SSS

[viscount17]

I had thought that the SSS rating of holes genuinely indicated which were the harder holes to play but was informed by a learned colleague that it ain't necessarily so.

According to the oracle, there are 'rules' to the bestowing of SSS ratings; they should be balanced between front nine and back nine, there should not be consecutive 'high' (1, 2, 3 etc) ratings. (Of course we've all played tracks where this is not the case.)

But it begs the question, does this 'artificial' awarding of 'high' SSS ratings not make a mockery of the handicap system? It surely leads to holes where the high handicapper genuinely needs the extra shot(s) but does not get them and conversely, to others where he does not need them but gets them.

I would expect that were you to play many different courses this would balance out but I'm not so sure that it is true of playing just one course.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

I agree. I played with a guy off 27 on Sunday in the comp which meant he got 2 shots at a 178 yard par 3 (SI 7). The fact that he has birdied it in the past for 2 (net zero) does tend to make a mockery of things. Why is that hole SI 7. Its not long, is fairly open and the green isn't that undualting.

I'm wondering if it goes along with your point about the SI being balanced as opposed to being given on merit. Does anyone else know why and how the SI is done in this way?

 

[viscount17]

I knew I had SSS wrong but had a brain blockage - of course I meant SI (doh!)

 

[jammydodger]

Taken from the EGU website

HANDICAP STROKE INDEX
Rule of Golf 33-4 requires Committees to “publish a table indicating the order of holes at which
handicap strokes are to be given or received”. To provide consistency at Affiliated Clubs it is
recommended that the allocation is made as follows:
(a) Of paramount importance for match play competition is the even spread of the strokes to
be received at all handicap differences over the 18 holes.
(b) This is best achieved by allocating the odd numbered strokes to the more difficult of the
two nines, usually the longer nine, and the even numbers to the other nine.
(c) The first and second stroke index holes should be placed close to the centre of each nine
and the first six strokes should not be allocated to adjacent holes. The 7th to the 10th
indices should be allocated so that a player receiving 10 strokes does not receive strokes on
three consecutive holes.
(d) None of the first eight strokes should be allocated to the first or the last hole, and at clubs
where competitive matches may be started at the 10th hole, at the 9th or 10th holes. This
avoids a player receiving an undue advantage on the 19th hole should a match continue to
sudden death. Unless there are compelling reasons to the contrary, stroke indices 9, 10, 11 and
12 should be allocated to holes 1, 9, 10 and 18 in such order as shall be considered appropriate.
(e) Subject to the foregoing recommendations, when selecting each stroke index in turn holes
of varying length should be selected. Index 1 could be a Par 5, index 2 a long Par 4, index
3 a shorter Par 4 and index 4 a Par 3. There is no recommended order for this selection,
the objective being to select in index sequence holes of varying playing difficulty. Such a
selection provides more equal opportunity for all handicaps in match play and Stableford
and Par competitions than an order based upon hole length or difficulty to obtain Par.
Note 1: Par is not an indicator of hole difficulty. Long Par 3 and 4 holes are often selected for
low index allocation in preference to Par 5 holes on the basis that it is easier to score
Par on a Par 5 hole than 4 on a long Par 4. Long Par 3 and 4 holes are difficult Pars for
low handicap players but often relatively easy Bogeys for the player with a slightly higher
handicap. Difficulty in relation to Par is only one of several factors to be taken into
account when selecting stroke indices.
Note 2: When allocating a stroke index it should be noted that in the majority of social matches
there are small handicap differences thereby making the even distribution of the lower
indices of great importance.
The above recommendations for the ‘Handicap Stroke Index’ provision are principally directed
at match play situations and have proved to be suitable for that purpose.

