Am I on to something?

[Bamberdele21]

Ok, so I’m head scratching a bit. Had a few lessons at start then decided to invest in a set of Cobra RadSpeed One length weapons to get me going. My main reason for my thinking here. Consistency.

Now the problem I’ve been having is my swing is basically the same every time (honestly) but the further down I go in my irons there seems to be an extremely repetitive pattern.

For eg:

All my wedges play perfect
9i is starting to fade.
8i is now a push fade
7i a slice is appearing
6i and 5i god help me it’s a lottery

Now here’s what I’ve noticed. I purchased these clubs thinking everything would be the same except for the lofts. Same length, same weight etc.

Now it’s 4.20am and after 6 months of thinking something ain’t right I have just checked the specs on my irons and noticed the lie angles are all completely different to each other!?

If I’ve got every club the same length, I’m setting up at address the same each shot, my swing is pretty much the same BUT every club has a different lie angle then surely this would explain the shot pattern of every iron used, no?

Please tell me I’m on to something here. I’m hoping to be proved wrong but the way I am seeing it is I’ve been robbed by Cobra with these dodgy lie angles and the last 6 months have been a waste. If it wasn’t for the lie angels I would basically be a scratch golfer by now. How am I meant to be consistent when they change the spec on every iron. It’s like they are moving the goalposts every time I select a different club out the bag.

EDIT: Just realised they are all ‘offset’ from the one another also! What is this offset and lie angle malarkey that is quite clearly holding me back from being the next Tiger Woods

 

[SaintHacker]

Its not the clubs, that I will guarantee...

 

[evemccc]

I guess you’re right.

My advice is to go and buy a brand new set of Taylormade TW irons…Tiger uses them, so you clearly WILL be the new Tiger Woods

 

[sweaty sock]

Does seem wierd they are a different lie angle, theough in fairness the steeper lie angle should create a pull or a draw, so theres a strong argumrnt to say thay are helping you as you go to the longer irons.

The offset is next to nothing, its how far behind the leaging edge of the shaft the leading edge of the face sits. Again this is to stop the slice, so should be helping you.

The major problem with one length is the decending loft. Normally the inreasing shaft length, means you have increasing club head speed to ensure you get enough launch and spin. With low loft and low speed, you are really making it easy to tilt the spin axis, so curve is increased.

So dont worry about lie and offset, particularly if your miss is right.

Now, time is getting to be critical as its getting more and more difficult to rise through county, mini tour, us mini tour, korn ferry, pga win. If you dont get it sorted this week, well say good bye to the masters, which would be a real loss for you and the spectators.

Whats really holding you back is how few custom putters you have, if i were you I'd be searching out a decently rare head cover too, and some cbd something. Glory awaits!

 

[Deleted member 23270]

A 'beginner' talking about lie angles. Love it.

 

[BubbaP]

Swap them out for the King Forged Tec (one length)....

 

[Maninblack4612]

It looks like they just put standard heads into same length shafts i.e. they don't make special heads for the one length irons. This makes no sense & is a lazy, penny pinching practice.

Although the lie angles may be making the lower lofts harder to hit it will be the stronger lofts causing most of the problem. The high lofts go straight because they impart more backspin than sidespin. As the sidespin increases so does the effect of hitting across the ball.

In other words, one length clubs are not the answer.

 

[Ross61]

I have the speedzone version of these. I too wonderEd about the lie angles as I have had problems with the 5 & 6, but not the others.
I worked out that I was subconsciously trying to hit them harder and my timing was going wrong.
Now I concentrate on not forcing the club through.
I now play the whole set well.
Have you also noticed that there are 3 different shaft weights through the set? Perhaps all the combinations are there for a reason.

I was advised to buy the 4 hybrid one length instead of the 4 Iron, but can’t hit it consistently. I have managed to get the 4 Iron now and can hit that really well.

 

[PJ87]

I have the speedzone version of these. I too wonderEd about the lie angles as I have had problems with the 5 & 6, but not the others.
I worked out that I was subconsciously trying to hit them harder and my timing was going wrong.
Now I concentrate on not forcing the club through.
I now play the whole set well.
Have you also noticed that there are 3 different shaft weights through the set? Perhaps all the combinations are there for a reason.

