Playing a Provisional Ball - Has this Changed

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Has the rule changed about when a player can decide to return to the tee or to where he played his previous shot to play a provisional.

Aside - I have heard suggested that a player has always been able to go back to where a shot had been played to play a provisional at any time before where he thinks his ball is as long as he plays the provisional within 5 mins of starting to walk back...? Not true surely?

 

[doublebogey7]

Has the rule changed about when a player can decide to return to the tee or to where he played his previous shot to play a provisional.

Aside - I have heard suggested that a player has always been able to go back to where a shot had been played to play a provisional at any time before where he thinks his ball is as long as he plays the provisional within 5 mins of starting to walk back...? Not true surely?

Yes the restriction that once you had gone forward you couldn't return to the tee to play a provisional has been receded under the new rules. Though now you are only permitted three minutes to search for your ball the opportunity to return to where you played the ball from is vastly reduced.

 

[jim8flog]

The change is that a player may play a provisional either before commencing a search for a ball that may be lost or OB or within 3 minutes of commencing the search.

The before going forward more than 50 yards has been deleted.

 

[duncan mackie]

Has the rule changed about when a player can decide to return to the tee or to where he played his previous shot to play a provisional.

Aside - I have heard suggested that a player has always been able to go back to where a shot had been played to play a provisional at any time before where he thinks his ball is as long as he plays the provisional within 5 mins of starting to walk back...? Not true surely?

As responded in post #90 to your post #89 on exactly this in this thread....

https://forums.golf-monthly.co.uk/threads/why-does-he-get-to-choose.99879/page-5

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

As responded in post #90 to your post #89 on exactly this in this thread....

https://forums.golf-monthly.co.uk/threads/why-does-he-get-to-choose.99879/page-5

Yes I understand. The secondary point and that which I was really confused about - was that I heard suggested that I could previously (old rules) have gone back to play a provisional as I can now under the revised rule. So for example if I was 150yds from the tee when I thought I wished I had played a provisional - I could run back to the tee and play a provisional as long as I played it before 5minutes were up - and as soon 5minutes were up that provisional became my ball in play if my original had not been found.

I thought the (notional or actual?) 50yds thing was the limiting factor previously - was I wrong?

 

[doublebogey7]

Yes I understand. The secondary point and that which I was really confused about - was that I heard suggested that I could previously (old rules) have gone back to play a provisional as I can now under the revised rule. So for example if I was 150yds from the tee when I thought I wished I had played a provisional - I could run back to the tee and play a provisional as long as I played it before 5minutes were up - and as soon 5minutes were up that provisional became my ball in play if my original had not been found.

I thought the (notional or actual?) 50yds thing was the limiting factor previously - was I wrong?

No, though it's a moot point now

 

[duncan mackie]

I thought the (notional or actual?) 50yds thing was the limiting factor previously - was I wrong?

No, you weren't wrong.

As to notional or actual....originally the rule was that you could only go back when you had gone forward to search if you had become aware of new information that made it clear that a provisional was the sensible option to save time.
It follows that the further forward you had gone the less likely it would be that it would save time - regardless of how much additional clarity was gained - the classic example being a blind driving area over a brow with a slight dogleg and a load of heavy rough on one side....
The equation gets muddled - clear principle but muddled equation.

So, out came the 50 yds guidance (which didn't change the principle but most people found easier to handle....

Now it's purely the natural equation of time - although IMO it will change again. My reason for this is that a player who almost gets to the search area for their ball can walk all the way back to the tee before starting to search at all. If no one else will start searching (because they are searching for someone else's ball for example) you are simply chewing up the group's time on course all round (which is not what provisional balls are designed for!)

 

[drdel]

Two shot penalty and play a ball at estimated point of being lost or OOB is designed to obviate returning to original point.

 

[mikejohnchapman]

Yes I understand. The secondary point and that which I was really confused about - was that I heard suggested that I could previously (old rules) have gone back to play a provisional as I can now under the revised rule. So for example if I was 150yds from the tee when I thought I wished I had played a provisional - I could run back to the tee and play a provisional as long as I played it before 5minutes were up - and as soon 5minutes were up that provisional became my ball in play if my original had not been found.

I thought the (notional or actual?) 50yds thing was the limiting factor previously - was I wrong?

No, as I understand it the notional 50 yards was to allow a player to go to their bag to get another ball as it was often the case it was left in front of the tee. The original wording was (I believe) that you couldn't go forward at all which left a catch 22 situation.

 

[rulie]

No, as I understand it the notional 50 yards was to allow a player to go to their bag to get another ball as it was often the case it was left in front of the tee. The original wording was (I believe) that you couldn't go forward at all which left a catch 22 situation.

The actual wording was "go forward to search", which did not prevent players from going forward to their bag to get a ball or club. Then the approximately 50 yards was added to allow players to gain more information and still return to play the (time-saving) provisional.
The "going forward" was often misinterpreted and misused.

 

[duncan mackie]

No, as I understand it the notional 50 yards was to allow a player to go to their bag to get another ball as it was often the case it was left in front of the tee. The original wording was (I believe) that you couldn't go forward at all which left a catch 22 situation.

Not really.

The rule wording hasn't changed significantly since the last major changes with the New Code rules of 1984.

The rule stated "...he must play it before he or his partner goes forward to search for the original ball."

All the decisions, and their guidance, were regarding what constituted going forwards.

Going (anywhere) to get another ball wouldn't be relevant regardless of distance.

Edit - beaten by Rulie! Must type faster...