When Does a Club Take Action

[Hobbit]

This isn't the case though is it???

You don't know how he'll play the remaining holes do you. You make a decision mid-round, and you haven't a scooby how it will play out. You have a good idea, and in most cases you'll be right.But what do you do if his nett score is 72, just outside the prizes but enough to affect h'cap changes?

 

[swingking]

You don't know how he'll play the remaining holes do you. You make a decision mid-round, and you haven't a scooby how it will play out. You have a good idea, and in most cases you'll be right.But what do you do if his nett score is 72, just outside the prizes but enough to affect h'cap changes?

Your right, no-one knows how he'll play the remaining holes but one things for sure changing the weights in his driver is going to make no difference. Its just like someone coming out of the bushes and giving him a big water bottle with a label that says 'golf juice that will make you tiger woods' My point is that by changing his weights gives him no unfair advantage whatsoever.

 

[la_lucha]

Your right, no-one knows how he'll play the remaining holes but one things for sure changing the weights in his driver is going to make no difference. Its just like someone coming out of the bushes and giving him a big water bottle with a label that says 'golf juice that will make you tiger woods' My point is that by changing his weights gives him no unfair advantage whatsoever.

On what basis can you make that statement?

 

[Kellfire]

If I allowed my FC to alter his driver, I could be DQ as well for allowing it...

So should I have been DQ for not informing the committee that I was asked the question?

aka is asking to "cheat" tantamount to cheating?

 

[jamielaing]

Your right, no-one knows how he'll play the remaining holes but one things for sure changing the weights in his driver is going to make no difference. Its just like someone coming out of the bushes and giving him a big water bottle with a label that says 'golf juice that will make you tiger woods' My point is that by changing his weights gives him no unfair advantage whatsoever.

Surely if he wanted to try out the different weights as he is so out of it he could NR and do this? If it is going to give him no advantage and he is going up 0.1 anyway then that is his answer. Otherwise he is cheating if that card goes in.

 

[North Mimms]

A former Brabazon trophy winner and a Ryder Cup player always love to retell the story of me hiding in bushes watching them as 12/13 year old's who were coming in with 'unbelievable' scores.

Hiding in bushes watching 12 year olds is never a good idea:ears:

 

[Khamelion]

There's a mother of bandits at our club and the club wont do anything about it. I have attached a photo of his score card for the order of merit final (big prizes) i predicted the winner in the club house amongst fellow finalists and i was told to wind my neck in. Can anyone guess what tee he was stood on when he was told that he physically couldn't loose with the score he had???? Dark blue is a blob

He plays off 24 and was a 3/4 handicap comp in brutal conditions. He won with 35 points and i come second with 28 points (thats how hard the course was playing)

Any chance you could make the image bigger, or say what the SI is of the last four holes he blobbed? Surely for HC purposes he should still score 2 over net max, as per clause 19.

@Swingking, Yes rules maybe open to interpretation, but Golf is the only game where you can be true to yourself and honest to your playing partners. Yes during bounce games when practicing, I'll give myself favourable lies, I'm not playing to practice moving the ball 6 feet from out from under the shrubbery. However during comp rounds I play to the rules, I've not won a comp yet, but when I do, I want to knowing it was the best round I played, in a honest and legal manner. Last year I double hit a chip from the greenside, I called that on myself, even though no one else had seen it.

If you're playing in comps, amateur or Pro, you have to play with integrity and honesty, if you don't, then don't enter competitions.

 

[Foxholer]

Your right, no-one knows how he'll play the remaining holes but one things for sure changing the weights in his driver is going to make no difference. Its just like someone coming out of the bushes and giving him a big water bottle with a label that says 'golf juice that will make you tiger woods' My point is that by changing his weights gives him no unfair advantage whatsoever.

But it's simply against the Rules! And he/you should know that - or at least be told that it is. Sandy Lyles DQ for putting sticking plaster on his (shiny, reflective) putter (to stop the glare) is another example. Simon Dyson's DQ and the subsequent kerfuffle for his aberarnt repair of a spike-mark another. Or Rory's swishing of sand from the fringe (legal if it was on the green). None really affect scoring, but against the Rules. Old, non-conforming Drivers in competitions or use of a phone that can measure wind speed or slope. The list of seemingly trivial, but illegal acts or devices that don't really have any effect on the player's score is pretty long!

But one of the fundamental tenets of Golf (except in bounce games) is that the rules are self-policed and players honestly apply (all of) them. If that is ignored, then much of the magic of the game is lost imo!

 

[NorfolkShaun]

I have to say that scorecard does look iffy but how did he find out he had done enough to win? this maybe one of the problems if people know what they need before a round is finished.

We have a yearly order or merit at our club that runs through the summer, at the AGM this year it was announced that the top 15 only had one player in it who was top 15 last year, followed by the comment handicap secretary take note (in jest I add)

Normally if you play around handicap you are close to the top and 40 points would normally win easily, we do seem fortunate that people are generally quite honest and playing of realistic handicaps.