I was advised to buy the 4 hybrid one length instead of the 4 Iron, but can’t hit it consistently. I have managed to get the 4 Iron now and can hit that really well.

Love the hybrids, I play "normal" clubs but one length hybrids ... 4 and 5, brilliant clubs

 

[Ethan]

I see your problem. You bought the 'One length' set. You shoulda bought the 'One lie' set instead. I wouldn't recommend the 'One loft' set, though.

 

[Bdill93]

You never fail to entertain!

4.30am you posted this - what do you do?!

 

[Highslice]

Seems simple to me, just take your irons to a custom fitter to have the lie angles sorted out and then you’ll play all rounds thereafter at level par. What are you waiting for?

 

[jmf1488]

Your swing is the reason the clubs are pushing, fading and slicing. Get onto trackman and the numbers will show you what your doing wrong with each club. The whole point of the one length was so that you could put the ball in the same position and stand the same way and hit it.

 

[Imurg]

If the length of the clubs is the same but the lie angles are different surely you're going to end up with a 15 yard spread shot pattern with the same swing
You can't possibly hope to hit a 37 inch club in the same direction if there is 3° of lie angle difference....
The King Forged 1 length have same length and lie values - why would it be any other way..?

 

[sweaty sock]

1. As MIB said, lazy, profiteering from a golf club manufacturer.

Or

2. Cobra know the vast majority of people buying those clubs will play with a slice, so are doing something to help them. Its an assumption, but its a better assumption than expecting someone who buys a set of GI clubs off a shelf to have a 0 path and 0 clubface...

 

[jim8flog]

The shafts may be one length but are they the same shaft in each club?*

My theoretical take on this is

In a standard set of clubs the kick point moves half an inch away from the head with each club from PW onwards*. This is to maintain the same relative flex (stiff or reg) and to allow for different head weights. As you swing the shaft will bend towards you as well as along the line of flight so each club actually needs a slightly different lie angle as the club will bend more towards you the higher up the shaft the kick point is.

Progressive offset is nothing new and most sets will have it.

*With a standard set this can be seen by how far the first taper step is away from the hosel

 

[sweaty sock]

Notmally its the shafts that make or break a one length set. David Edel and Bryson really blazed a trail on the science on this.

The shorter shafts and decending lofts as you get to the longer irons totally rob you of launch and spin, so the shafts need to progressively add launch and spin as you move to the longer irons. This could be done with a vast combination of bend profile, weight and stiffness, normally headweight is maintained in one length, otherwise the swingweights are miles off!

How that effects toe droop during the swing is a fair point and logically it would line up with more upright angles in the longer clubs, but its so player dependent that it would be impossible for a manufacturer to manage effectively.

To be honest, I'd be suspect about how much thought has went into the mass produced stuff. Id love to get a set on a swingweight scale to investigate!

 

[SimonC]

If anything you should hook the longer irons more if you're looking at lie angles alone as the clubs actually get more upright the further up the bag you go, for example your PW is 62 degrees whereas the 4 iron is 65 degrees. Most sets go the other way, Taylormade P790 for example go from 64 degrees for the PW to 61 degrees for the 4 iron but this should be the case as the clubs are getting longer.

The real reason for the straight(ish) shot turning to a fade/slice will be due to the spin axis & spin loft. Basically as spin loft decreases the spin axis increases hence why the ball will curve more, the higher the spin axis the greater the curvature.

 

[Deleted member 30522]

Its not the clubs, that I will guarantee...

If his lie angles are different on same length clubs, then yes partly it will be

 

[sweaty sock]

About 10 or 15 years ago there was a trend of MOI matching, so making all your clubs 'feel' like your favourite one, normally a 7 or 8. Lengths changed, headweights changed, overall head weights changed, in effect they got very difficult to make for the average punter/clubbuilder who didnt have access to OEM capabilities.

I think this is what Bryson is using, and I think we are all being fobbed off with 'one length' as a bit of a cop out...