 

[bernix]

There are other factors that come into consideration as well. I know i.e. that the first and the last hole are ALWAYS rated higher. For social rounds where a mulligan applies the rating should surely be adjusted - it makes the first hole that much easier

 

[bobmac]

If you look at any golf course SI, the 18th will never be SI 1.
Even if the last 3 holes were the hardest on the course, they would never be rated as 1,2 and 3.
The reason being if you are playing a knockout and you get 3 shots, your match may be finished by the time youm get to the 16th, therefor not getting your strokes.
Thats why the shots are spread out around the 18

 

[StuartD]

When playing a matchplay comp earlier this season I gave one shot away to a 14 h/capper.


Our S.I 1 is the second (It is our hardest hole). We both got 5 and he won the hole with his stroke. I said I am always happy with a 5 there and not unhappy to loose the hole. My opponent pointed out that had we been playing in the Saturday stableford together we would both have a shot here and be expected to get a five. He said it was SI 14 where he would get a shot and I don’t. So why in Matchplay does he get a shot on a hole where we both should score the same. Never thought of it this way.

Not sure if the guidelines have always been this way for selecting the SI for each hole. Does make it a bit complicated but I suppose I can see the logic behind it

 

[Mike_j_golf]

Our club used to be spread like that but they scraped it and went with the actual S.I. of the holes which everyone is finding much better, I think it is giving a huge advantage to the higher handicappers in stableford to have easy holes with a low SI just because they are in a certian spot on the course.
Mike

 

[HomerJSimpson]

I guess it comes down to where do you draw the line. We need the SI for handicaps to work and everyone has their own particular holes that they think are/easy hard and this doesn't correlate necessarily to the SI. I was giving 8 shots in a match that wen to extra holes and he was getting one on the par 5 second (SI 6). He'd bogied it first time by 3 putting and I'd made par so I wasn't exactly confident. Fortunately he drove OB and so it wasn't a problem. Clearly it was hole he could play either very well or very badly and in this case the SI was right. He also managed to hit the 16th (430 yards SI 3) with a drive and a 5 iron. Does that make the SI wrong.

I think its a very difficult subject for course designers and committees to get right and not something I'd be happy to try and do. You'll never please everyone and I guess at least the way laid out by jammydodger we all know where we stand.

 

[Dodger]

Or StuartD why do you not get shots the other way around i.e. instead of me giving a 3 hcper a shot on stroke index 1 I give him it on stroke index 18?If it is the easiest more chance me making Birdie for a half if he makes par.....swings and roundabouts me thinks.

 

[birdieman]

The Club2000 software that 99% of clubs use for handicapping and general admin will give you formal stats for hole difficulty over a day, week, season or even years. That is an exact means of allocating a SI to each hole.

Very rarely do the SI's correspond correctly to the actual difficulty of holes as SI's were allocated years and years ago before computers and before scoring stats could be easily analysed. It is a shame as shots given should be on the hardest holes to keep matches between different handicap golfers as fair as possible.

I suppose clubs just dont want to have the palaver and expense of reprinting scorecards and strokesavers and making new tee markers etc.

 

[vig]

When playing a matchplay comp earlier this season I gave one shot away to a 14 h/capper.


Our S.I 1 is the second (It is our hardest hole). We both got 5 and he won the hole with his stroke. I said I am always happy with a 5 there and not unhappy to loose the hole. My opponent pointed out that had we been playing in the Saturday stableford together we would both have a shot here and be expected to get a five. He said it was SI 14 where he would get a shot and I don’t. So why in Matchplay does he get a shot on a hole where we both should score the same. Never thought of it this way.

Not sure if the guidelines have always been this way for selecting the SI for each hole. Does make it a bit complicated but I suppose I can see the logic behind it

That is a very valid point Stu.
I have never thought of it that way either.

Our SI's are pretty indicative of their difficulty

 

[Leftie]

As already mentioned, there is a well reasoned convention for stroke indexes which is for matchplay reasons.

I know of one club (Hever Castle) that has two sets of stroke indexes printed on the card. One is following normal convention for matchplay, and the other is based on historical stats on hole difficulty for stableford comps.

Makes sense to me