Sanding Greens

FairwayDodger

FairwayDodger

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:rant:

So the greens at my place are awful and they're really struggling this year after the poor weather but gradually improving; with any luck they'll just be bad soon.....

Turned up for a comp today to discover that all the greens have had sand spread over them. Putting on these greens at the best of times is a bit of a lottery; today it was farcical. Judging weight was nearly impossible - it seemed every long putt was either six feet short or six feet past. I three putted 5 times in the first 10 holes and got quite annoyed with the whole thing.

My question is (knowing nothing about greenkeeping).... what is the point in sanding them?

Then.... any chance of doing it when there isn't a comp on?

Grrrrr!!
 
No knowing that much about the keeping of greens, my guess would be to aid in drainage is particularly wet weather and to stop the greens turning to mush when people walk over them when they are soggy but deemed playable.

I feel you pain when putting on sanded greens it is like playing bagatelle
 
helps with drainage aswell i think ,everywer is the same its been that cold that theres not alot of growth around
 
GreiginFife said:
FD, where do you play? I've not heard of sanding greens when a comp is on. Sand them in between yes (I believe this is to absorb excess water and speed the drying - I could be wrong).
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It's Liberton in Edinburgh. My guess is also for drying but I played Saturday and they were fine (as fine as they get at the moment) and I don't think it's rained since.

I doubt they'd have been sanded on a gents comp day but that's another rant entirely!! ;)
 
Might just be trying to make a decent fist of a bad situation. Our greens are the same, there just hasn't been enough heat to let the grass grow properly.

I played with one of our greenkeepers in the medal last week and he said that the best time to core the greens was actually in the middle of summer, but they don't do it then because they don't think it would go down too well ;)
 
FairwayDodger said:
It's Liberton in Edinburgh. My guess is also for drying but I played Saturday and they were fine (as fine as they get at the moment) and I don't think it's rained since.

I doubt they'd have been sanded on a gents comp day but that's another rant entirely!! ;)
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Ah, I see. I haven't played there so don't know what the general condition is. Is it one of those places that has different standards for the gents?
 
Ours were sanded last week two weeks after being overseeded. From what I have been told it helps with maintenance of the green along with helping to smooth them out a bit. All to do with the health of the grass etc.

As for the timing it is a fairly fixed schedule and as has been said there has been little growth so far this year.
 
Our greens are in marvellous condition. There are patches on a few of them which are badly damaged with scars or have big holes, but this is due to the greenkeepers having no budget to fix such things when it was under the previous ownership. Since I've been playing there in the last two months, the condition has got better each time I've played it.

The greens yesterday were rolling lovely.
 
GreiginFife said:
Ah, I see. I haven't played there so don't know what the general condition is. Is it one of those places that has different standards for the gents?
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General condition isn't great TBH, some of it down to the weather but having played a few other courses recently that are looking good I know it can't just be that.

It's equal rights - maybe that comment was a bit paranoid..... I'll look with interest for future "topdressing" days.

EDIT> Impossible to substantiate but I'll say it anyway. I reckon I could average about 2 shots a round better if our greens were comparable to those I've played on at the likes of Gullane and Royal Musselburgh recently.
 
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FairwayDodger said:
General condition isn't great TBH, some of it down to the weather but having played a few other courses recently that are looking good I know it can't just be that.

It's equal rights - maybe that comment was a bit paranoid..... I'll look with interest for future "topdressing" days.

EDIT> Impossible to substantiate but I'll say it anyway. I reckon I could average about 2 shots a round better if our greens were comparable to those I've played on at the likes of Gullane and Royal Musselburgh recently.
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I think standards when you compare to Gullane and the like is a difficult measure. I wouldn't rate even Muckhart as highly as Gullane, whilst we are still very good.
I would certainly look at the maintenance schedule with interest in relation to comps...
 
Sanding the greens helps in numerous ways however the greens sound as though they could do with a pencil core as well to get the sand into the greens. Are you sure this wasn't done as well?

For the record I played a tie this morning and our greens were magnificent. Last weeks rain has helped no end. Bare in mind there has been very limited growth so far this year.
 
thecraw said:
Sanding the greens helps in numerous ways however the greens sound as though they could do with a pencil core as well to get the sand into the greens. Are you sure this wasn't done as well?

For the record I played a tie this morning and our greens were magnificent. Last weeks rain has helped no end. Bare in mind there has been very limited growth so far this year.
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Not today, I'm sure, but maybe earlier in the season.

Jealous of anyone with "magnificent" greens; at the moment I've got no confidence looking at any putt over about 3 feet - just can't count on it running true. :(
 
this is a classic case of you're dammed if you do, and you're dammed if you don't.....

won't give the really long version but....

the first green keeper to 'sand' or topdress greens was Old Tom Morris at St Andrews and he quickly developed some of the best green surfaces for putting anywhere.

topdressing with fine material when greens are bumpy will actually result in greens that putt truer straight away, and should fairly quickly result in faster truer surfaces that just plain putt better.

ideally you would close the course for 3 weeks in May and August but, as suggested, most courses shy away from this!

generally the right balance of material in the upper layers of the green surface is critical to consistency though the playing season - it aids growth, drainage, reaction to footprints, consistent reaction (through different weather conditions) to pitching, chipping and full shots landing on the green.

overal recovery time is going to depend on growth, which depends on weather and, importantly, most clubs will hire in the machinery to do some of the work and may not be able to do so to suit a competition schedule everytime - actually most clubs competition schedule during the key growing periods don't have a 3 weeks slot at any time!!!
 
duncan mackie said:
this is a classic case of you're dammed if you do, and you're dammed if you don't.....
Click to expand...

Och aye, I'm sure they don't do it just for the hell of it but it really screwed me up today. I played pretty well tee to green but couldn't putt to save my life.

Not just me either, I fear. Perfect conditions today; sunny barely a breath of wind but when I left the computer was estimating CSS at SSS+3!
 
About 2 months ago my local course did the whole sand thing on the greeens was awful, but now the greens do look and play alot better
 
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