Swing speed v back swing

[Wolf]

Read an article a number of years ago that talked about fast muscles and slow muscles. Yes, there’s an element of strength involved but it’s also about how quickly certain muscle sets react.

If you think about different sprinters and the times they run, and even the same sprinter seeing their times come down through a season. It’s the speed of the muscle that generates the speed of movement of the legs.

It’s the ability to move quickly that generates swing speed. Add a bit more strength and it’ll go a bit further.

Think about prop forwards. More muscle than you can shake a leg at but slow compared to a winger.

Pretty much hits a nail on the head that, there are different types of muscle fibres named Type 1 (slow twitch) and type 2 (fast twitch) and you can train both depending what your your use is for them. E. G a marathon runner will train for a lot of type 1 fibres for endurance hence their slight frames and a sprinter will go for a lot of type 2 fibres for explosive power hence the rounder muscle bellies they create in arma, legs and shoulders. Type 2 muscle energy is expended quicker as it's used for explosive power and not sustained effort. Hence the reason someone like Brooks can be built like a tank and still play golf, or Finau can be physically strong, remain flexible, allied to good technique and Bomb it using a shorter swing as the muscles are primed for explosive power.

There's a whole science to the energy systems used as well of ATP, CP etc but essentially train to get stronger along with flexibility, take some golf lessons for good technique and voila you have the ideal conditions for creating power and big drives. Though you still need to have talent to be any good at the game.

That's why so many pros have strength and conditioning coaches these days

 

[harpo_72]

Pretty much hits a nail on the head that, there are different types of muscle fibres named Type 1 (slow twitch) and type 2 (fast twitch) and you can train both depending what your your use is for them. E. G a marathon runner will train for a lot of type 1 fibres for endurance hence their slight frames and a sprinter will go for a lot of type 2 fibres for explosive power hence the rounder muscle bellies they create in arma, legs and shoulders. Type 2 muscle energy is expended quicker as it's used for explosive power and not sustained effort. Hence the reason someone like Brooks can be built like a tank and still play golf, or Finau can be physically strong, remain flexible, allied to good technique and Bomb it using a shorter swing as the muscles are primed for explosive power.

There's a whole science to the energy systems used as well of ATP, CP etc but essentially train to get stronger along with flexibility, take some golf lessons for good technique and voila you have the ideal conditions for creating power and big drives. Though you still need to have talent to be any good at the game.

That's why so many pros have strength and conditioning coaches these days

this is so true, it's determining what you are.
But also to consider the achilles heal of these muscles.
Perhaps and I am not saying it is the case, but if you get too quick or are quick, there is an opportunity to get over the top if the back swing is too long. By shortening it you reduce the risk.
For me the power in the golf swing actually is in the follow through. If you just hit the ball your decelerating, but if you hit through it your not - so getting that feeling of going through and hitting yourself on the follow through is key. (easy to type and say )
I have been really struggling this year my yardages have been shocking for the effort. I have realised I am dishing out glancing blows and I have been trying to get that through the ball feeling going. Have I shortened my swing? No, but I am pretty sure I never was Daly like and I don't think I ever got to parallel to target. What I did do when I was good was get through the ball with a full shoulder turn.

 

[Jacko_G]

Ronan Rafferty won the European Tour OoM and he had a very short back swing.

And a baseball grip.

 

[Orikoru]

I shortened my backswing a while ago (probably 18 months to two years now) and I didn't notice any loss of distance. The positive effect was that I starting striking the ball better more consistently, and that in turn was most likely the reason I didn't lose any distance. I've got so used to swinging that way that if I went back to having the club parallel at the top it would probably feel like I was overswinging wildly. New playing partners often comment that it looks like I'm only taking a half swing every time. The older guys usually say things like "wow - you still get it out there with that short punchy swing". (I say older guys because I wouldn't be considered a long hitter against anyone else of course.)

In terms of how far back I swing, it's probably similar to Finau with his driver, except I don't get as much wrist hinge or lag as he does. I imagine my club is pointing near enough straight upwards when I start my downswing.

 

[Dibby]

Pretty much hits a nail on the head that, there are different types of muscle fibres named Type 1 (slow twitch) and type 2 (fast twitch) and you can train both depending what your your use is for them. E. G a marathon runner will train for a lot of type 1 fibres for endurance hence their slight frames and a sprinter will go for a lot of type 2 fibres for explosive power hence the rounder muscle bellies they create in arma, legs and shoulders. Type 2 muscle energy is expended quicker as it's used for explosive power and not sustained effort. Hence the reason someone like Brooks can be built like a tank and still play golf, or Finau can be physically strong, remain flexible, allied to good technique and Bomb it using a shorter swing as the muscles are primed for explosive power.

