Angry golfers who won't practice or take lessons...

[Orikoru]

My mate off scratch is the worst bunker player I have met.
If he goes in a bunker he’s toast.

I have tried numerous times to teach him to open the face and present the bounce to the sand.
But he rolls his wrists on every shot and he’s brilliant at it but that dosnt work in sand.

You can see the frustration on his face and mine
He’s been like this for over 30 yrs.

But as he says “ I don’t go in a bunker very often”

Yeah that's my strategy these days as well. If there's bunkers at the front of the green, I'm clubbing for the back. If there's a fairway bunker on the left, I'll aim straight at it as the only surefire way to miss it.

 

[clubchamp98]

I've been Mr Angry on a course and beaten myself up over a duffed chip or thinned bunker shot and it has still be stewing three holes later. I have been doing a lot of work using the Karl Morris and others podcasts to really get some clarity into a pre-shot and especially post-shot routine and some acceptance that I am not a good golfer in the great scheme of things and I do it for "fun".

However I am a believer that if someone has a fundamental swing flaw it needs some sort of professional intervention to at least identify the issue and give some fixes. How far the player then takes that is an individual choice and even if they don't work on it at least they have some knowledge on the issues and can try to minimise the problem on each shot

I don't know who said it but there is a great quote along the lines of if you keep doing the things you are doing you'll keep getting the results your getting. In other words change something (lessons or in the case of my long game a brand new swing) and work on it. My short game is my weakest spot by miles and I am making changes to improve it (a long way to go) but I know if I can get this up to even a 4/10 I am saving shots on where I am now

It’s the guy on Sky
Martin ?

 

[Arthur Wedge]

Never had a lesson , don’t practise , just try diffrent things from watching videos or seeing stuff on the telly

Lessons won’t suit everyone , lessons may improve some but I will always have the belief that everyone has a natural ability ceiling and no matter how much someone practises or has lessons they will never go beyond a certain point - ability and biology stops it

But they are a great placebo for some

 

[Deleted member 25575]

My mate off scratch is the worst bunker player I have met.
If he goes in a bunker he’s toast.

I have tried numerous times to teach him to open the face and present the bounce to the sand.
But he rolls his wrists on every shot and he’s brilliant at it but that dosnt work in sand.

You can see the frustration on his face and mine
He’s been like this for over 30 yrs.

But as he says “ I don’t go in a bunker very often”

He is missing a huge chunk of what’s available to him course wise. If he is off scratch and can’t play out of bunkers, I can only imagine he would be + some if he could.
Often times (if you’re a competent bunker player) the bunker is a great miss, if the rough is up or there’s water at the other side of the green the bunker is a great miss, strategically it must be hard approaching a green with water left and sand right contemplating the water as the safe side to miss

 

[cliveb]

strategically it must be hard approaching a green with water left and sand right contemplating the water as the safe side to miss

If there's a bunker right and water left, there is no safe miss. If you go in the bunker, you just know where the shot out of it going to end up

 

[Lord Tyrion]

He is missing a huge chunk of what’s available to him course wise. If he is off scratch and can’t play out of bunkers, I can only imagine he would be + some if he could.
Often times (if you’re a competent bunker player) the bunker is a great miss, if the rough is up or there’s water at the other side of the green the bunker is a great miss, strategically it must be hard approaching a green with water left and sand right contemplating the water as the safe side to miss

You often hear that on the Sky commentary, 'he will be happy to be in the bunker'. Top players are so good out of bunkers, they are rarely a hazard to them.

 

[Backache]

Never had a lesson , don’t practise , just try diffrent things from watching videos or seeing stuff on the telly

Lessons won’t suit everyone , lessons may improve some but I will always have the belief that everyone has a natural ability ceiling and no matter how much someone practises or has lessons they will never go beyond a certain point - ability and biology stops it

But they are a great placebo for some

I suspect there is a natural ability ceiling, but I also suspect that for the vast majority of club golfers that ceiling is well above how they play.
The effect of lessons will depend on the quality of the person delivering the lesson and the receptivity of the person taking it and their willingness to work at putting it into practice.

 

[LincolnShep]

Lessons won’t suit everyone , [...]

But they are a great placebo for some

They are also great fun for some.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Never had a lesson , don’t practise , just try diffrent things from watching videos or seeing stuff on the telly

Lessons won’t suit everyone , lessons may improve some but I will always have the belief that everyone has a natural ability ceiling and no matter how much someone practises or has lessons they will never go beyond a certain point - ability and biology stops it

But they are a great placebo for some

I love the way you say you've never had a lesson yet write them off as a placebo for some. I would agree that if you turn up, have the lesson and then don't put the work in then it is a waste of time (and I am sure Bob could see every lesson those that had and hadn't when he taught). Not sure why you say they won't suit everyone (unless it is for the effort as before). I am approaching 60 in a few years and have some injury issues but I still believe I have the capability to improve and so work at my game to do so. I have no idea why you say ability and biology has to stop it. I can improve my ability and I can do stuff to improve my fitness and core to be more resilient to injury.

