CSS fair or not?

[Fyldewhite]

Sorry, I meant CSS in above post. Agree it may happen elsewhere but is still very rare overall, certainly south of the border. I understand what you are saying and that the ability of the golfers on the day will dictate the CSS. However if the members of all three clubs are a random selection of folk then the average play on any day (and CSS) should be around the same. The fundamental problem here is that statistically one club should not contain a significantly larger percentage of players playing to handicap if all the clubs are operating the system the same way and have similar split of members. Blaming CSS is putting the cart before the horse. The CSS should only be consistently different if something else is affecting the averages.

 

[19th]

I think you are correct BUT I only want to get back to playing against par of the course or for that matter that stupid thing call SSS and not find that when I hit 6 over par that it is really 10 over CSS and 9 over SSS.

NO!!

I beat par by 6 - I had a good round, honest..don't say I performed in double figures. I was proud of 6 now I hang my head in shame....10!!

 

[HawkeyeMS]

CSS is not a measure of the difficulty of the course it's a ridiculous figure based entirely on how well club golfers play on the day and I, like Imurg, James and Murph find it very odd.

Comps at my place are played over 2 days with a CSS being calculated for each day. Invariably the CSS is lower one day than the next. Last weekend it was 70 on Saturday and 71 on Sunday (SSS is 71). Conditions were pretty even for both days so how can CSS be based on conditions?

And if the course was easier on Saturday, how come only 3 of the 15 cat 1 and 2 players were in the buffer zone? Surely if the course was playing easy the lower handicaps would score better? I hit the ball really well but struggled around the green and ended up in the buffer, that had nothing to do with conditions, that was me chipping poorly.

I just don't get why my handicap should be affected by other players. The calculate SSS so why not use it, I can tell you know that my handicap would be exactly the same if SSS was used so exactly what is the point of calculating another number?

 

[JustOne]

I hit the ball really well but struggled around the green and ended up in the buffer, that had nothing to do with conditions, that was me chipping poorly.

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Wot he said. CSS is a farce. IMHO we should play what is in front of us and get a h/cap accordingly.

 

[Ethan]

The problem is comparing handicaps from Carnoustie, par 72, with your local municipal, also par 72. SSS is a decent, if imperfect, way of reducing the disparity. CSS is simply a further adjustment to allow for weather, and is also OK, but imperfect.

The CSS doesn't change all that much, and changes are driven by the play of better players.

If anyone has a better plan, please describe it.

 

[Marko77]

If anyone has a better plan, please describe it.

Play to the course par?

 

[Ethan]

If anyone has a better plan, please describe it.

Play to the course par?

i think you misread. I said better plan!

That means that players cannot bring their handicaps to another course or play matches against other clubs which are easier/harder.

Par is an arbitrary notion anyway. No better or worse than SSS/CSS, although perhaps easier to understand.

 

[HawkeyeMS]

If anyone has a better plan, please describe it.

Play to the course par?

i think you misread. I said better plan!

That means that players cannot bring their handicaps to another course or play matches against other clubs which are easier/harder.

Par is an arbitrary notion anyway. No better or worse than SSS/CSS, although perhaps easier to understand.

Play to the SSS?

My course is par 72, SSS 71, my original h'cap was calculated against SSS by virtue of shooting an 80 for one of my cards.

So I shoot 8 over par to get a h'cap of 9 and now I invariably have to shoot 7 over to play to it.

Something doesn't add up somewhere along the line. If SSS is good enough for calculating h'cap then it should be good enough for adjusting it.

 

[Imurg]

My thoughts exactly.

You can't ever level the playing field completely handicap wise. Carnoustie is always going to be harder than SomeTown Muni. Even if SSS is different, a 10 handicapper from Carnoustie is going to be like a 4 or 5 at a lot of other places.

And on the subject of CSS being an adjustment for weather, I'm afraid that's simply not true.
Our Midweek medal last wednesday was played in ok-ish conditions for the front 9 and then a howling wind and pouring rain for the back. Most played in these conditions and CSS went down a shot.
CSS is all about how players score. Weather may influence it but in poor weather you may still score well. How many times have you played in perfect conditions and played like a plonker?
If you decide not play in a comp just because the weather is bad and you don't want to go up .1 then that's handicap protection - or the "B" word!
A bit of weather adds to the challenge. If I play below SSS I deserve to be cut, whether its a blazing hot, still day or blowing a hurricane with sideways rain.

As Hawkeye says, our original handicaps were judged against SSS.
Surely it is simply wrong to judge them against anything else.