Teachers/coaches

[incatrekker]

Hi all, I’m new here but not to golf. I have recently been listening to some of the “top” celebrity coaches and their theories on the swing and thought I’d add my experience.
The best coaches can assess your swing and abilities quickly then develop a practice drill that gives you the correct “feeling” for what you’re trying to improve. Just telling you is not good enough, we have to experience what “correct” feels like to improve. Major changes take hundreds of hours of practice! Spending time finding a coach you understand pays huge dividends.

What are your experiences of teachers?

 

[ScienceBoy]

The best explanation I have found is Chris Ryan Golf on YouTube.

He has a really good way of explaining the golf swing without resorting to weird “techniques” and jargon.

 

[bobmac]

Yeah people learn differently, so a good coach should be able to adapt his delivery to get the point across.

The PGA training course recognises that people learn by visual, audio or kinetic methods.
So the golfer learns best by watching demonstrations, listening to instruction or by being physically placed into positions by the pro.
The trainee pro is taught by asking a few questions how to work out which method their pupil prefers and will use that preferred method during the lesson.
But of course the trainee pro also prefers to teach in a certain way so for example, a visual pro will have more success with a visual pupil.

 

[jonny1409]

Hi all, I’m new here but not to golf. I have recently been listening to some of the “top” celebrity coaches and their theories on the swing and thought I’d add my experience.
The best coaches can assess your swing and abilities quickly then develop a practice drill that gives you the correct “feeling” for what you’re trying to improve. Just telling you is not good enough, we have to experience what “correct” feels like to improve. Major changes take hundreds of hours of practice! Spending time finding a coach you understand pays huge dividends.

What are your experiences of teachers?

100% agree with this.

The guy I've recently had lessons with is huge on this and my biggest issue is the difference between "Feel vs Real" and we're working hard on that.
Obviously it'll take time, but I feel I'm getting there and can actually "feel" the differences myself at times.

 

[incatrekker]

The best explanation I have found is Chris Ryan Golf on YouTube.

He has a really good way of explaining the golf swing without resorting to weird “techniques” and jargon.

It was YouTube that made me realise that the language used was critically important to understanding. I have different gurus on there for different aspects of the game.

 

[Biggleswade Blue]

Video is so helpful. My recent lesson adjusted various set-up issues - and I could look at the video clip comparison to my original setup after each shot, so that I learnt how what I was aiming for "felt". Pro then used words to explain what we were adjusting, whilst showing me on the video what the words meant (hitting inside, over the top etc) which meant that as the lesson went on, when he said something, I knew exactly what he was meaning.

On the practice ground I can now take the time to recreate that feeling without the pressure of rushing to play a shot.

 

[incatrekker]

Video is so helpful. My recent lesson adjusted various set-up issues - and I could look at the video clip comparison to my original setup after each shot, so that I learnt how what I was aiming for "felt". Pro then used words to explain what we were adjusting, whilst showing me on the video what the words meant (hitting inside, over the top etc) which meant that as the lesson went on, when he said something, I knew exactly what he was meaning.

On the practice ground I can now take the time to recreate that feeling without the pressure of rushing to play a shot.

That’s a great combination and clearly working for you!
Last summer a friend told me he was really struggling with bunkers, he couldn’t get out and was now scared when facing a bunker shot. His solution was to buy a new 60 degree sand iron. No improvement. As we restarted after lockdown we played 9 holes together and he got in 5 bunkers. He never got out of the first 4, then picked up from the 5th. I asked if he’d had a lesson and he said 2 or 3 but no help. So we went to the practice bunker where I showed him the technique. No improvement. Then I realised he could easily play a flop shot over the bunker, so I told him to use that feeling in the bunker.
Lo and behold out it came! He’s never failed to get out first time since.
Lessons: 1) New club isn’t the solution 2) once he could feel the shot he could repeat it in a different situation.

 

[ScienceBoy]

It was YouTube that made me realise that the language used was critically important to understanding. I have different gurus on there for different aspects of the game.

Absolutely, when you look at a lot of the golf tuition they are not teaching that much of a different thing but the way the explain it, what they call it and how they visualise it is hugely different.

In the end they all aim to do the same thing, deliver the club to the ball so the ball goes straight and far. There really is only one set of physics at play here.

What drives all these different approaches is the fact what we see, what we feel and what we do are all hugely separated. The different “techniques” or “swings” are just looking to reduce the gap between those three in the way they think is best.

 

[incatrekker]

Absolutely, when you look at a lot of the golf tuition they are not teaching that much of a different thing but the way the explain it, what they call it and how they visualise it is hugely different.

