Coronavirus - how is it/has it affected you?

[Ethan]

I haven’t seen Ethan’s post as he is the sole member of my blocked list. Always was back in the day and always will be.

I can imagine what it says though, typed as it no doubt was, through screams of virtue signalling anguish, accompanied by the sound of the frustrated snap of Scotty putter shafts - his equivalent of a comic collection. Only gentle ribbing kids - don’t hit that report button! Still a safe space!! ? ??

I’m all for live and let live but we all have to draw a line somewhere. I suggest the forumites that “skweam twoll” do the same to me. ??‍

That pitiful post is the forum equivalent of a toddler reaching into their nappy and throwing poo.

 

[Ethan]

For clarity, I do and will continue to wear a mask if I am likely to be close to someone. If inside a public building that might happen ,because unlike outside, I might not be able to move away ( 2 m, or so)
But in this discussion we are talking the merits or otherwise of keeping mask wearing a legal requirement.
I suggest that there would be a difficult impractical situation to have it legally binding if and when places like nightclubs, cinemas, theatres are opened.
Think about it. How the hell can you have people dancing( they call it) in a nightclub having to wear a mask? They wouldn't wear a mask.- period.
Then some journo, etc demands the police enforce the law against these lawbreakers.
Same for cinemas and theatres.
These are places that masks fit the criteria for them to be worn in.
The Entertainment industry has crie out for re opening.
The Gov clearly want to do as asked, but they see the above difficulties, so they cannot keep the law as is and re open.
It would be chaos.
And, silh, whilst you want to see masks worn in appropriate places, where does your argument lie when you are also demanding the opening up of entertainment?
Masks do work in some circumstances, namely where droplets may pass between people.
And Im talking ordinary blue masks - not surgical ones?

They should keep masks as mandatory on public transport at least. Let nightclubs etc do what they want but keep track and trace so the inevitable outbreaks can be followed up. If the number of outbreaks is very low after a month or so, then perhaps do away with that then. Stopping all regs all at once make it very difficult to know which elements matter.

 

[GreiginFife]

This counts as a face covering, right? Asking for a friend...

 

[Jamesbrown]

I don’t believe in their efficacy. I think the advice in the beginning was sound with covid and masks before disaster capitalists lobbied for them realising it was a good little earner.
The WHO’s budget is 30% predictable and the rest cap in hand. Donors have their preferences and and would like see change in policies when they part with their money.
Couple the lobbying with SPI-B psychological nudging with a pull at your heart string messaging like “my mask protects you” giving this air of social responsibility and guilt tripped into masking up, here we are with this new culture war.
I saw no real world evidence of efficacy. Nearly a year in of masks and cases rose and rose.

If you want to wear one - great. Get personal protective ones, shave your face, get professionally face fit, wear a air fed hood. Whatever. Maximise YOUR protection.

 

[SocketRocket]

I don’t believe in their efficacy. I think the advice in the beginning was sound with covid and masks before disaster capitalists lobbied for them realising it was a good little earner.
The WHO’s budget is 30% predictable and the rest cap in hand. Donors have their preferences and and would like see change in policies when they part with their money.
Couple the lobbying with SPI-B psychological nudging with a pull at your heart string messaging like “my mask protects you” giving this air of social responsibility and guilt tripped into masking up, here we are with this new culture war.
I saw no real world evidence of efficacy. Nearly a year in of masks and cases rose and rose.

If you want to wear one - great. Get personal protective ones, shave your face, get professionally face fit, wear a air fed hood. Whatever. Maximise YOUR protection.

I suspect that's a bit subjective. I would suggest that most infections are transmitted where masks are not worn.

 

[Jamesbrown]

I suspect that's a bit subjective. I would suggest that most infections are transmitted where masks are not worn.

I would suggest most infections that led to deaths were transmitted in health care settings were masks are worn.

 

[GreiginFife]

I don’t believe in their efficacy. I think the advice in the beginning was sound with covid and masks before disaster capitalists lobbied for them realising it was a good little earner.
The WHO’s budget is 30% predictable and the rest cap in hand. Donors have their preferences and and would like see change in policies when they part with their money.
Couple the lobbying with SPI-B psychological nudging with a pull at your heart string messaging like “my mask protects you” giving this air of social responsibility and guilt tripped into masking up, here we are with this new culture war.
I saw no real world evidence of efficacy. Nearly a year in of masks and cases rose and rose.

If you want to wear one - great. Get personal protective ones, shave your face, get professionally face fit, wear a air fed hood. Whatever. Maximise YOUR protection.

It's a tricky one to prove or disprove IMO, we have no comparison data where this has happened before. On the flip side we saw cases rise at xx rate even with masks but there is no logical reason not to suggest that it may have been yy rate without masks. There is just nothing to refer back to to say otherwise.

Whilst I don't believe they are a fix or a solution, in the same way that pouring sand in an engine block won't stop an oil leak, it will certainly slow it down and I'd prefer that over oil free flowing out of my engine. If the virus is expelled in breath then, whilst it won't stop the expelling of breath, a barrier in front may/should minimise the reach and spread.

Yes, some will escape, but like the sand, I'd be more confident that the flow was being at least restricted until I can get out of the situation.

 

[The Dog.]

I would suggest most infections that led to deaths were transmitted in health care settings were masks are worn.

