FAO any stat keepers

[KeefG]

Here's a question for all the stat keepers out there:

I use golfers diary to record all my stats, GIR, putts, Fairways hit etc etc

If, for arguments sake, you play a par 4 and are approx 2yds off the green on the fringe with your 2nd shot and you elect to use your putter from the fringe...

Do you count it as 2 putts which would signify a GIR (which it technically isnt) or would you count it as 1 putt which would then falsely (i believe) improve your putting stats?

 

[Dave3498]

Like the famous saying - 'There are lies, damn lies, and statistics.' However you want to play it is the answer. In my opinion it is simply the number of time you use your putter, other than to recover from behind a tree or something. If you are putting to 'hole it' then that to me counts as a putt.

 

[KeefG]

I agree, but then the amount of GIR you allegedly hit is untrue and misleading!!

 

[Adrena1in]

Good point really. On the first cut of the fringe I would probably count that as GIR and 2 putts. If the 2nd cut is short and I'm putting from 10 yards off the green or something, (which would be rare), I'd call it not regulation and 1 putt.

 

[Imurg]

Ah the wonders of statistics.....................

 

[KeefG]

To look at it another way....say its a par 4 and with my 3rd shot I am a couple of feet off the green on the fringe and use the putter, from which I leave it short but then putt again and hole it, I will only count that as 1 putt as its the only putt taken on the green!

When it doesnt affect my GIR stats then I take it as the actual number of putts on the green!

 

[welshjim22]

Just because i use the putter i don't see whythat would change my GIR. GIR is GIR, isn't it?

 

[Dave3498]

I don't see why it effects your GIR stats. You don't have to reconcile your GIR and Putts with the gross score for the hole if you are truly applying statitics. Your are really trying to find out how good you are at hitting GIR and how good you are at putting. Presumably you have a computer program or something that will not allow you to do what I have just stated, if so, then you have to follow the program but it won't give you your true performance.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

I will only count a GIR as such if I'm on the putting surface. If I'm on the fringe I'll put it down as a missed green but if I then take my putter from the fringe it will count as two putts. If the ball is off the fringe though (say 5 yards short of the green) but I elect to putt instead of chip I'll mark it as a missed green but will only count the putts once the ball is on the putting surface. I feel that just because I elected to putt rather than chip, it is still and approach shot and not a putt

 

[TonyN]

O no, Keef, this can of worms was spilt a month or two back, you should have seen the mess.

Jezz, give this one a swerve mate

Keef you keep stats so you no where to improve right? If you use a putting stroke, record it as a putt, because if you keep getting around the edge of the green (fringe) and 3 putting, then yeah, your long putting is going to need the work.

If you keep getting in same place but are taking mostly 2's and the occasion 1 then you know the putting is ok, maybe its the approaches that need tweaking to get you in 1 put range more often.

My main advice would be, just dont kid yourself for the sake of making the stats look good, it kinda defeats the object. Atleast, this is what I would do if I kept stats anyway.

HTH

 

[Dave3498]

My main advice would be, just dont kid yourself for the sake of making the stats look good, it kinda defeats the object. Atleast, this is what I would do if I kept stats anyway.

Couldn't agree more Tony.

 

[haplesshacker]

Keef. Not this old can of worms. I've had my fair share of 'debate' on this one, and as I had probably had the strongest views on this last time. Here goes.

Ultimately what and how you keep your stats is up to you. As long as you keep it the same forever. However don't expect to compare your stats with anyone else, pro or mates, as it will be meaningless.

Back to the green question. Assume a par 4 for arguments sake.

If the ball is on the putting surface in 2 (ie. par less 2 putt), then it's a GIR.

If it lands on the fringe on the second shot. It's not GIR, no matter how close the ball is to the pin.

If you 2 putt from the putting surface, then it's a 2 putt.

If you putt from the fringe, and then hole out on the next putt. Then it's a single putt.

If you hole out from the fringe, it's zero putts. Again regardless of club used.

As I see it, you can use whatever club you like from the fringe, but it ain't a putt as far as putting stats are concerned.