 

[duncan mackie]

Any chance you could make the image bigger, or say what the SI is of the last four holes he blobbed? Surely for HC purposes he should still score 2 over net max, as per clause 19.

@Swingking, Yes rules maybe open to interpretation, but Golf is the only game where you can be true to yourself and honest to your playing partners. Yes during bounce games when practicing, I'll give myself favourable lies, I'm not playing to practice moving the ball 6 feet from out from under the shrubbery. However during comp rounds I play to the rules, I've not won a comp yet, but when I do, I want to knowing it was the best round I played, in a honest and legal manner. Last year I double hit a chip from the greenside, I called that on myself, even though no one else had seen it.

If you're playing in comps, amateur or Pro, you have to play with integrity and honesty, if you don't, then don't enter competitions.

that would be the case in medal play ie he would be awarded the lowest score that gave him a blob - however that already happens in stableford ie a blob is a blob!

as to the rest of your post; totally agree, and many others around the world do exactly the same. this of course can result in interesting comments in the bar when individuals are 'observed' improving their lie....the context can be lost from 200 yds even if the 'crime' is clearly seen!

 

[HomerJSimpson]

It's always an emotive subject and never nice when there is an air of suspicion over a playing partner or member. It needs handling with sensitivity unless there is irrefutable proof in which case it needs to be taken to the right sources and let them deal with it. There is no leeway and so the example of a PP changing driver weights, if in a competitive game, is against the rules and he must be told he can't do so, irrespective of how it performs after if the change is made regardless.

The club is always in a tough scenario unless there is bags of evidence. I like the way most on here will deal with the unfortunate scenario, including the bad counters.

 

[hovis]

I have to say that scorecard does look iffy but how did he find out he had done enough to win? this maybe one of the problems if people know what they need before a round is finished.
.

His best friend was in my group and told him on the tee as we was waiting for the green to clear. There was only 3 groups as it was top 12 that qualified.

 

[NorfolkShaun]

His best friend was in my group and told him on the tee as we was waiting for the green to clear. There was only 3 groups as it was top 12 that qualified.

While I guess this is not against the rules it does not really seem in the spirit.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

While I guess this is not against the rules it does not really seem in the spirit.

Hence why calling him a cheat and even saying it to his face imo is not on

He could have just folded when he realised he had won and lost concentration etc

 

[NorfolkShaun]

Hence why calling him a cheat and even saying it to his face imo is not on

He could have just folded when he realised he had won and lost concentration etc

Could be I guess, I kind of meant him finding out the score being against the spirit.

One of the parts I love is waiting for the results to see what is needed not sure it would feel right if I found out on the 15th tee that I needed 4 points to win for example

 

[hovis]

Hence why calling him a cheat and even saying it to his face imo is not on

He could have just folded when he realised he had won and lost concentration etc

Its ok phil, he didn't look too bothered as he collected his pair off ecco's and his 2 night stay and 2 rounds of golf at worburn voucher.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Its ok phil, he didn't look too bothered as he collected his pair off ecco's and his 2 night stay and 2 rounds of golf at worburn voucher.

Has he broken any rules ?

 

[hovis]

Has he broken any rules ?

Bore off phil. Your like a broken record

 

[Siren]

No this is just my point. 36 wont win a comp. But it usually places you around 4th or 5th. This would get you 5 or 6 merit points to qualify for the merit final ( top 12) so by shooting a preserving 36 you makes the final and then you walk it. The prize was a weekend stay at woburn with two rounds of golf

And he couldn't get a cut as it was a 3/4 handicap comp

Why wouldnt your Handicap secretary/manager cut someone consistently scoring 36 points in 3/4 handicap competition? Surely that comes under General play?

 

[Simbo]

When I first joined my club I reached the final,of the greensomes which I played with my dad, he's been a member for donkey's years. Someone approached us and told us to keep,an eye on the pair we were playing. As they had been brought to the attention of the club for cheating. Nothing really happened that I saw during the match. However last season one of the aforementioned guys was playing our second which runs parallel to 17, the 3 guys coming down 17 heard a shout of fore from this guy and his ball landed in the trees separating the fairways, they saw his ball finish behind one of the trees with the tree in a direct line between his ball and the green. When they realised who it was they walked further down 17 and stopped to watch him at which point they saw him stand behind his ball pretending to try and look for a line to the green when he used the back of his club to push the ball a couple of feet to the side. 2 of them made a written complaint which the club acted upon. Listened to both sides of the story. The verdict was the guy being banned from the club for 3 months.
For a club to take action there's needs to be pretty good evidence from at least 2 people who are prepared to go through the drama and hassle of reporting the suspect, sadly which the majority of golfers can't or won't do it, they much prefer just to say nothing to the chest at the time then go and moan and bitch about it to their mates or on forums!!