson just wants to help grow Singapore’s economy now.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

https://news.sky.com/story/po-post-...f-twitter&utm_source=t.co&utm_medium=referral

 

[Mudball]

So the fearless leaders of Brexit have ensured that they won’t be affected by any deal..
Rees Mog moved his finance company to Ireland (no back stop issue here) ... and now Dyson moves to Singapore. I hope BoJo also applies for a German passport soon..

.. rats leaving a sinking ship??

 

[Deleted member 1147]

Apparently the Dyson electric cars will be made in Singapore - says a lot about his faith in Britain post brexit!

 

[MegaSteve]

Not sure Dyson is going anywhere... Believe he is Britains biggest farmer...

 

[SocketRocket]

Dyson has invested massivly in research and development and has created a faciility in North Wiltshire to train undergraduates in design and engineering. He has a very big design facility in Malmesbury where he employs a large number of engineering graduates. He is more than worthy of praise for his commitment to young engineers and new technology. Maybe some on here decrying him can compare their credentials with his.

 

[Sweep]

I have to say that even in my wildest fears, I never thought I would ever see anything like this mess created by the current parliamentarians.
Just a brief overview of recent happenings:
The Chancellor, the very man in charge of tax revenue for our nation, has a conference call with the boss of Amazon, one of the biggest tax dodging companies trading in Britain, giving him assurances that he is not in a position to make about Brexit. Seriously, if you avoid paying tax do you think you would get to chat with the Chancellor? I mean, what is going to happen if you don’t do what Mr Amazon says? We will have a £15k tax hole to fill.
The leader of HM Opposition doesn’t agree with his own shadow Brexit minister and the PM doesn’t agree with hers.
5 days debate on the Withdrawal Agreement ends with the vote being cancelled because the govt is going to lose, only for another 5 days of debate one month later on the very same agreement which ends in the govt losing, as everyone knew they would. The Opposition then table a motion of no confidence in the govt that they know they can’t win, resulting in a days debate and a vote they lost as everyone knew they would. So an entire week was wasted debating votes that everyone knew wouldn’t be won. Apparently we have all the time in the world for such nonsense. After all we have another 9 weeks (less a few weeks for holibobs).
The PM then had 3 days to come back with Plan B. She comes back with Plan A.
In the meantime she asks the other parties for their ideas even though everyone knows she will ignore them. The Leader of the Opposition who has been moaning for two and a half years that the govt should have had cross party consultation refuses to be consulted. Unless the govt rule out no deal, which requires a deal in itself.
Everyone on the planet, except Labour and a few other oddballs in Parliament, understands that if you are undertaking a negotiation for anything, from buying a house, a car, something off eBay or with the EU, you can’t negotiate if you are not prepared to walk away. Everyone knows taking away your biggest point of leverage is negotiation suicide. It’s like going into a car dealer and saying “I am going to buy this car, no matter what deal you offer me”. It’s complete madness and yet we have people in power who think it’s a jolly good idea.
The media can’t decide if the ports are going to be gridlocked or they are going to lose 87% of traffic. Easter will have to be cancelled because there will be a chocolate shortage (because Easter is a chocolate festival), Mother’s Day is off due to a flower shortage.
MP’s from all sides seem to think that democracy and the referendum result are a mere inconvenience and appear to be utterly unaware of the anger and frustration at the prospect at the destruction of a democracy that took centuries to build. They seem blissfully unaware of the loss of confidence and trust in the political process that would follow. The complete lack of mandate when no-one bothers to vote in a sham of a democracy. They are only concerned about parliamentary deadlock, even though the nation decide 30 months ago and the debate ended then.
A former Prime Minister is briefing the EU on how to play hardball with his own nation.
Today, my MP tweets. Two and a half years ago her constituency voted overwhelmingly to leave. They told her what they wanted. Today, with just 9 weeks to go she comes up with a brainwave. A citizens assembly, so that her constituents can tell her what they want. Again. Seemingly she was happy to embrace democracy when it got her elected. Now though democracy has lost its novelty value and she will do anything to avoid doing her damned job.
I believe and I certainly hope that the people of this country and history will judge the politicians of today with the condemnation they deserve. And the same should be true on whatever side of the debate you are on. They are weak and ineffective. They are living in Cloudcuckoo Land. They lack leadership and courage. They represent everything that is wrong with Britain today and the nation we have become.
They need to grow a pair and quick.

 

[MendieGK]

Sony announced they are moving their European HQ to Holland because of brexit.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

I'm no fan of Dyson and his gradual move east but if he was being hypocritical about Brexit then he would have moved into Europe not the Far East. Moving to Singapore doesn't protect his company from Brexit, it's still outside the EU.

 

[Taz]

I'm no fan of Dyson and his gradual move east but if he was being hypocritical about Brexit then he would have moved into Europe not the Far East. Moving to Singapore doesn't protect his company from Brexit, it's still outside the EU.

LBC were saying this morning that its only 2 people from head office moving out there.

