Signed for an incorrect score....

[zlinuk]

I played in the monthly medal last Sunday and had a total howler, in due course I was awarded a .1 increase.

During the round I hit the ball into my bag and incurred a 2 stroke penalty (or so I thought), now reading through FTF's "hit my umbrella" thread it seem that the penalty should have only been 1 shot. This now means that I have signed for the wrong score.

So if I now make the comps sec aware of my error I guess he should disqualify me. Does this mean that I will get my .1 back or will it stand?

The other option is that given the error will make no impact at all on the outcome of the comp, should I even bother mentioning it and just put it down to experience?

 

[sawtooth]

Not worth mentioning IMO, you would have got .1 increase either way.

 

[Colin L]

Yes, the penalty should only have been one stroke. You are only disqualified, however, for signing for a wrong score at a hole if you recorded a score less than you actually took. A score greater than your actual score simply stands - no problem, no DQ. See Rule 6-6d:

The competitor is responsible for the correctness of the score recorded for each hole on his score card. If he returns a score for any hole lower than actually taken, he is disqualified. If he returns a score for any hole higher than actually taken, the score as returned stands.

 

[Fyldewhite]

As Colin says, it's not a DQ as you have effectively "done yourself out of a shot" rather than gaining an advantage.

However, it's probably worth mentioning that although it would make no difference here as it's 0.1 either way, had your score been a good one resulting in a handicap reduction then the committee should correct the incorrect score on the hole making your score one shot better (for handicap purposes only) and you would therefore get a bigger reduction. The principle of the system is that you get adjusted according to what you actually score (ie without mistakes).

 

[Tommo21]

I played in the monthly medal last Sunday and had a total howler, in due course I was awarded a .1 increase.

During the round I hit the ball into my bag and incurred a 2 stroke penalty (or so I thought), now reading through FTF's "hit my umbrella" thread it seem that the penalty should have only been 1 shot. This now means that I have signed for the wrong score.

So if I now make the comps sec aware of my error I guess he should disqualify me. Does this mean that I will get my .1 back or will it stand?

The other option is that given the error will make no impact at all on the outcome of the comp, should I even bother mentioning it and just put it down to experience?

Competition is officially closed, can't see them doing a thing or wanting to even if your score was one less.

 

[duncan mackie]

As Colin says, it's not a DQ as you have effectively "done yourself out of a shot" rather than gaining an advantage.

However, it's probably worth mentioning that although it would make no difference here as it's 0.1 either way, had your score been a good one resulting in a handicap reduction then the committee should correct the incorrect score on the hole making your score one shot better (for handicap purposes only) and you would therefore get a bigger reduction. The principle of the system is that you get adjusted according to what you actually score (ie without mistakes).

in this case it's not an 'incorrect score' so this isn't relevant.

in fact the only thing a committee may (must) do in this overall context is to use the reference sheet on which overall scores still count for reductions when a player is DQ'd from a competition for breaching a rule.

if you signed and returned a card for a 5 when you took a 4 your score for the hole is 5 and your handicap would be adjusted against a 5. if you deliberately manipulated your score upwards to manipulate your handicap then that is a different matter - for which the answer still isn't to just adjust the score.

 

[Fyldewhite]

if you signed and returned a card for a 5 when you took a 4 your score for the hole is 5 and your handicap would be adjusted against a 5. if you deliberately manipulated your score upwards to manipulate your handicap then that is a different matter - for which the answer still isn't to just adjust the score.

Sorry Duncan, I'm not convinced........The note to the paragraph about qualifying scores (17.1) states:
"For handicap adjustment and record purposes the entry of an incorrect score on any hole or an incorrect handicap must be corrected.....blah blah" [my bold]

Taking away the deliberate element of your scenario above (agreed) doesn't this mean that the score should (indeed must) be changed to a 4 for handicap purposes? If not then what does it mean?

I'd always thought that the idea behind the application of adjustments when DQ was based on reflecting the actual score done. For example, unsigned card is hardly a reflection of your playing ability so for handicap purposes it stands. Same here, it's a clerical error so put the score "right" then adjust is the principle. It can't be right to only do this if you are disqualified (it's clear that it must be adjusted if the error was the "other way round" and a DQ) and not when you make essentially the same error but are not disqualified.

 

[rulefan]

Fylde is right. The actual score must be entered for handicap purposes.

 

[duncan mackie]

Sorry Duncan, I'm not convinced........The note to the paragraph about qualifying scores (17.1) states:
"For handicap adjustment and record purposes the entry of an incorrect score on any hole or an incorrect handicap must be corrected.....blah blah" [my bold]

Taking away the deliberate element of your scenario above (agreed) doesn't this mean that the score should (indeed must) be changed to a 4 for handicap purposes? If not then what does it mean?

I'd always thought that the idea behind the application of adjustments when DQ was based on reflecting the actual score done. For example, unsigned card is hardly a reflection of your playing ability so for handicap purposes it stands. Same here, it's a clerical error so put the score "right" then adjust is the principle. It can't be right to only do this if you are disqualified (it's clear that it must be adjusted if the error was the "other way round" and a DQ) and not when you make essentially the same error but are not disqualified.

Fylde is right. The actual score must be entered for handicap purposes.

my mistake - I'd missed the note to 17.1 and definitely accept the principle

from a practical perspective I assume a committee would have to agree the 'revised' score with the player's marker - who's already signed to say the player scored a higher score........???

 

[rulefan]

Presumably the marker also thought it was a 2 stroke penalty

 

[duncan mackie]

Presumably the marker also thought it was a 2 stroke penalty

touche - but I had posted

"if you signed and returned a card for a 5 when you took a 4 your score for the hole is 5" without reference to any penalty.


where the reason for the difference is known this obviously isn't a relevant question.

 

[zlinuk]

All very interesting, thanks.

 

[Scrindle]

Odd...reading the title of this thread I assumed it would have been started by Sawtooth...