In the end they all aim to do the same thing, deliver the club to the ball so the ball goes straight and far. There really is only one set of physics at play here.

What drives all these different approaches is the fact what we see, what we feel and what we do are all hugely separated. The different “techniques” or “swings” are just looking to reduce the gap between those three in the way they think is best.

Indeed, and nothing brings this home more than a comparison of David Leadbetter’s book which is almost identical to the James Braid “Advanced Golf” published in 1908! Who made the most money from that...

 

[Sairamtim]

I have had a few lessons with different coaches and by and large I feel most golf coaches are average to poor.
There is a lack of structure to what they do, not enough assessment, no measurables taken to judge performance etc etc.
All of them are capable of looking at your swing and going ‘you’ve come over the top’ and improving you in that lesson.
Where I feel many lack is what happens after that.
A great coach should initially assess your game, work out where the biggest weaknesses are and then plan a schedule to improve this. Theybshould also designs method of measuring your skills so you can see the improvement over time. Lastly, they should also set homework for you to do in your own time. Most just turn up and go through the motions I think. mid I was a golf coach I would make my pupils use a specific app which gives you statistics about your game and then go from there.

 

[Biggleswade Blue]

I have had a few lessons with different coaches and by and large I feel most golf coaches are average to poor.
There is a lack of structure to what they do, not enough assessment, no measurables taken to judge performance etc etc.
All of them are capable of looking at your swing and going ‘you’ve come over the top’ and improving you in that lesson.
Where I feel many lack is what happens after that.
A great coach should initially assess your game, work out where the biggest weaknesses are and then plan a schedule to improve this. Theybshould also designs method of measuring your skills so you can see the improvement over time. Lastly, they should also set homework for you to do in your own time. Most just turn up and go through the motions I think. mid I was a golf coach I would make my pupils use a specific app which gives you statistics about your game and then go from there.

I'm clearly lucky then. I've just embarked on a series of six lessons which began with an email from me to the coach about what I felt I needed to improve, then a pre-lesson chat talking through how we would be doing that.

 

[ScienceBoy]

I'm clearly lucky then. I've just embarked on a series of six lessons which began with an email from me to the coach about what I felt I needed to improve, then a pre-lesson chat talking through how we would be doing that.

Make sure you end that with a course playing lesson, I used to buy a pack of 6 lessons and had the option to trade the last two for a playing lesson. It was ALWAYS worth the trade as we worked up to the lesson on the course in the preceding 4 lessons. I would do a lesson every 2-3 weeks so the whole series took near 3 months. When done I booked it in again for the next 3 months! The return in improvement was well worth it.

 

[Deleted member 1147]

The best explanation I have found is Chris Ryan Golf on YouTube.

He has a really good way of explaining the golf swing without resorting to weird “techniques” and jargon.

A good teaching pro, he got me down from 10 to 5.
I only saw him a few times a year due to distance to the Belfry, which is where he used to work. Now at Forest of Arden.

 

[incatrekker]

I have had a few lessons with different coaches and by and large I feel most golf coaches are average to poor.
There is a lack of structure to what they do, not enough assessment, no measurables taken to judge performance etc etc.
All of them are capable of looking at your swing and going ‘you’ve come over the top’ and improving you in that lesson.
Where I feel many lack is what happens after that.
A great coach should initially assess your game, work out where the biggest weaknesses are and then plan a schedule to improve this. Theybshould also designs method of measuring your skills so you can see the improvement over time. Lastly, they should also set homework for you to do in your own time. Most just turn up and go through the motions I think. mid I was a golf coach I would make my pupils use a specific app which gives you statistics about your game and then go from there.

I think that’s quite a common viewpoint on coaches. I guess one of the issues of golf improvement is that ultimately it’s down to the hard work of the player. I agree the follow up homework is lacking, particularly as practice is usually done in isolation. It’s very easy when practicing to be distracted from the core issue requiring remedy. I usually get someone to come with me. I tell my practice buddy what I’m working on and all I want is him to keep me focussed.
It’s hard in golf to assess progress on a specific element. A progress schedule from the Pro would be so productive.

 

[Biggleswade Blue]

Make sure you end that with a course playing lesson, I used to buy a pack of 6 lessons and had the option to trade the last two for a playing lesson. It was ALWAYS worth the trade as we worked up to the lesson on the course in the preceding 4 lessons. I would do a lesson every 2-3 weeks so the whole series took near 3 months. When done I booked it in again for the next 3 months! The return in improvement was well worth it.