There's a whole science to the energy systems used as well of ATP, CP etc but essentially train to get stronger along with flexibility, take some golf lessons for good technique and voila you have the ideal conditions for creating power and big drives. Though you still need to have talent to be any good at the game.

That's why so many pros have strength and conditioning coaches these days

So just to tack onto this, people regularly confuse strength, size and power - yes, in general, these are interrelated and have some correlation, but there are subtle differences.

The analogy of the rugby prop and winger was a great one to relate to the golf swing. It might surprise some people but some props are faster than wingers at top speed in a straight line. However, the winger is quicker to accelerate to their top speed and to change speed and direction. In a race down the pitch, the winger has made such a gap by reaching top speed sooner whilst the prop is still accelarating that by the time the prop reachs full speed and starts to gain the winger has already reached the tryline.

Same applies to golf, some people can be stronger, but in the golf swing, it only matters how much strength you can apply in the fraction of a second that is the downswing, more force on the club will always lead to a longer shot (impact conditions being the same), but that force needs to be applied and maintained prior to and through impact. Adding more force after impact is not useful for obvious reasons.

This is why static strength alone is not an indicator for distance, a guy that can move 200kg slowly will be strong, but not powerful, a guy that can move 1kg quickly will be fast but not powerful, a guy that can move 100kg quickly is starting to combine strength and speed so is becoming powerful.

Also, size can be coreelated, but not always, being a beanpole might give you a leverage advantage over someone much shorter and muscular. Your muscles may produce less force, but your limbs may leverage that into a gigger force being aplied at the club.

Strenght and conditioning is in its infancy in golf, compared to other sports, but as it develops, I think we will see a lot more athletic types at the pro level with some ridiclous distances being hit (not that we don't already have that).

 

[inc0gnito]

It’s all about the jacked fibraz brah!

Also Bruce Lee’s one inch punch comes to mind. Extremely powerful but very short swing.

 

[sev112]

I think Messrs Finau and Woodland also make the best use of their ability to load the shaft in the short backswing and then time it’s natural release as they come back through the ball as well, getting a huge benefit from the shaft.
Whereas the average handicap golfer will lose all of that elastic loading when they cast on the downswing, or uncock out of time etc.

 

[Leftie]

Fitness, strength, and speed all have their place but a couple of other things come to mind.

Technique and timing - how often have you kicked yourself for not taking 2 clubs less when playing a safety lay up shot and ending up in or very close to trouble? It's one of golf's truisms that the easy lay up shot always goes further than a full blooded whallop.

If you can finish your follow through in a "pose" position then you must have done a lot right to get there.

Just wish I could get this tired old body to do what the brain tells it to do

 

[williamalex1]

Fitness, strength, and speed all have their place but a couple of other things come to mind.

Technique and timing - how often have you kicked yourself for not taking 2 clubs less when playing a safety lay up shot and ending up in or very close to trouble? It's one of golf's truisms that the easy lay up shot always goes further than a full blooded whallop.

If you can finish your follow through in a "pose" position then you must have done a lot right to get there.

Just wish I could get this tired old body to do what the brain tells it to do

Welcome to my world

 

[USER1999]

I will second the lay up 5i is the longest 5i you will ever hit.

 

[Parsaregood]

Forget about length of swing, if you look at almost all tour professionals they have at least 90 degrees of shoulder rotation at the 'top' of their swing. It's how far your arms move independently of your turn that determines swing length. Everyone is different, if you look at almost all the top players they all know who they are as golfers in terms of what works for them, the guys not so near the top are always searching when intact they'd be better off refining what they have and becoming super effective at doing it which is what the top guys have done. You tend to find guys with shorter swings have a quicker wrist set and tempo than most guys with fuller golf swings

 

[Slime]

I find that the hardest thing in golf is shortening the backswing.
I've been trying for many, many years and just don't know how to do it.
I remember a few months ago I had to just knock a little 5 iron out of the rough, just to get it into position in the fairway.
A little ¾ swing, I had no choice, and the bugger went just over 200 yards, beautifully straight!
But to do it when I don't have a restricted swing, due to trees etc., is just impossible!
Aaaggghhh.

 

[Swinglowandslow]

If I don't do a full shoulder turn, then the shot goes wrong, I produce a severe slice. Whenever my shotmaking starts to go off, I find the cure is as full a swing as I can make.
However, I can chip wedges ok on half swings( with no body involvement, which I suppose is the difference).