Limiting factors ?

[Deleted member 16999]

for sure being able to play with different folks who have already reached the level you looking to get to or even further along the index ladder is good ways to go

just looking at that shot that caused issues in the recent game
things I would advise folks to consider would be

where in the round did it happen

had you made a reasonable assessment of just how strong the wind was - 1/2/3 club wind etc
exactly how did you tee the ball up - in relation to that tee-box where did you tee the ball from

how wide is the green - how deep is the green - extent of the trouble long - what's happening trouble wise the non penal & non shortside of the green (left)

what had been the overall shot flight pattern being experienced prior to - what type of slight curvatures were there - how good was the shot distance control

under normal playing conditions do you really know to 5 yards how far you carry each club through the bag

how does this stuff maybes relate to the outcome of that particular shot

trouble front & right of - wind was against - but the aim was dead center green
slightly come off/back off any shot the likely 'mistakes' will be too high flight so loss of penetrating traj - short - shot tend to stall drift rightfield so short & right

likely the real margin for error target wise would be the extreme left edge of green - plus again real margin for error maybes definitely take more than enough club

these are all just rhetorical questions & about just different ways to look at/approach course management & shot selection & club selection - so next time hopefully ball stays dry

guessing too the issue with the stubby pitch recovery had a deal to do with set-up & maybes club selection perhaps assessment of ground conditions those kinda things

Great post Coach, :thup:

 

[HomerJSimpson]

If you don't think you can get better, not only in golf but in life then you stagnate. There are always ways of doing things better and with my golf I know I can improve my short game immensely before I even consider the work I'm doing over the winter on my long game. Granted as I get older there may come physical limitations but I can always get better. That is why I'll also be looking at NLP and thinking better around the course and over the ball. I was always taught in life you only get out what you put in

 

[Hobbit]

Time, desire, preparation, belief. I haven't the time to play as much as I should, or is it the desire to find the time to play as much as I should. I don't prepare as I should, nor have the commitment to do so. And my belief(excuse) is age and fitness is now getting in the way - tell that to Langer...

Will things get back to where they used to be? I very much doubt unless I change my attitude.

 

[pendodave]

Despite optimistic declarations to the contrary, a decent chunk of the back half of all golfers lives are spent getting slowly worse....

 

[pendodave]

I'm in exactly the same position as the op, bouncing around between 11 & 12 so have every sympathy.

Golf is really complicated, and there are consequently a stack of reasons why people reach a particular level. What limits one doesn't limit another.

I would say that self awareness is an issue for many. They just don't realise that they are doing things wrong and consequently never correct significant issues.

Personally, I wouldn't worry about it. You play well enough to enjoy the game and all it brings.

 

[User 105]

Does it seem to be the same bad holes on the same course (I found I was switching off mid round on simpler holes)

Does it happen both in comps and bounce games? (Subconciously we can tend to find ways of scoring within our comfort zones)

Can happen at any time. Not always the same holes. And will happen in comps and bounce games. No real pattern.

 

[User 105]

for sure being able to play with different folks who have already reached the level you looking to get to or even further along the index ladder is good ways to go

just looking at that shot that caused issues in the recent game
things I would advise folks to consider would be

where in the round did it happen

had you made a reasonable assessment of just how strong the wind was - 1/2/3 club wind etc
exactly how did you tee the ball up - in relation to that tee-box where did you tee the ball from

how wide is the green - how deep is the green - extent of the trouble long - what's happening trouble wise the non penal & non shortside of the green (left)

what had been the overall shot flight pattern being experienced prior to - what type of slight curvatures were there - how good was the shot distance control

under normal playing conditions do you really know to 5 yards how far you carry each club through the bag

how does this stuff maybes relate to the outcome of that particular shot

trouble front & right of - wind was against - but the aim was dead center green
slightly come off/back off any shot the likely 'mistakes' will be too high flight so loss of penetrating traj - short - shot tend to stall drift rightfield so short & right

likely the real margin for error target wise would be the extreme left edge of green - plus again real margin for error maybes definitely take more than enough club

these are all just rhetorical questions & about just different ways to look at/approach course management & shot selection & club selection - so next time hopefully ball stays dry

guessing too the issue with the stubby pitch recovery had a deal to do with set-up & maybes club selection perhaps assessment of ground conditions those kinda things

Thanks coach. I tend to consider those things on all shots. Especially on a dangerous hole like this one.

