Is this acceptable?

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rudebhoy

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Playing in a doubles knockout match this morning. All very amicable to start with. We eventually get our noses in front and are 2 up after 5. On the 6th, I slice my drive way over a bunch of trees, heading towards the 7th fairway.

Me and my pp go to look for it. One of the other pair starts coming over to help, his mate stands still in the middle of the 6th fairway. His pp notices this, and does an about turn and joins his mate watching us. They then call the pair behind us through, but still don't make any attempt to help look for my ball.

I eventually have to give up and declare it lost. We are both pretty annoyed by the lack of help and it gets worse on the green. My pp is about 18 inches away for a half, but they don't give us it, despite us having given them a few longer ones earlier. My mate missus the putt to lose the hole. From there on, they don't concede anything which is more than a couple of inches from the hole. There must have been 4 or 5 putts from a foot or less which we had to hole.

Funnily enough, on the next hole, they both put their drives in the cabbage. I initially think "sod them, I'm not going to help look", but then think "come on, don't sink to their level", and help them find both. Of course, they then won the hole to get back to all square!

Fortunately we ended up winning, but it did leave a bit of a sour taste for me.

I totally get there is no obligation to concede short putts, but refusing to help look for a lost ball seemed pretty poor form. Maybe I'm over-reacting - I'd be interested to hear other people's thoughts on this.
 

Orikoru

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My views:
The guy who was going to help you look for the ball and turned back, could be poor form. Although if your ball was thought to be on a fairway then they might have expected you to find it easily.

Not giving the putt - no problem with that. The fact that it was missed justifies them not giving it. They're losing the match, why would they give you putts? On my course the greens are very tricky so in my matches we've rarely ever given many putts unless it's one foot and dead straight. Certainly not if we're losing either.

Fair play to you helping them look for their balls - I'd probably do the same in fairness. Or at least give the appearance of looking for it while possibly not trying that hard. :D
 

DanFST

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If It's not someone I know, I probably wouldn't help look for their ball in a knockout. Nor would I give a single putt.

Unless it was a scratch match, an afternoon in the cabbage looking for someones ball constantly is not my idea of fun.
 
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rudebhoy

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My views:
The guy who was going to help you look for the ball and turned back, could be poor form. Although if your ball was thought to be on a fairway then they might have expected you to find it easily.

Not giving the putt - no problem with that. The fact that it was missed justifies them not giving it. They're losing the match, why would they give you putts? On my course the greens are very tricky so in my matches we've rarely ever given many putts unless it's one foot and dead straight. Certainly not if we're losing either.

Fair play to you helping them look for their balls - I'd probably do the same in fairness. Or at least give the appearance of looking for it while possibly not trying that hard. :D
True, but it was very obvious very quickly that we were struggling to find it, they had a perfect view of us looking for it.
 

DaveR

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I had similar in a match once, like you I was tempted not to help the guy look for his ball but instead I walked over and said 'Would you like me to help you look for your ball even though you didn't look for mine?'
He very sheepishly said 'Yes please'. I didn't need to look for any more of my shots after that so I don't know if he would have helped me or not.
 
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rudebhoy

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If It's not someone I know, I probably wouldn't help look for their ball in a knockout. Nor would I give a single putt.

Unless it was a scratch match, an afternoon in the cabbage looking for someones ball constantly is not my idea of fun.
Really? Surely it's not about whether you know them or not, it's about playing the game in the proper spirit?
 
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rudebhoy

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I had similar in a match once, like you I was tempted not to help the guy look for his ball but instead I walked over and said 'Would you like me to help you look for your ball even though you didn't look for mine?'
He very sheepishly said 'Yes please'. I didn't need to look for any more of my shots after that so I don't know if he would have helped me or not.
that's a great line, must remember that one :D
 

Orikoru

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True, but it was very obvious very quickly that we were struggling to find it, they had a perfect view of us looking for it.
Playing devil's advocate maybe, but say after a minute and a half it starts to look like you might not find it, then it would take them another half a minute to walk over there, that only leaves one more minute of searching. Hardly worth it. :LOL:

Personally I'd have made a slow walk over and pretended to help you look for it to save face I reckon.
 

Canary_Yellow

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Poor form, yes. Comes across as desperate to win to the point of being unsporting.

