Divot versus aim

[timd77]

Hi, I don’t think I’ve posted in this section before so here goes.

My iron shot shape tends to be a cut/fade, starting roughly on target and finishing 10-15 yards right of target. Even a flushed, well hit iron will be like this. Sometimes that’s on the green, sometimes it’s OOB!

Case in point today where I end up laughing at my divot. So, if the flag/my aim is 12 o’clock, the ball started roughly there but finished at 2 o’clock. Looked at my divot and that was pointed at 10 o’clock!

I have a steep angle of attack stemming back to me trying to make sure I hit ball then turf (used to pick the ball off) and I know I have an over the top swing.

Is this the text book outcome of an over the top, exit left swing?

Planning on having lessons over the winter and I think this will be the first thing I’ll ask about.

 

[bobmac]

Yes, the divot shows your swing path.
The swing path is VERY hard to change.
My advice is always for you, aim at 2 o clock and get you grip checked, it may be a bit weak. Then your swing path will be straight.
This is me aiming at the tree...note where my feet are pointing.
Ball went straight.

 

[timd77]

So aim the body right and the club face straight?

 

[jim8flog]

When considering divots there is a lot that can be learnt from them.

Look at the very first cut in the turf - this will give you angle of the club face at impact.
Look at the direction of the divot - will tell you swing path.
Look at the shape of the divot - this will tell you if you rotate your wrists through impact.

One of the reasons I hate ranges so much is that there is no divot to learn from.

 

[rulie]

Put a cardboard shoe box just outside the ball, in the direction of play, with half of the box behind the ball's location. Hit the ball, not the box!

 

[bobmac]

So aim the body right and the club face straight?

No, the clubface should square to your body/aim.
I'm betting your grip is a touch weak which is why your ball doesn't start left

 

[timd77]

Thanks all, something to work on at the range!

 

[timd77]

 

[timd77]

No, the clubface should square to your body/aim.
I'm betting your grip is a touch weak which is why your ball doesn't start left

Took a couple of photos posted above, trying to show my grip. Do they look weak?

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

I can 100% confirm what @bobmac has said about changing your swing path…it sounds straightforward and maybe just like any old change to your swing….but it is very…very…hard. Be wary of starting down that path if it is ever suggested.

I have managed to change mine (a swing path that I had developed and had engrained in me over near 45yrs of playing), but it has taken a lot of lessons and a lot of practice over three years - yet what had become my bad old way can still sneak in if I try and manipulate the club in the swing.

I was willing to try to change as I had retired and so had the time. Besides…that old way was wrecking my golf and killing my enjoyment of the game.

 

[Beezerk]

My divot is exactly the same, points anywhere between 10 and 11 o clock in relation to target. I tried aiming right to try and neutralise the swing path but it just feels really uncomfortable, I’ve sort of resigned myself I’ll never ever hit a straight ball

 

[timd77]

I can 100% confirm what @bobmac has said about changing your swing path…it sounds straightforward and maybe just like any old change to your swing….but it is very…very…hard. Be wary of starting down that path if it is ever suggested.

I have managed to change mine (a swing path that I had developed and had engrained in me over near 45yrs of playing), but it has taken a lot of lessons and a lot of practice over three years - yet what had become my bad old way can still sneak in if I try and manipulate the club in the swing.

I was willing to try to change as I had retired and so had the time. Besides…that old way was wrecking my golf and killing my enjoyment of the game.

I don’t think I’ve got a major change in me to be honest, I don’t get much time to practice. That said, I’m determined to go up the range a couple of times a month over winter.

My divot is exactly the same, points anywhere between 10 and 11 o clock in relation to target. I tried aiming right to try and neutralise the swing path but it just feels really uncomfortable, I’ve sort of resigned myself I’ll never ever hit a straight ball

It’s a recent thing from me. I’ve got from pretty much plucking the ball off the turf, to really trying to compress the ball, and I think that’s caused me to have an overly steep angle of attack and affected the swing path. And as Bob says, I think that combined with the weak grip (assuming it is, looks it to me) is giving these results. Very frustrating because I feel like I can hit this irons well but obviously I can’t get better if I’m missing the target by 15-20 yards!