I believe this is how the pros stats are 'marked'. If it's good enough for them.........

Phew. Open the flood gates.

 

[Imurg]

I agree with you Hapless. Where's the difference in choosing to put from 5 yards off the green to choosing to putt from the fringe? Putts are - or at least should be - counted on the green. Otherwise its just another shot.

 

[RGDave]

RG heads for the bomb shelter.

I don't record anything off the green as GIR. If I did, I'd have the GIR stats of a 7-8 h'cap....

As for the putting, you have to decide for yourself. If I can reasonably expect myself to get down in two and play the first of those with a putter and mess it up, then miss the next, it's a 3 putt.

If I'm miles away from the flag, I'll chip it anyway.....

 

[Herbie]

If the stat worshipers were to make any genuine effort to make their stats accurate, then GIR is GIR and putting on the green is putting.

The comments I have read here show how fraudulent stats are in the hands of the average golfer.

Why pick and choose when you call GIR, GIR, and why pick and choose what you record as a putt or not a putt? I wish someone with the nouse at R&A headquaters would change it and simply say No of strokes to the green and No of strokes on the green, perhaps then people might get their stats more accurate?

 

[haplesshacker]

If the stat worshipers were to make any genuine effort to make their stats accurate, then GIR is GIR and putting on the green is putting.

The comments I have read here show how fraudulent stats are in the hands of the average golfer.

Why pick and choose when you call GIR, GIR, and why pick and choose what you record as a putt or not a putt? I wish someone with the nouse at R&A headquaters would change it and simply say No of strokes to the green and No of strokes on the green, perhaps then people might get their stats more accurate?

HNJ. Whilst I maybe a stat worshiper. I'm guessing that you're not having a pop at me, as I believe I'm correct. If not please correct me.

What annoys me is when people claim to hit all GIRs because they count the fringe as green. I even knew one chap who used to count GS bunkers as GIR as they were part of the greens!! Oh, and people who count GIRs as net GIRs. What's the point?

Oh damn. Drawn right into this one again!

 

[clubchamp07]

Is there any Stat collector sites online so we can record our every game?

 

[KeefG]

You ever get that feeling where you wished you had just kept your mouth shut?

 

[funkyfred]

If the stat worshipers were to make any genuine effort to make their stats accurate, then GIR is GIR and putting on the green is putting.

The comments I have read here show how fraudulent stats are in the hands of the average golfer.

Why pick and choose when you call GIR, GIR, and why pick and choose what you record as a putt or not a putt? I wish someone with the nouse at R&A headquaters would change it and simply say No of strokes to the green and No of strokes on the green, perhaps then people might get their stats more accurate?

HNJ. Whilst I maybe a stat worshiper. I'm guessing that you're not having a pop at me, as I believe I'm correct. If not please correct me.

What annoys me is when people claim to hit all GIRs because they count the fringe as green. I even knew one chap who used to count GS bunkers as GIR as they were part of the greens!! Oh, and people who count GIRs as net GIRs. What's the point?

Oh damn. Drawn right into this one again!

Hapless, sorry but I have to disagree with you on this one. I'm one of those who use the net GIR figure to work out my stats, thats one of the reasons of having h/c's. Not to work out stats I know, but to make it a level playing field. I played with a guy last week who hit a driver and I think he said a 3 iron and put it through our 586 yard 8th hole, he is playing a different game to you and me and played of a 6 h/c. If because of my handicap I am allowed to reach the green in 4 and then have my 2 putts and walk of with my 6 for 2 points then thats fine with me.

Of course all the other stats are as the balls lie, ie on or off the fairway or green, (fringe not included) I can remember VJ knocking the ball in on the 16th at the Players Championship a few years ago with a 3 or 5 wood from just off the back of the green.

 

[Parmo]

I used to keep stats last season but don't see the point in it anymore. I know if my drives are straight or I am hitting greens and really don't need a piece of software to tell me my driving has been poor or that my bunker play is great.

I find them just another piece of kit to over complicate the game.