Totally agree and the stats back this up. The number of deaths that are nosocomial is very high.

 

[drdel]

I thought a mask was to help reduce the wearer's propensity to spread coughs and sneezes distributing droplets and, to a lesser degree, inhaling potentially contaminated air.

Obviously the more dense and fine the medium is the more effective filter it is, however high filtration also impacts the ease of breathing. Thus any filtration is better than no filter.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

I'm talking about the alternative viewpoint about the efficacy of non surgical facemasks, the science suggests the gains on either side are marginal so when you talk about people 'not giving a ***' it's just not the sort of language that is helpful. The are plenty of scientists on the other side of your viewpoint who would argue just as strongly as you do that the cloth and paper variants that the vast majority wear do almost nothing to stop the aerosol spray.

Struggling with this as it seems to me to be 100% obvious that if I sneeze or cough when wearing a mask then the dispersion of droplets from my sneeze or cough is going to be significantly less than were I not wearing a mask. No mask - much greater and wider dispersion of my droplets. That seems kind of obvious unless I am missing something.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

I thought that was just a personal thing from the medical man on the podium.
It was in the three things HE would do.
Correct me if I am wrong but it’s not in the official guidance.
But would just be good manners.

What official guidance? - there is none other than us using our individual common sense...and that is the nub of the problem. But I would most certainly accept the comments of the chief medical and scientific officers on what they would do in the circumstances as the guidance that the man-in-the-middle seemed unable to give.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

It was tongue in cheek, I will have no feelings about anyone wearing/not wearing a mask in my presence. I am just asking what right anyone has to ask anyone to put on a mask when there is no legal requirement to do so? You may feel it's the 'right' thing to do however they may feel equally strongly that it is now their right not to wear one. In all likelihood I will probably carry on wearing one on public transport just because it is such a confined space however I would also not dream of demanding that a non-wearer 'masks up'.

My point was more about me being asked to remove my mask by someone claiming that my mask-wearing made him feel uncomfortable.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

For clarity, I do and will continue to wear a mask if I am likely to be close to someone. If inside a public building that might happen ,because unlike outside, I might not be able to move away ( 2 m, or so)
But in this discussion we are talking the merits or otherwise of keeping mask wearing a legal requirement.
I suggest that there would be a difficult impractical situation to have it legally binding if and when places like nightclubs, cinemas, theatres are opened.
Think about it. How the hell can you have people dancing( they call it) in a nightclub having to wear a mask? They wouldn't wear a mask.- period.
Then some journo, etc demands the police enforce the law against these lawbreakers.
Same for cinemas and theatres.
These are places that masks fit the criteria for them to be worn in.
The Entertainment industry has crie out for re opening.
The Gov clearly want to do as asked, but they see the above difficulties, so they cannot keep the law as is and re open.
It would be chaos.
And, silh, whilst you want to see masks worn in appropriate places, where does your argument lie when you are also demanding the opening up of entertainment?
Masks do work in some circumstances, namely where droplets may pass between people.
And Im talking ordinary blue masks - not surgical ones?

I suggest that venues have the right - if they so wish and without fear of being accused of discrimination - to require the wearing of a mask as a condition of entry and that they reserve the right to have removed from the premises anyone not wearing a mask. And if they wish they continue with track and trace.

 

[road2ruin]

My point was more about me being asked to remove my mask by someone claiming that my mask-wearing made him feel uncomfortable.

Essentially no one has the right to ask anyone to put on or take off a mask regardless of how uncomfortable they might feel IMO.

 

[clubchamp98]

I suggest that venues have the right - if they so wish and without fear of being accused of discrimination - to require the wearing of a mask as a condition of entry and that they reserve the right to have removed from the premises anyone not wearing a mask.

I would agree yes.
Just call it part of the dress code.
No mask go somewhere else.

 

[BiMGuy]

I would agree yes.
Just call it part of the dress code.
No mask go somewhere else.

What about people who wear a sunflower lanyard?

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

I would agree yes.
Just call it part of the dress code.
No mask go somewhere else.

...and in a few months time, when most over 18s have had the opportunity to have been fully vaccinated, I suggest that venues will require a vaccination certificate/passport as a condition of entry.

 

[road2ruin]

I suggest that venues have the right - if they so wish and without fear of being accused of discrimination - to require the wearing of a mask as a condition of entry and that they reserve the right to have removed from the premises anyone not wearing a mask. And if they wish they continue with track and trace.

I think this is what the Govt is aiming for with the whole personal responsibility and putting the rules back to the general population, I wonder whether some shops will decide to do the same. I can't see public transport doing it purely because of how they would manage it although I'm assuming they will ask people to do so given it's a confined space and then rely on people to follow their guidance.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Essentially no one has the right to ask anyone to put on or take off a mask regardless of how uncomfortable they might feel IMO.

everybody has a right to ask and a right to refuse - but nobody has a right to demand or to physically remove another's mask. If asked to put on a mask I suspect that in most (I cannot in all honesty say all) circumstances I expect that I will do so. If the request is ludicrous or unreasonably made, and if it caused me a problem carrying out what I was doing or about to do - then I might well look to extricate myself from the situation.

 

[clubchamp98]

What about people who wear a sunflower lanyard?

Do people wear lanyards when they go out out.?
They could stuff it up their mask.!