 

[Dando]

LBC were saying this morning that its only 2 people from head office moving out there.

Let’s hope they got on with each other!

 

[robinthehood]

The two largest suppliers are the salt mines in Cheshire and the mines at Boulby in North Yorkshire. Used to pass Boulby quite often. The shaft goes out to sea quite a way.

There is also a large mine in Carrickfergus N.I

 

[User62651]

I have to say that even in my wildest fears, I never thought I would ever see anything like this mess created by the current parliamentarians.
Just a brief overview of recent happenings:
The Chancellor, the very man in charge of tax revenue for our nation, has a conference call with the boss of Amazon, one of the biggest tax dodging companies trading in Britain, giving him assurances that he is not in a position to make about Brexit. Seriously, if you avoid paying tax do you think you would get to chat with the Chancellor? I mean, what is going to happen if you don’t do what Mr Amazon says? We will have a £15k tax hole to fill.
The leader of HM Opposition doesn’t agree with his own shadow Brexit minister and the PM doesn’t agree with hers.
5 days debate on the Withdrawal Agreement ends with the vote being cancelled because the govt is going to lose, only for another 5 days of debate one month later on the very same agreement which ends in the govt losing, as everyone knew they would. The Opposition then table a motion of no confidence in the govt that they know they can’t win, resulting in a days debate and a vote they lost as everyone knew they would. So an entire week was wasted debating votes that everyone knew wouldn’t be won. Apparently we have all the time in the world for such nonsense. After all we have another 9 weeks (less a few weeks for holibobs).
The PM then had 3 days to come back with Plan B. She comes back with Plan A.
In the meantime she asks the other parties for their ideas even though everyone knows she will ignore them. The Leader of the Opposition who has been moaning for two and a half years that the govt should have had cross party consultation refuses to be consulted. Unless the govt rule out no deal, which requires a deal in itself.
Everyone on the planet, except Labour and a few other oddballs in Parliament, understands that if you are undertaking a negotiation for anything, from buying a house, a car, something off eBay or with the EU, you can’t negotiate if you are not prepared to walk away. Everyone knows taking away your biggest point of leverage is negotiation suicide. It’s like going into a car dealer and saying “I am going to buy this car, no matter what deal you offer me”. It’s complete madness and yet we have people in power who think it’s a jolly good idea.
The media can’t decide if the ports are going to be gridlocked or they are going to lose 87% of traffic. Easter will have to be cancelled because there will be a chocolate shortage (because Easter is a chocolate festival), Mother’s Day is off due to a flower shortage.
MP’s from all sides seem to think that democracy and the referendum result are a mere inconvenience and appear to be utterly unaware of the anger and frustration at the prospect at the destruction of a democracy that took centuries to build. They seem blissfully unaware of the loss of confidence and trust in the political process that would follow. The complete lack of mandate when no-one bothers to vote in a sham of a democracy. They are only concerned about parliamentary deadlock, even though the nation decide 30 months ago and the debate ended then.
A former Prime Minister is briefing the EU on how to play hardball with his own nation.
Today, my MP tweets. Two and a half years ago her constituency voted overwhelmingly to leave. They told her what they wanted. Today, with just 9 weeks to go she comes up with a brainwave. A citizens assembly, so that her constituents can tell her what they want. Again. Seemingly she was happy to embrace democracy when it got her elected. Now though democracy has lost its novelty value and she will do anything to avoid doing her damned job.
I believe and I certainly hope that the people of this country and history will judge the politicians of today with the condemnation they deserve. And the same should be true on whatever side of the debate you are on. They are weak and ineffective. They are living in Cloudcuckoo Land. They lack leadership and courage. They represent everything that is wrong with Britain today and the nation we have become.
They need to grow a pair and quick.

Agree with most of it until the bold part.
Dont really agree with the MPs ignoring democracy, if they did they'd have just ignored the result back in 2016 and said thanks for the opinion poll but no thanks. Half the reason we're in such a muddle is because PM is trying to follow 'the will of the people' as she calls it no matter what. At 52/48 there was always going to be parliamentary gridlock compounded by May then losing a working majority through a needless GE which was done to try and make her own position stronger both to get Brexit through her way and make other Tory policy easier to get through, all because the polls gave her party a massive lead which she personally evaporated to Corbyn of all people - electorate said no thanks to May so it's our fault too.
I dont believe MPs lack courage or live in cloud cuckoo land at all either, they are very much in the middle of a harsh reality. They just disagree, you have an electorate that gave a small majority on an ill-conceived referendum (zero planning by govt for a Leave vote) against a parliament which was majority remain. Most MPs reflect their constituents views (if they dont they'll lose their job soon). For example you cant tell me every MP up here should back May's deal when every constituency voted remain, doesn't work like that. They are compromising however to leaving but with tie-ins to Customs Union and Single Market - course that's not meeting the 'Leave means leave' mantra which is part of the issue.

Something has to give soon after 2.5+ years of BS.

However I think we'll be getting an extension to Article 50 shortly. So no resolution for another 9 months+. Fun isn't it?

