Killing rollups has hurt golf

[Mandofred]

Quite simply if you reserve certain times for one group, by definition, you can’t do both. It’s not a tricky concept. Fairness and equity cannot be delivered where a certain group gets differing treatment.

In reserving specific times for one group over another, you are not compromising.

I don't actually get this. At one of my clubs there are open tee times until 9am....then an hour of booked times for the rollup.....and then open tee times. Sure sounds like a compromise.....You get both ways of playing.....why is that so unfair? If it was a blocked seniors comp against ??? club it is ok to block those times. Why is it ok to block for one reason.....but unfair to block for another reason?

 

[GreiginFife]

Are you saying they do ladies days every week or multiple times a week? Is once a year too much for you?

Not sure any clubs round here do ladies days since the millennium arrived. Junior days never heard of them.

If there are places that do, then they are doing them at detriment to another group. Which goes back to my call for equity to all paying members.

Visiting parties I have no issue with, nor does anyone following a 100% positive response at the last AGM as we understand they help subsidise our membership.

But it just sounds like it doesn’t work for YOU and so the system is wrong.

 

[Bunkermagnet]

We don't have tee times, it's turn up, queue and go.
We have a couple of groups who play at the weekend, and probably other days of the week. They have no priority for the first tee. Their numbers vary but most know when they normally play. They also aren't closed shops.

 

[GreiginFife]

I don't actually get this. At one of my clubs there are open tee times until 9am....then an hour of booked times for the rollup.....and then open tee times. Sure sounds like a compromise.....You get both ways of playing.....why is that so unfair? If it was a blocked seniors comp against ??? club it is ok to block those times. Why is it ok to block for one reason.....but unfair to block for another reason?

Beyond a competition that allows ALL members the opportunity to play there should be no blocked tees for equity.

It sounds like a compromise to you because it benefits you. But in stopping people having the opportunity to play at a time that suits them then that’s dictatorial and not compromise.

Official competitions governed by CoC should not be conflated with social roll-ups IMO that is a disingenuous comparison.

 

[Lucifer MorningStar]

I don’t get what the personal comments are for!

All that matters is the clubs speak to members and get it right by what their membership wants. If you don’t like it and can’t accept what the outcome of that decision is then either don’t rejoin that club, play at other times or speak to the committee and see if you can offer suggestions to make improvements for everyone.

Other than that there certainly isn’t any need to be personal about it. Makes me laugh people post on open forum then get offended when someone posts a response that doesn’t agree with them

 

[Mandofred]

Are you saying they do ladies days every week or multiple times a week? Is once a year too much for you?

Not sure any clubs round here do ladies days since the millennium arrived. Junior days never heard of them.

If there are places that do, then they aren’t doing them at detriment to another group. Which goes back to my call for equity to all paying members.

Visiting parties I have no issue with, nor does anyone following a 100% positive response at the last AGM as we understand they help subsidise our membership.

But it just sounds like it doesn’t work for YOU and so the system is wrong.

Nope....doesn't sound like it works for me.

As an example....at the club I am returning to......Tuesdays from 9=11am is a ladies "comp". Every Tuesday. All year. At the local club (Oakdale)...there are 7 or 8 Open series comps......blocked from playing unless you want to play in the comp. I can go on....but for some reason.....you don't realize that all clubs don't work in the way you think they do. Clubs "block" times for all kinds of reasons....some I agree with , others I don't.

In a perfect world....yes, everybody would get the heck out of my way so I could play as fast and as often as I want......I don't think that's going to happen.

 

[GreiginFife]

I think this debate has run its course.

You’re demonstrating a very prevalent mindset of recent culture. One that says “I don’t like the system, the system is broken” rather than”I don’t like the system, it doesn’t work for me”.

 

[Arthur Wedge]

The answer is simple - join a club that has roll ups

Or put a motion to the committee and the members to introduce roll ups

If there is a desire to have them then they will get voted in

 

[Mandofred]

I think this debate has run its course.

You’re demonstrating a very prevalent mindset of recent culture. One that says “I don’t like the system, the system is broken” rather than”I don’t like the system, it doesn’t work for me”.

Where have I said that? Seems like I have stated multiple times there is a place for a compromise. Are you actually reading what I've wrote?