Interestingly, I don’t have this issue 8i to wedges, just seems to be the longer irons.

 

[Beezerk]

I don’t think I’ve got a major change in me to be honest, I don’t get much time to practice. That said, I’m determined to go up the range a couple of times a month over winter.

It’s a recent thing from me. I’ve got from pretty much plucking the ball off the turf, to really trying to compress the ball, and I think that’s caused me to have an overly steep angle of attack and affected the swing path. And as Bob says, I think that combined with the weak grip (assuming it is, looks it to me) is giving these results. Very frustrating because I feel like I can hit this irons well but obviously I can’t get better if I’m missing the target by 15-20 yards!

Interestingly, I don’t have this issue 8i to wedges, just seems to be the longer irons.

My bag goes from 8 iron to 5 hybrid as any iron longer than an 8 is a disaster zone for me lol. Odd but that’s just how my gapping works out.

 

[bobmac]

View attachment 55833View attachment 55834

Bingo, your left hand is weak.
The next time you're at the range, just tweak the left hand a touch clockwise.
Not too much though just enough so it feels a bid strange. Keep tweaking it until the ball stops fading.
Your right hand also may need tweaking in the future too, but focus on your left hand at the moment.
The idea is to get the clubface square (perpendicular) to the swingpath, which is now straight because you are now aiming right.


As SILH says, even after 3 years of practicing, his old swing can sneak back in without warning.
By aiming right and squaring the c/face, you can let the swing go where it wants and it feels comfortable.
That frees up the mind for other stuff like ''I wonder how much a new razor costs''

 

[bobmac]

My divot is exactly the same, points anywhere between 10 and 11 o clock in relation to target. I tried aiming right to try and neutralise the swing path but it just feels really uncomfortable, I’ve sort of resigned myself I’ll never ever hit a straight ball

If Luke's target is figure A green, he is aiming right.



But because his swing path is left and his clubface is square to that path, he will hit the green all day

 

[Beezerk]

If Luke's target is figure A green, he is aiming right.

View attachment 55840

But because his swing path is left and his clubface is square to that path, he will hit the green all day

Thanks Bob, I did try that a few years ago but had really mixed results. Maybe I should try again and really practice this time.
BTW OP sorry for the hijack

 

[bobmac]

Thanks Bob, I did try that a few years ago but had really mixed results. Maybe I should try again and really practice this time.
BTW OP sorry for the hijack

Pick a target and aim as normal, then tweak the grip and hit 6 balls which will all go left.
Then imagine where the balls would have landed if you had aimed right of your target.
You've just hit 6 balls straight and onto the green.
Success breeds confidence breeds success etc

 

[timd77]

Bingo, your left hand is weak.
The next time you're at the range, just tweak the left hand a touch clockwise.
Not too much though just enough so it feels a bid strange. Keep tweaking it until the ball stops fading.
Your right hand also may need tweaking in the future too, but focus on your left hand at the moment.
The idea is to get the clubface square (perpendicular) to the swingpath, which is now straight because you are now aiming right.

View attachment 55838
As SILH says, even after 3 years of practicing, his old swing can sneak back in without warning.
By aiming right and squaring the c/face, you can let the swing go where it wants and it feels comfortable.
That frees up the mind for other stuff like ''I wonder how much a new razor costs''

Great, thanks Bob. Very interesting!

It’s designer stubble I’ll have you know!

 

[rulie]

Took a couple of photos posted above, trying to show my grip. Do they look weak?

The "v" formed by the thumb and index finger should point towards the area between your right shoulder and chin - both hands. As others have noted, left hand looks a little weak.

 

[timd77]

The "v" formed by the thumb and index finger should point towards the area between your right shoulder and chin - both hands. As others have noted, left hand looks a little weak.

Yeh, once I took the photo I could see it was off. It used to be worse than that!