 

[hors limite]

Ive replied to this matter a number of times. keep up.

Take a look at #4,315/4322

My post questioned your attitude about bumps in the road following Brexit and your " I'm alright Jack" attitude. I am pretty certain from your self congratulatory, even conceited, posts that you will be well insulated from any adverse effects. If you are going to hold such selfish views you should at least have the courage to defend them.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

LBC were saying this morning that its only 2 people from head office moving out there.

Is it a tax move then or is it about making it easier to set up factories in Singapore? I know in some Far Eastern countries they will look more kindly, or it's the law, upon a business if they move key aspects out there. As Dyson are mfr out in Singapore now this move, practically a paper move if only 2 people are going, may be along those lines.

 

[Sweep]

Agree with most of it until the bold part.
Dont really agree with the MPs ignoring democracy, if they did they'd have just ignored the result back in 2016 and said thanks for the opinion poll but no thanks. Half the reason we're in such a muddle is because PM is trying to follow 'the will of the people' as she calls it no matter what. At 52/48 there was always going to be parliamentary gridlock compounded by May then losing a working majority through a needless GE which was done to try and make her own position stronger both to get Brexit through her way and make other Tory policy easier to get through, all because the polls gave her party a massive lead which she personally evaporated to Corbyn of all people - electorate said no thanks to May so it's our fault too.
I dont believe MPs lack courage or live in cloud cuckoo land at all either, they are very much in the middle of a harsh reality. They just disagree, you have an electorate that gave a small majority on an ill-conceived referendum (zero planning by govt for a Leave vote) against a parliament which was majority remain. Most MPs reflect their constituents views (if they dont they'll lose their job soon). For example you cant tell me every MP up here should back May's deal when every constituency voted remain, doesn't work like that. They are compromising however to leaving but with tie-ins to Customs Union and Single Market - course that's not meeting the 'Leave means leave' mantra which is part of the issue.

Something has to give soon after 2.5+ years of BS.

However I think we'll be getting an extension to Article 50 shortly. So no resolution for another 9 months+. Fun isn't it?

I agree with much of what you say. However, I do think MP’s are too focussed on parliamentary deadlock rather than enacting the result of the referendum, which after all is their duty.
I think and hope that the vast majority of the electorate are not as daft as our elected representatives think we are. We know what they are trying to do when they come up with all kinds of excuses like “we need another vote but don’t know what to ask”, citizens assemblies, no deal off the table, project fear, staying in a customs union even though it means no trade deals with anyone else, leaving but not really leaving, backstop, “we need to delay”...
If they don’t want to meet their responsibilities as our elected representatives, if they don’t want to abide by the manifestos they were elected on (SNP and Lib Dems aside) they should just resign and let someone else do the job.
We are 31 months into the process with 2 to go. What the hell have they been doing? If they decide to delay I hope they are met with the derision they deserve. Most if not all are not fit for purpose.
Expect a lot of deselections prior to the next GE. And expect a lot of the electorate to be disengaged, disinterested and distanced from their own nation.
It’s hard to be proud and part of your country when your vote is ignored and all you are is a cash cow for whichever party of charlatans are claiming power on any given date.

 

[Sweep]

Is it a tax move then or is it about making it easier to set up factories in Singapore? I know in some Far Eastern countries they will look more kindly, or it's the law, upon a business if they move key aspects out there. As Dyson are mfr out in Singapore now this move, practically a paper move if only 2 people are going, may be along those lines.

Or maybe it’s something to do with Singapore just having done a deal with the EU, as some papers are reporting.
I have little doubt this is being over egged by Dyson’s detractors and the remain camp, but he is an open goal, so you can’t blame them. It has to be said, James Dyson has not been the best PR for Brexit and it would have been better if he had just kept his views to himself, as his actions don’t seem to match his words. For example, did he have to make this move right now?
In the words of Noel, Some might say he is actually working undercover for remain. Now there is a conspiracy theory.

Oh well, sunshine follows thunder. 😀

 

[drdel]

Its worth remember that it was Barnier who said that the disengagement process and future (trade, etc) talks could not operate in parallel.

Since it is patently nonsense to say that the future plans aren't influenced by the how you transition (withdraw) it obviously created the hiatus of the middle ground and by implication the NI 'backstop'. No one would ever buy a business without discussing the current state of affairs AND conducting the due diligence and forecasts.

If both sides to an arrangement plan on a future agreement it is stupid to have any 'stop' in the transition process.

 

[Mudball]

LBC were saying this morning that its only 2 people from head office moving out there.

So said American Kraft/Modelez when they bought Cadburys... eventually shuttering. People blame India Tata for doing same with steel and Cars..
They do have a strong PR.. they went for 2 people. When everything cools down, it does not take long to move other bits as part of a 'strategic review'.

BTW, I am not sure where they would manufacture in Singapore given it is so small and real estate is really really expensive. I am assuming they will manufacture in Malaysia, Vietnam, Thailand, Indonesia etc with an office in expat friendly Singapore..