Not giving putts is fair enough though. Wouldn't be my style, but wouldnt complain if it was done to me
 

timd77

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I probably wouldn’t be too narked about short putts not being given. It’s all part of matchplay, however, they wouldn’t be getting any off me either if that’s their game, see who can stand the pressure!

I’d definitely be narked about the lack of help ball searching, clearly gamesmanship and so I wouldn’t help them search for theirs. In fact, I wouldn’t even bother watching where their balls went, 2 can play at that game.
 

Slab

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I don’t have that much match play experience (& even less on the ‘gamesmanship’ aspects) so which putts to give/look to see holed, the ‘art’ of making them putt one early (or late) in the round to rattle them all seems a bit…. well, desperate if I’m honest. But that might just be my inexperience showing through. I tend to give when 18” or less (more if I ‘know’ the player & I’m happy they’ll make it)

Ball search; Unless I had dam good reason not to I’m gonna look for lost balls and I’ll try to look for it as if it was my ball


As a footnote; Is there even a 10% chance the lad on the fairway didn’t help look because of the following 2-ball, i.e letting them see you guys were still on that hole and not already on the adjacent 7th (after all that’s where all 4 players might’ve been)?
(Imagine he waves them through, comes to help look for your ball, goes back to where his ball was and one of the oiks behind has only gone and lifted it!)
Maybe not probably but certainly not impossible
 
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rudebhoy

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I probably wouldn’t be too narked about short putts not being given. It’s all part of matchplay, however, they wouldn’t be getting any off me either if that’s their game, see who can stand the pressure!

I’d definitely be narked about the lack of help ball searching, clearly gamesmanship and so I wouldn’t help them search for theirs. In fact, I wouldn’t even bother watching where their balls went, 2 can play at that game.
there was definitely a bit of gamesmanship going on. More than once they marched off up the fairway after playing their shot, but before I had played mine. Had to call out to them a couple of times to get out the line of fire.
 

DanFST

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Really? Surely it's not about whether you know them or not, it's about playing the game in the proper spirit?

What is the proper spirit? I don't expect anyone to help me look for mine and if they try, will tell them not to bother.
I'm concentrating on my ball and my game. Half arsing a search, or mildly watching where a PP drive lands isn't actually very helpful. No science to it, but If you know you have no help, I think you are more likely to find it.


Not even a 6 inch tap in?
Just tap it in! You've got to go get it anyway.

No gamesmanship, there's zero chance of a thread like this is everyone did the same, just be consistent and take all emotion out of it. (y)
 
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rudebhoy

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I don’t have that much match play experience (& even less on the ‘gamesmanship’ aspects) so which putts to give/look to see holed, the ‘art’ of making them putt one early (or late) in the round to rattle them all seems a bit…. well, desperate if I’m honest. But that might just be my inexperience showing through. I tend to give when 18” or less (more if I ‘know’ the player & I’m happy they’ll make it)

Ball search; Unless I had dam good reason not to I’m gonna look for lost balls and I’ll try to look for it as if it was my ball


As a footnote; Is there even a 10% chance the lad on the fairway didn’t help look because of the following 2-ball, i.e letting them see you guys were still on that hole and not already on the adjacent 7th (after all that’s where all 4 players might’ve been)?
(Imagine he waves them through, comes to help look for your ball, goes back to where his ball was and one of the oiks behind has only gone and lifted it!
)
Maybe not probably but certainly not impossible

I guess it's possible, but in those circumstances, the obvious thing to do would be to leave his trolley in the vicinity of his ball so it didn't get played by mistake. It's not as if it was a blind tee shot, the guys behind knew they were being called through and could see the 4 of us. That said, I have called folk through when looking for a pp's ball, only to have one of the group behind play my ball in error!
 

Springveldt

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When I started back playing again and entered one of the knockout comps I had to actually ask some lads if I should help look for my opponents ball or not. They both burst out laughing and said "why wouldn't you help?" and I said "because deep down I don't want them to find the ball, I want to win the hole". Anyway I helped look for any balls that went astray even when I didn't want to find it.

As for not giving the putt, to be fair they were 2 down, I'd be making my opponent putt out a 2 footer and I'd expect them to tell me to putt it out as well. I'd obviously concede ones right next to the hole but after that I'd be seeing them. 2 footers aren't 100%, they do get missed occasionally.
 
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