WHS Index Scorecard Info

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phils226

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Hi - Ive seen this on a card of a fellow member at my club on the WHS scores profile. I dont understand the 'black boxes' which according to the legend example should be showing as Double bogey or more but clearly are not against the par below. Also what does the asterisk signify? Cheers

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Your club can enter an 'expected score' if none is entered.

Its recommended to be nett par, as a way to stop handicap manipulation.

Ive had some truly awful 'predicted scores'. After i had to quit a round for more important family stuff they put seemingly random numbers in to the system, for example an albatross on a par 5.... when i asked for it to be sorted (I believed nett double bogey was fair as i had no good golfing reason to leave). I was told it was all legit as long as my total gross was in line with my expected performance...

Its another reason I've totally given up hope on the handicaps ability to track performance.

Isn't WHS wonderful.
 

wjemather

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Your club can enter an 'expected score' if none is entered.

Its recommended to be nett par, as a way to stop handicap manipulation.

Ive had some truly awful 'predicted scores'. After i had to quit a round for more important family stuff they put seemingly random numbers in to the system, for example an albatross on a par 5.... when i asked for it to be sorted (I believed nett double bogey was fair as i had no good golfing reason to leave). I was told it was all legit as long as my total gross was in line with my expected performance...

Its another reason I've totally given up hope on the handicaps ability to track performance.

Isn't WHS wonderful.
This is wrong. If 10 or more holes have been started, the only correct procedure is to add net pars (net bogey for the first hole, if 10-14 holes are started) for the holes not started, with the option of a penalty score if the reason for not played those holes is considered invalid. A family emergency would be a valid reason for abandoning a round.

"Expected score" is not a function of WHS; "Most Likely Score" is, but that has not been adopted by CONGU (outside trials in Ireland), and only applies to holes that have been started.

Also, it's probably best not to blame the system for the incompetence of the individuals administering it at your club.
 
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Maybe, but all i can go on is my experience of the system.

Incidentally the experience i explained was performed by the county, I found it unsatisfactory, so asked my club, who advised it as a perfectly acceptable way to add my score.

So back to the original post, why not net double bogey?
 

wjemather

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Hi - Ive seen this on a card of a fellow member at my club on the WHS scores profile. I dont understand the 'black boxes' which according to the legend example should be showing as Double bogey or more but clearly are not against the par below. Also what does the asterisk signify? Cheers

View attachment 38585
The asterisk signifies a hole not started; the figure in brackets is the system assigned score based on the players Course Handicap (i.e. net par because the hole is marked as not started); the double-bogey box is being applied because no score has been recorded for the hole (it reflects the actual score recorded rather than whatever counts for handicapping).
 
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Ok so is this the likely scenario

Player plays 18 holes
Picks up or no returns 2 holes
Adds his score to the computer with "0" in the NR holes
Computer assumes for handicap purposes that as more than 10 holes have been played, net par is the expected score because as far as it knows, they have not been attempted.
Assuming the round is a medal, then NR is the competition result, but net pars are used to calculate handicap?
 
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Possibly..... but if a player simply enters nothing (by putting a zero in or a dot or just hitting return key for that hole)...then a nett double bogey will be assumed by the system.

However....if a player specifically marks a hole as "not played" or "not started" (Score returning systems/apps should have the option for someone to differentiate between a hole that was not started and one that the player picked up on) then the system will record it as a nett par or a nett bogey depending on how many holes have been played - as explained in post #4.

The person entering the scores must be able to differentiate between a hole that is picked up on and a hole that has not been started.
 
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phils226

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Hi - thanks for the great feedback as I didn't know this. I know this was a Stableford Competition and I can see no points were awarded and the scenario is exactly as 'Sweaty Sock' states above. Just odd that a net par taken rather than a net double bogey which is much more likely to be nearer the double bogey + 1 that I would have expected. Would this be the same for a medal of if picked up then is it a par + five shots?
 
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Yes it is the same for medal....for handicapping purposes (once a player has a handicap) any hole where you pick up will still be counted as a nett double bogey and any hole that you do not start will be nett bogey or nett par.

The par +5 shots is only relevant when submitting cards for initial handicap allocation.
 

wjemather

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Ok so is this the likely scenario

Player plays 18 holes
Picks up or no returns 2 holes
Adds his score to the computer with "0" in the NR holes
Computer assumes for handicap purposes that as more than 10 holes have been played, net par is the expected score because as far as it knows, they have not been attempted.
Assuming the round is a medal, then NR is the competition result, but net pars are used to calculate handicap?
"The computer" does not assume anything. WHS simply takes whatever has been input (usually by the player) and applies the appropriate adjustments.

Some ISV systems (e.g. ClubV1/howdidido, IG, HM/MS, etc.) will prompt when zeros are entered to confirm the status of the hole (not started/not completed). If zeros are sent through to WHS, it reads them as "started but not completed" and assigns net double-bogeys; asterisks would need to be entered for holes not started (different ISVs facilitate this in different ways), and WHS would then assign net pars (with par+1 for the first hole if 10-14 holes are started).

Hi - thanks for the great feedback as I didn't know this. I know this was a Stableford Competition and I can see no points were awarded and the scenario is exactly as 'Sweaty Sock' states above. Just odd that a net par taken rather than a net double bogey which is much more likely to be nearer the double bogey + 1 that I would have expected. Would this be the same for a medal of if picked up then is it a par + five shots?
In your example, I strongly suspect that the hole scores in question have simply been input incorrectly as "not started" instead of "not completed".
 

jim8flog

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Ok so is this the likely scenario

Player plays 18 holes
Picks up or no returns 2 holes
Adds his score to the computer with "0" in the NR holes
Computer assumes for handicap purposes that as more than 10 holes have been played, net par is the expected score because as far as it knows, they have not been attempted.
Assuming the round is a medal, then NR is the competition result, but net pars are used to calculate handicap?
as per wjemather

Intelligent Golf has entry 'keys' for NR (a hole started but not completed) and NS (a hole not started) and it is important for golfers to use the correct key.
 
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