That was exactly what my coach recommended. I came to him usually taking about 100 strokes round a course, able to hit a ball, and likely off about 30 handicap, and him having seen me play a bit in some low key group lessons (parent and junior, more focused really on the junior). Intent is after the first few lessons to start putting in some handicap cards, ready to get my formal handicap by mid November when I will be eligible to play in competitions. The first first few lessons are about improving my mechanics, moving on to improving my skills with different types of shot (including short games, putting etc) and finishing off with a course lesson to look at my decision making. My lessons are going to be every three weeks or so which gives me time in between to work on what we covered. That frequency was already what I intended, but before I raised it he specifically said he does not advocate more frequent lessons for someone in my position.

 

[incatrekker]

That was exactly what my coach recommended. I came to him usually taking about 100 strokes round a course, able to hit a ball, and likely off about 30 handicap, and him having seen me play a bit in some low key group lessons (parent and junior, more focused really on the junior). Intent is after the first few lessons to start putting in some handicap cards, ready to get my formal handicap by mid November when I will be eligible to play in competitions. The first first few lessons are about improving my mechanics, moving on to improving my skills with different types of shot (including short games, putting etc) and finishing off with a course lesson to look at my decision making. My lessons are going to be every three weeks or so which gives me time in between to work on what we covered. That frequency was already what I intended, but before I raised it he specifically said he does not advocate more frequent lessons for someone in my position.

Agreed. The other great thing about a playing lesson is you get to see how a good player approaches each shot, especially their thought process, which is a whole other aspect of golf. Poor thinking causes as many poor scores as poor shot execution!

 

[Biggleswade Blue]

Agreed. The other great thing about a playing lesson is you get to see how a good player approaches each shot, especially their thought process, which is a whole other aspect of golf. Poor thinking causes as many poor scores as poor shot execution!

Yes. One of the things that I have enjoyed about my recent club membership that I had not really thought about is playing with better players. One of my pals is in the scratch team playing off 5-6, and it is good to watch how he plays the game. I have to learn though to have the presence of mind to make decisions that suit me, rather than try and copy/match him. It's easy, for example, on a long par 4, knowing that he'll be on in 2, trying to leather a miracle second shot 3 wood from a slightly ropey lie to match him, rather than take a nice easy hybrid or 5 iron to lay up and use my shots. I find it much easier to make better decisions playing with a similar ability player, and need to learn not to try and match the good players (though of course it is fun when you take something on and it works). Nonetheless, watching him take his medicine when it is called for is also a good lesson, and his encouragement and guidance is welcomed.

 

[incatrekker]

That was exactly what my coach recommended. I came to him usually taking about 100 strokes round a course, able to hit a ball, and likely off about 30 handicap, and him having seen me play a bit in some low key group lessons (parent and junior, more focused really on the junior). Intent is after the first few lessons to start putting in some handicap cards, ready to get my formal handicap by mid November when I will be eligible to play in competitions. The first first few lessons are about improving my mechanics, moving on to improving my skills with different types of shot (including short games, putting etc) and finishing off with a course lesson to look at my decision making. My lessons are going to be every three weeks or so which gives me time in between to work on what we covered. That frequency was already what I intended, but before I raised it he specifically said he does not advocate more frequent lessons for someone in my position.

That sounds like a great approach and well thought out improvement plan. I usually try to have a practice buddy to make sure I focus on MY plan. I treat each shot as my only shot so do the whole shot routine including setup, alignment and practice swing. Hitting ball after ball without the prep for each shot can be Counter productive.

 

[incatrekker]

Yes. One of the things that I have enjoyed about my recent club membership that I had not really thought about is playing with better players. One of my pals is in the scratch team playing off 5-6, and it is good to watch how he plays the game. I have to learn though to have the presence of mind to make decisions that suit me, rather than try and copy/match him. It's easy, for example, on a long par 4, knowing that he'll be on in 2, trying to leather a miracle second shot 3 wood from a slightly ropey lie to match him, rather than take a nice easy hybrid or 5 iron to lay up and use my shots. I find it much easier to make better decisions playing with a similar ability player, and need to learn not to try and match the good players (though of course it is fun when you take something on and it works). Nonetheless, watching him take his medicine when it is called for is also a good lesson, and his encouragement and guidance is welcomed.

Absolutely correct. In our regular roll ups I ask each player on every shot to talk me through their plan for their next shot. I don’t always comment because the act of having to verbally plan the shot usually makes them think more than they normally would about their shot. It’s kind of self help!

 

[incatrekker]

Absolutely correct. In our regular roll ups I ask each player on every shot to talk me through their plan for their next shot. I don’t always comment because the act of having to verbally plan the shot usually makes them think more than they normally would about their shot. It’s kind of self help!

I think it was Jack Nicklaus who said he never attempted a shot he hadn’t already practiced and mastered. Good advice that...