Immoveable Obstruction Rule 24

[3offTheTee]

Whilst playing yesterday the my playing partners ball landed on a path and he took relief behind the path.

However when he followed through he hit the edge of the path i.e. the wood which determined where the path was.

Should a penalty stroke have been called please?

 

[backwoodsman]

No - not that I can see. Why do you think a penalty should have been called?

 

[3offTheTee]

I did not think there should have been a penalty. However we were playing in a 3 ball and the other player thought there should be a penalty. Whilst I could see no reason he seemed to think that something similar happened on TV a while ago when the TV commentator stated that if the pro hit the wood there woild be a penalty

 

[TonyN]

No i think you or he rather is getting confused with trees or branches etc

If your swing is hampered by an imovable obstruction that you dont get releif from i.e a tree. If you are taking practice swings and you touch a branch or leaf etc, you incure a penalty.

Once you start the swing and touch the branch you must complete the swing and take the shot.

 

[DCB]

How was the "nearest point of relief" determined ?

If the player did connect with part of the Obstruction after taking his stance and during the playing of the shot then he would have been in violation of 20-2. He should have re-dropped before playing the shot as his ball had not been dropped correctly from the "nearest point of relief"

Decision 20-2c/6 covers this and if the full extent of the obstruction was evident then the player would be liable to a penalty under 20-2. That would be a two stroke penalty in strokeplay or loss of hole in matchplay.

 

[Herbie]

I think DCB is on the ball but its always hard to give the correct answer when there could be many questions to ask.

What is the exact definition of the path?
What was the decision making process to take a drop?
How was it dropped and where exactly?
Was it a tree or a branch/was it before or after swing?

Do you see what I mean? Im sure many on here have a rough idea of what has happened but a rules are so detailed and specific(I think ott sometimes) that great detail in description is needed.

 

[Leftie]

Always difficult to tell without being there and aware of all circumstances but...


If you take a free drop for relief from an immovable obstruction, then FULL relief MUST be taken e.g. if taking relief from a path, you cannot drop and still be partly standing on the path to play your shot. From what you have said, a drop was taken but when playing the shot, part of the obstruction was hit with the club. If this was the case then full relief hadn't been taken and under the rules the ball was played from the wrong place and therefore subject to penalty.

 

[3offTheTee]

Thanks for your comments. In relation to herb's points:
1. The ball was on the path. Not sure what you mean by the exact definition.
2. The ball WAS dropped in the wrong position. ie Not nearest point of relief then 1 club length but just behind the path probably within 1 club lemgth hence the reason it he touched the path with his club as the ball had moved forward a little.
3. It was not a tree or branch But the wooden edging which determines the path.

Hope this helps

3OTT

 

[DCB]

3OTT

don't want to sound pedantic, but when taking relief like this it is the ball must strike the ground within one clublength of the nearest point of relief. Its not an clublength then drop. The ball may also roll a further two clublengths from the point it touched the ground.

 

[RGuk]

Whilst playing yesterday the my playing partners ball landed on a path and he took relief behind the path.

However when he followed through he hit the edge of the path i.e. the wood which determined where the path was.

Should a penalty stroke have been called please?

Well i.m.o. if the player went on to hit the obstruction he had taken relief from, then he didn't take full relief. I guess you are talking about the wooden "edges" to paths around courses.
I can't give you the ruling, as I don't know for sure, but this must happen quite a lot (thinking you've taken full relief only to discover you haven't!)
Good question.
Not a problem normaly, experienced players don't take chances with taking relief from obstructions.

 

[TonyN]

Do you have to take releif?

Yesterday I found myself twice stood on a path to play my shot with a really good lie. If I had taken relief elsewhere then I would have been at a major disadvantage IMO.

 

[3offTheTee]

Sorry DCB I did not express myself clearly. The ball was dropped within 1 club length from the nearest pont odf relief

 

[RGuk]

How was the "nearest point of relief" determined ?

If the player did connect with part of the Obstruction after taking his stance and during the playing of the shot then he would have been in violation of 20-2. He should have re-dropped before playing the shot as his ball had not been dropped correctly from the "nearest point of relief"

Decision 20-2c/6 covers this and if the full extent of the obstruction was evident then the player would be liable to a penalty under 20-2. That would be a two stroke penalty in strokeplay or loss of hole in matchplay.

Thanks DCB......I was waiting for your eye to pass over this.

 

[3offTheTee]

DCB. My Decisions Book is 2006/7 and 20-2c/6 is reserved/.

Perhaps I am not up to date.

Thanks for your help

 

[SammmeBee]

Do you have to take releif?

Yesterday I found myself twice stood on a path to play my shot with a really good lie. If I had taken relief elsewhere then I would have been at a major disadvantage IMO.

Not if you dont want to.....

 

[DCB]

Aye, current book does have the usual new decisions. Excellent bedtime reading if you have trouble sleeping.

 

[Herbie]

Thanks for your comments. In relation to herb's points:
1. The ball was on the path. Not sure what you mean by the exact definition.
2. The ball WAS dropped in the wrong position. ie Not nearest point of relief then 1 club length but just behind the path probably within 1 club lemgth hence the reason it he touched the path with his club as the ball had moved forward a little.
3. It was not a tree or branch But the wooden edging which determines the path.

Hope this helps

3OTT

I put the questions as a prompt for all golf rule questions, perhaps the path one confused, but you know what I mean.

I would say penalty in the case you have described now I understand it more.