On this hole water was around the front of the green and up the right. Bunkers were on the left side. So if you go in there you're then playing back towards water.

My shape up until then was a slight draw so i teed it up on the right side of the tee box to hit across the green away from the water and was aiming at the middle thinking if I draw it slightly then I'm left side of the green, if I do hit a small fade then I'll be close to the pin.

Club selection was good as it went in the water about pin high and I clubbed up and swung easy as it was into the wind and to keep it a bit lower, and if it did go long it still isn't great but better then left, right or short.

I'm happy with my choices, I just hit a bad shot.

With the pitch shot I had to hole it for a point so was forced into playing a shot I normally wouldn't. There wasn't much room to land it and get it to roll out to the pin so had to pitch it a lot higher than I'd usually would to get it to come down soft and roll out, so had to play it with a bit of loft and the lie I had after the drop wasn't great. A bit bare. I had about a 40 yard carry over water and about 3-4 yards roll to the pin. Just caught it a little heavy and came up a couple of yards short and into the water again.

As i say most of the time I'm comfortable with my shot selection, it's not perfect all the time, but it's one area I do feel reasonably confident with. It's more the execution of the shot that's causing the issue.

 

[User 105]

I was always taught in life you only get out what you put in

I'm not 100% sure that applies to golf

It seems with golf you have to put an inordinate amount of time and effort in for very little return.

If one of my project managers at work came to me and explained the amount of time they'd invested in golf and the improvement they got I think I'd be canning the project on the spot

 

[Deleted member 16999]

Thanks coach. I tend to consider those things on all shots. Especially on a dangerous hole like this one.

On this hole water was around the front of the green and up the right. Bunkers were on the left side. So if you go in there you're then playing back towards water.

My shape up until then was a slight draw so i teed it up on the right side of the tee box to hit across the green away from the water and was aiming at the middle thinking if I draw it slightly then I'm left side of the green, if I do hit a small fade then I'll be close to the pin.

Club selection was good as it went in the water about pin high and I clubbed up and swung easy as it was into the wind and to keep it a bit lower, and if it did go long it still isn't great but better then left, right or short.

I'm happy with my choices, I just hit a bad shot.

With the pitch shot I had to hole it for a point so was forced into playing a shot I normally wouldn't. There wasn't much room to land it and get it to roll out to the pin so had to pitch it a lot higher than I'd usually would to get it to come down soft and roll out, so had to play it with a bit of loft and the lie I had after the drop wasn't great. A bit bare. I had about a 40 yard carry over water and about 3-4 yards roll to the pin. Just caught it a little heavy and came up a couple of yards short and into the water again.

As i say most of the time I'm comfortable with my shot selection, it's not perfect all the time, but it's one area I do feel reasonably confident with. It's more the execution of the shot that's causing the issue.

If you went in the water off the tee, the drop would’ve been your third for 2 points if it had gone in or pitch it close for 1 putt for a point.

 

[Dasit]

11 to 12 is a decent level for most people

Why do you think you should ever get lower

 

[BubbaP]

I feel that most of us who are not low have weaknesses in technique that need timing to compensate for. When it is on and can be maintained (maybe this week's swing thought) then we can shoot low but most of the time it will catch up on us somewhere.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

11 to 12 is a decent level for most people

Why do you think you should ever get lower

Why not?

 

[Dasit]

Why not?

Golf is hard

 

[Deleted member 16999]

Golf is hard

Absolutely, but he’s asking for advice and that tells me he wants to go lower, not that he should, he’s putting a lot of time and effort into trying.

 

[User 105]

Absolutely, but he’s asking for advice and that tells me he wants to go lower, not that he should, he’s putting a lot of time and effort into trying.

That's exactly it. I want to go lower, I'm putting the effort in and have been for quite some time, but I'm not getting any better. Hence the post.

I've got some great ideas from you guys of other things to look at to see if I can make a break through.

The real question I'm asking myself is given the amount of time\effort I'm putting in is it really worth it ? Only I can really answer that and I want to make sure I've explored all avenues before I make that decision.

What's that quote "If you continue doing what you've always done, you'll always get what you've always got"

Something needs to change for me to progress, just need to work out what.