I'll say it AGAIN. There is a place for both ways of playing golf. Please read what I have written........

 

[Mandofred]

The answer is simple - join a club that has roll ups

Or put a motion to the committee and the members to introduce roll ups

If there is a desire to have them then they will get voted in

That.....I finally agree with.

 

[PaulMdj]

Nope....doesn't sound like it works for me.

As an example....at the club I am returning to......Tuesdays from 9=11am is a ladies "comp". Every Tuesday. All year. At the local club (Oakdale)...there are 7 or 8 Open series comps......blocked from playing unless you want to play in the comp. I can go on....but for some reason.....you don't realize that all clubs don't work in the way you think they do. Clubs "block" times for all kinds of reasons....some I agree with , others I don't.

In a perfect world....yes, everybody would get the heck out of my way so I could play as fast and as often as I want......I don't think that's going to happen.

These extra events bring in revenue that helps keep your membership fees down.

 

[GreiginFife]

I don’t get what the personal comments are for!

All that matters is the clubs speak to members and get it right by what their membership wants. If you don’t like it and can’t accept what the outcome of that decision is then either don’t rejoin that club, play at other times or speak to the committee and see if you can offer suggestions to make improvements for everyone.

Other than that there certainly isn’t any need to be personal about it. Makes me laugh people pat on open forum then get offended when someone posts a response that doesn’t agree with them

An important distinction in what I have been saying here is the use of the word “opportunity”. I didn’t play today because I could only play between 10 an 11 this morning due to prior commitments, I was a tad late in going to BRS and so missed out. But I had the OPPORTUNITY to get a suitable time.

Rollups seem to want to work on a guarantee rather than opportunity.

 

[Mandofred]

These extra events bring in revenue that helps keep your membership fees down.

So....it's ok to block times for "good" reasons......?

 

[GreiginFife]

Where have I said that? Seems like I have stated multiple times there is a place for a compromise. Are you actually reading what I've wrote?

I'll say it AGAIN. There is a place for both ways of playing golf. Please read what I have written........

Yes I have read what you have said. But what you’re suggesting isn’t compromise. If a roll up has tees every Saturday from 1000 to 1100 and no one outside that RU can book a tee time but the “compromise” is well you can have 0900 - 1000 but that doesn’t work for others then it’s only beneficial to the RU.

It really is that entitlement over opportunity that I oppose really.

Anyway, I’ll bow out now. I stand by the above statement on mindset.

 

[Mandofred]

An important distinction in what I have been saying here is the use of the word “opportunity”. I didn’t play today because I could only play between 10 an 11 this morning due to prior commitments, I was a tad late in going to BRS and so missed out. But I had the OPPORTUNITY to get a suitable times seem to want to work on a guarantee rather than opportunity.

As.....do all the other events I have mentioned. I can't play tomorrow at the closest course because of county womens comp.....they "quarantee" that time for this comp. I can't play.....unfair?

 

[PaulMdj]

So....it's ok to block times for "good" reasons......?

Yes, absolutely.

 

[Mandofred]

Yes I have read what you have said. But what you’re suggesting isn’t compromise. If a roll up has tees every Saturday from 1000 to 1100 and no one outside that RU can book a tee time but the “compromise” is well you can have 0900 - 1000 but that doesn’t work for others then it’s only beneficial to the RU.

It really is that entitlement over opportunity that I oppose really.

Anyway, I’ll bow out now. I stand by the above statement on mindset.

Does the rollup STOP the player from playing golf? No....they can play in the rollup....they just can't play the way THEY want to play. I mentioned this at the beginning. Why is that way "better" than another way?

 

[GreiginFife]

As.....do all the other events I have mentioned. I can't play tomorrow at the closest course because of county womens comp.....they "quarantee" that time for this comp. I can't play.....unfair?

A county comp is your go to for this? NowI’m definitely oot. With a capital OOT.

 

[Mandofred]

Yes, absolutely.

And a senior rollup with 40+ people is not a good reason?

 

[PaulMdj]

As.....do all the other events I have mentioned. I can't play tomorrow at the closest course because of county womens comp.....they "quarantee" that time for this comp. I can't play.....unfair?

Did you enquire about any reciprocals?