What would you have done/what should I have done?

[louise_a]

I was just thinkig about the comp we played on Sunday. One one hole my playing partner's ball settled in front of a small sign in in the ground, she immediately picked up her ball and dropped it to the side.
I queried this and said she should have removed the sign, it was easily lifted. She said she thought the sign was fixed and so entitled to a free drop.

she is a long standing member playing off 8 so I said no more and she played the ball from where she had dropped it, a slightly easier position. She then got down in 2 for a par.

At thew end of the day she beat me to 3rd prize on a card playoff.

Now what should I have done? should I have told her to add a shot forthe unnecessary drop or was she allowed the drop.

Being pretty new to rules I was at a loss and bowed to her opinion.

 

[DCB]

Well, I'd have thought that a small sign was a 'movable obstruction' and she should have taken it out of the ground and played the shot as it lay.

However, if the sign was fixed, say into concrete, she may have been correct. Did she mark the ball before lifting it ? If not then that opens up another can of worms in 20-1 with a likely 2 stroke penalty and if not applied should have been a DQ.

 

[louise_a]

no it was just pushed into the grass, i lifted it easily. She didnt mark it first either.

 

[Region3]

I thought that marking the ball prior to a drop was only 'recommended' and not required. Most likely wrong though.

As for a penalty, would it be one for moving the ball plus another one for playing from the wrong place?

Sometimes there are local rules saying that certain objects are to be treated as immovable obstructions when they would otherwise be moveable, but I wouldn't have thought that would apply to a small sign.

 

[Twire]

If it was a movable obstruction then she should have moved that and not the ball, if it wasn't she should have marked her ball, found the nearest point of relief, marked her drop zone, then dropped.

 

[ForeRighty]

Me personally I wouldn't have a problem with this however, if this was a big comp somebody else may have been in the same position and lifted the sign out therefore it's Apples and Oranges not Apples and Apples and a shot penalty should have been applied.

 

[bobmac]

she immediately picked up her ball and dropped it to the side.

What she should have done is call you over and explain to you what she intends to do by the rules. You can then discuss the rule without first touching the ball. Then if she's right, fine. If not, she hasn't touched the ball so no penalty.
By doing what she did, she almost forces you into agreeing with what she's done, especially being the more experienced golfer.

 

[louise_a]

By doing what she did, she almost forces you into agreeing with what she's done, especially being the more experienced golfer.

Which is exactly how I felt Bob.

 

[pbrown7582]

You would expect an expierienced single figure player to know what she is doing so it is very hard to question her actions.
You would hope its out of rules ignorance rather than trying to get an easier chip.
Maybe bring the issue of moveable signs up with a committee informally for clarification that there is no local rule.

 

[bladeplayer]

As aquward as it may be Louise you are kinda obliged to bring it up , if your not sure you may say something like

"i thought under the rules you should ....." ,

I do apreciate its not easy thing to do but unfortunatly its gota be done , & id also explain to her youd apreciate not been put in that position again , mayb thats why she is off 8 ha ..

Seems to me it was done through not knowing the rule tho , she probably would have had a shot if she had just moved the sign anyway ..

 

[chrisd]

What she should have done is call you over and explain to you what she intends to do by the rules. You can then discuss the rule without first touching the ball. Then if she's right, fine. If not, she hasn't touched the ball so no penalty.
By doing what she did, she almost forces you into agreeing with what she's done, especially being the more experienced golfer.

That's my view too!

 

[SocketRocket]

The first position is to understand local rules appertaining to moveable and immovable obstructions, they are often marked on the scorecard. I agree that your opponent should have discussed it with you first.

Did she get any real advantage from dropping the ball? If the lie was similar then I guess I would have let it go.

 

[chrisd]

Having looked at the rules, if she had acted correctly she would be entitled to a free drop/ move the sign, so I feel that either way no harm was done and to penalise her imo would be harsh.

 

[bladeplayer]

Did she get any real advantage from dropping the ball? If the lie was similar then I guess I would have let it go.

Having looked at the rules, if she had acted correctly she would be entitled to a free drop/ move the sign, so I feel that either way no harm was done and to penalise her imo would be harsh.

So just for the record , on the next hole she chips in to a couple of inches with her 3rd shot , no question a dead cert gimme , picks the ball up & signs for a 4 , no harm done , no real advantage gained as we agree it would have been a 4 .. is that ok aswell ?

 

[sydney greenstreet]

Sounds like she broke a rule ! not moving the moveable obstruction, then lifting and dropping without marking. 2 mistakes combined into 1 ?

 

[Oddsocks]

i always carry this in my bag for occassions just like this, unfortunately on my point i lost our winter singles final on a penalty that i called on myself incorrectly.

http://www.weekend-golfer.com/golf-etiquette/golf-rules-made-easy.html

This book trims off half the bullcrap that is lost in the R&A version, a quick reference rules for dummies as it were. i dont think any golf playing in a comp shouldnt have one in their bag. Small, cheap and simple...

 

[Mattyboy]

She should jhave asked whoever was marking her card first (as has ben said). Then there wouldnt be an awkward situation. I would guess she didnt like the lie of the ball close to the sign and went for the assumptive free drop.

 

[Andy808]

Last summer I had the opposite happen. My ball landed between a tree and a sign (imoveable object). I didn't know the rule on this that well and my playing partners said I had to take a penalty drop. I did and lost the comp on count back. Turned out a few weeks later that I should have had a free drop and should have won the comp in theory.
That's life when your still learning the ruled I suppose.

 

[muttleee]

You would expect an expierienced single figure player to know what she is doing

Not necessarily. Being good at golf doesn't automatically mean you also know the rules. I've seen instances on TV where even the pros have got it wrong.

 

[Oddsocks]

it still amazes me how badly 90% of golfers know the rules (me included) we have a guy at our club who knows the rules inside out, rather like rosecott on here, hes a great oplaying partner for team events.

*Note to self, learn the rules better.