 

[jim8flog]

One of the things that often gets over looked is the mental side of the game.

I have seen a few players who get stuck in the mode "I am a better player than this" and put a lot of anxiety in their game rather than just relaxing and letting it happen

One of the guys in our group is stuck at the 11/12 level but is trying to get to single figure by the end of the year but we feel he will never succeed simply because he is trying to force it. His principle problem is that he feels that he should try to birdie every hole and often bogeys the hole instead when he would have easily have got a par with a better mental attitude.

 

[User 105]

Thanks Jim. I don't think that's it with me. I play a fairly conservative strategy. I'll often hit a shorter club off the tee to keep it in play. I'll even lay up in front of the greens on Par 4's if I don't like the shot as my short game is reasonably decent and I'll fancy my chances of getting up and down.

As an example on the tight Par 4 2nd at Chesfield (SI 2 I think). Trouble left and right off the tee I have no issue hitting 7i, 7i and then a wedge in. It's one of those holes as a handicap player you'd happily take a 5 at all day.

When I had playing lesson with my coach this year she commented that sometimes I play a little too conservatively so have been looking for spots where I can take on some shots where the punishment for a miss isn't too bad.

My usual mindset is safety first but I am looking for spots where I can be more aggressive.

 

[Deleted member 21258]

Have you looked at your recent rounds and analysed were you have dropped 11 plus shots on.

11 shots are a big number to lose tbh, so should be easy to see a trend over several weeks, what is your weak areas/shots or when it happens or what shots are at risk of going wrong.

 

[Yant]

What do you guys see as the limiting factors to a golfer improving ?

I've been stuck at around 11-12 handicap for about 4 years now. Despite regular lessons, spending a lot of time practicing and playing 2-3 times a week (in the summer at least) I don't seem to actually be improving. If anything I feel I'm getting slightly worse. :angry:

I've tried changing coaches a few times in an effort to shake things up but I'm starting to get to the conclusion that this might be as good as I'll ever get :mmm:

I know I can shoot 5-6 shots under my hcp when everything clicks but most of the time I miss the buffer and then the once a year low one brings me back down again to between 11-12.

My pattern seems to be play good golf for a few holes, then out of nowhere I'm all over the place for no apparent reason, then again for no reason I'll be fine again. But by then I'll have wrecked my card.

This weekend was the perfect example. I shot 32 points but with 4 blobs in close proximity mid round. But when I say blobs they we're 8's and 9's, so we're not talking about 1 bad shot doing the damage it will be a really bad drive, couple of duffed irons, duffed wedge and a 3-putt.

Then out of nowhere I'm fine again.

Thoughts ?

Without reading the rest of the replies yet in the thread, my comment would be about consistency, which sounds kind of obvious given your explanation of your usual scoring habits. I'd say you should start to record your shot count and look at the stats, so you can better identify the areas that need improvement. I always do a post-round review (using golfshot) and enter all of my information for the round, which tells me how fairways i've hit, how many greens, how many sand saves, how many putts etc. But it also tells me which side my misses are on, so i get a clearer idea when i play again where i can expect to miss (most of the time).

Bringing your handicap down into single figures and low figures is about making your bad shots better and not so destructive. Course management may be a thing too - are you always pin seeking? rather than playing for the heart of the green (or anywhere around the green when out of position off of the tee?). I see so many cat2 & 3 players taking the wrong option when they get out of position it's no wonder their handicap doesn't come down. Sometimes you have to be aware of the situation and play for the heart of the green, take a 2-putt par and move on. Or, play for as close to the green as you can get it, then try to get up and down. This might help with not compounding a mistake with another one - something else i see cat 2 & 3 players do a lot.

 

[User 105]

Have you looked at your recent rounds and analysed were you have dropped 11 plus shots on.

11 shots are a big number to lose tbh, so should be easy to see a trend over several weeks, what is your weak areas/shots or when it happens or what shots are at risk of going wrong.

Thanks. Yeah looked for patterns. It doesn't seem to be one specific shot, situation or hole. My game just suddenly goes completely off for 3-4 holes then will suddenly come back for no reason.

As I've said looks like a concentration thing but it doesn't feel like it when I'm playing, everything feels normal. I just hit a lot of really bad shots during that spell of play.