You have written lessons off on here for years on the basis you don't have them and are happy to try thing on your own

 

[Deleted member 29109]

How many time have we head someone say. I had a lesson but it’s not working. Someone who has a lesson then does absolutely no practice.
Like they are somehow magically going to fix a poor swing.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

All the pro's use coaches. If they, at their standard, are using them then there is probably something in it. Anyone not taking a lesson at some stage, that's your choice, but ...............

 

[Pants]

I've been on this forum for nearly 15 years now Homer, and you have been telling us about your problems and lessons continuously over all this time and yet, you still seem to be in the same place now as you were then. Are you sure that lessons are right for you mate?

 

[Slab]

I practice once or twice a week, but because I don't take lessons I may well be practicing the wrong thing (or at the every least, not practicing the right thing)

I'm a tinkerer, always have been. So even if I had a lesson and practiced that for hours, as soon as it went wrong I'd tinker to get a fix in play

I really enjoy practice though (way more than playing 6/9 holes)

 

[HomerJSimpson]

I've been on this forum for nearly 15 years now Homer, and you have been telling us about your problems and lessons continuously over all this time and yet, you still seem to be in the same place now as you were then. Are you sure that lessons are right for you mate?

My game is better than it has been for years and I am cleaning up quite nicely in the roll ups. have won a monthly stableford (so qualified for the end of season Masters), came 5th in a major really struggling on day one with a back injury. My issue is with short game and having taken advice of some of our top players (including ex-pros) I have changed the short game technique to a more up to date (Dan Grieve) method. It is just taking time to get rid of the years of chocolate frogs in my head and focus on it with clarity

I am happy with my own game, where I am, where its going and how I am getting there and that is all that maters so you can mock as much as you want. I haven't been this glass half full for soooooooooo long and I am going to go with it as long as possible

 

[Slab]

My game is better than it has been for years and I am cleaning up quite nicely in the roll ups. have won a monthly stableford (so qualified for the end of season Masters), came 5th in a major really struggling on day one with a back injury. My issue is with short game and having taken advice of some of our top players (including ex-pros) I have changed the short game technique to a more up to date (Dan Grieve) method. It is just taking time to get rid of the years of chocolate frogs in my head and focus on it with clarity

I am happy with my own game, where I am, where its going and how I am getting there and that is all that maters so you can mock as much as you want. I haven't been this glass half full for soooooooooo long and I am going to go with it as long as possible

Its good that you’re happy (hope it stays that way) but you have to see the validity in what @Pants said

It sounds a wee bit like the main thing all these many many lessons from previous years have given you (in your own words) is "chocolate frogs"

 

[Arthur Wedge]

I suspect there is a natural ability ceiling, but I also suspect that for the vast majority of club golfers that ceiling is well above how they play.
The effect of lessons will depend on the quality of the person delivering the lesson and the receptivity of the person taking it and their willingness to work at putting it into practice.

there will certainly be some out there that don’t realise their potential- and I guess that’s the same in any sport

The issue with golf is time - some really only have a finite amount of time to play the game during the weekend so want to focus on just going on and playing and enjoying where they are

A lot will prob also improve by playing more as well

 

[Arthur Wedge]

They are also great fun for some.

I’m sure there are some who take enjoyment out of lessons ( well apart from the Pro cashing in )

 

[Backache]

there will certainly be some out there that don’t realise their potential- and I guess that’s the same in any sport

The issue with golf is time - some really only have a finite amount of time to play the game during the weekend so want to focus on just going on and playing and enjoying where they are

A lot will prob also improve by playing more as well

Absolutely, there's nothing wrong with enjoying where you are at, and a lot right with it.
I guess the starting point of this thread was people who are unhappy with part of their game to the point where it is off-putting to others playing with them but who make little attempt to put this right.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Its good that you’re happy (hope it stays that way) but you have to see the validity in what @Pants said

It sounds a wee bit like the main thing all these many many lessons from previous years have given you (in your own words) is "chocolate frogs"

Add in the same issue as you and I am a tinkerer especially around all things short game and have been guilty of flipping from one method to another which has simply added another layer of confusion. I am working hard on clearing the debris and having one goal, one method and one objective with my short game which I'll be able to measure with my Arcoss data in time

 

[SteveW86]

Add in the same issue as you and I am a tinkerer especially around all things short game and have been guilty of flipping from one method to another which has simply added another layer of confusion. I am working hard on clearing the debris and having one goal, one method and one objective with my short game which I'll be able to measure with my Arcoss data in time

Will there be a new quest for single figures blog?