Coronavirus - how is it/has it affected you?

[Deleted member 15344]

No , you've read my post wrongly. In the bit of mine you've quoted, you should have noted that I said some.
And I have numbered the post that started this aspect of the debate. RtR supported that post and talked in his about "a month"
As the posts went on he talks more in general terms describing a time in the future , further forward, more akin to what I support. Of course, restrictions should be lifted as vaccinations take effect and numbers fall greatly. That will happen, but not in a month .

I believe that some level of relaxation will happen from February Half term - schools mainly primary schools will open up from the first week in March amongst other businesses and potentially outdoor sports like golf and tennis clubs.

The indoor stuff - gyms , pubs etc. won’t be until after Easter

And we will be in some level of Tier system from the end of Feb/beginning of March.

All depending on if the vaccine levels continue as they are , the number of cases continue as they are and the hospital admissions reduce as they expect.

Whether or not that’s the right thing to do I’m not sure but that’s what I see happening - there will be some level of reducing the lockdown after half term.

 

[Ethan]

Daughter in law, who has been sheilding pretty much from the start due to a compromised immune system, has just found out she won't be vaccinated due to her immune system problems. Unhappy is a massive understatement

Really? Who decided that, her GP? She needs the vax more than most, and it does not pose a risk to those with impaired immune systems. The only contraindications to the Pfizer are allergy to specific components of the vaccine. It is noted in the Information for Healthcare Professionals that:

Immunocompromised persons, including individuals receiving immunosuppressant therapy, may have a diminished immune response to the vaccine. No data are available about concomitant use of immunosuppressants.

That is not stated as a reason not to give, though.

 

[Deleted member 25172]

Depends what you mean by 'get going'. And for the umpteenth, but probably not last, time, IT. ISN'T. ONLY. ABOUT. DEATHS.

You keep banging on about that, so let me reply - I. KNOW. THAT. IT'S. NOT. ALL. ABOUT. THE. DEATHS.

Deaths and hospital admissions seem to correlate somewhat in regards to the age groups as already stated, accounts for 95% of all deaths. So, when the vaccination of these groups have been completed, an extra 3-4 weeks to let the vaccine work it's magic, hospital admissions should see a decrease, and we could look at relaxation. Would you agree?

If not, at what point would you suggest that any relaxations are done?

 

[SocketRocket]

You keep banging on about that, so let me reply - I. KNOW. THAT. IT'S. NOT. ALL. ABOUT. THE. DEATHS.

Deaths and hospital admissions seem to correlate somewhat in regards to the age groups as already stated, accounts for 95% of all deaths. So, when the vaccination of these groups have been completed, an extra 3-4 weeks to let the vaccine work it's magic, hospital admissions should see a decrease, and we could look at relaxation. Would you agree?

If not, at what point would you suggest that any relaxations are done?

View attachment 34717

Should and Could are not definites, death and infection rates are.

 

[Ethan]

You keep banging on about that, so let me reply - I. KNOW. THAT. IT'S. NOT. ALL. ABOUT. THE. DEATHS.

Deaths and hospital admissions seem to correlate somewhat in regards to the age groups as already stated, accounts for 95% of all deaths. So, when the vaccination of these groups have been completed, an extra 3-4 weeks to let the vaccine work it's magic, hospital admissions should see a decrease, and we could look at relaxation. Would you agree?

If not, at what point would you suggest that any relaxations are done?

View attachment 34717

You will have to forgive me. Your previous statement mentioned only deaths, and an obsession with death rates only is a thing amongst those who are desperate to remove lockdown measures asap.

I would certainly agree that vaccination of the higher risk groups will cut both hospital admissions and deaths. I would guess that we will start to see an effect soon, although it is difficult to assign what proportion of that will be due to vax and what to lockdown restrictions. It seems clear that the Govt sees the point at which they can declare that all the over 70s plus CEVs are vacc'd (plus at least 2 weeks) as a key milestone, followed by over 50s and other less serious at risks. These milestones are risky, though as any statement which sounds too positive runs the risk of lots of people abandoning social distancing and all the rest.

 

[Jimaroid]

At the start of the pandemic, my wife noted that a lot of her personality disordered patients, typically very hard to treat and the cause of many problems for the mental health teams, were rather quiet. These people tend to wax and wane with rises and dips in the pandemic. In terms of what she would call hard pathology, there is still a bunch of people with schizophrenia and other mental health disorders who need treated and managed, but no signs that these numbers are increasing. There have been reports of increased numbers of suicides at points during the pandemic, although the interpretation of that is disputed, but there does not appear to be any evidence of widespread mental health problems (of the sort that need medical intervention) in the wider community. There are loads of people on social media complaining about there mental health, but that sometimes seems to be a sort of ennui or unsettledness, and in my opinion is likely not a lasting mental health issue.

My wife's in CAMHS and seeing the softer mental health issues, especially amongst younger and deprived families are increasing in number and severity. Obivously I don't know or see the data so can't confirm or say why, but may be able to speculate that the catchment area includes some very deprived areas that appear to be getting hit harder due to socio-economic aspects of lockdown.

 

[Ethan]

My wife's in CAMHS and seeing the softer mental health issues, especially amongst younger and deprived families are increasing in number and severity. Obivously I don't know or see the data so can't confirm or say why, but may be able to speculate that the catchment area includes some very deprived areas that appear to be getting hit harder due to socio-economic aspects of lockdown.

Possibly, and CAMHS is an aspect which sees a range of issues reflected around families, sometimes parental issues expressed through the kids. I have no doubt there is an increase in softer stuff, but my point was that some of that stuff does not translate into actual "hard" psychopathology, admissions, suicides and so on. Almost every family is seeing more tension, frustration and stress, but much of that will evaporate as lockdown restrictions are lifted and will cause few lasting problems. I agree that more deprived households have less resource to assist with it all.

 

[bobmac]

It seems to me that once the people who are most at risk have been vaccinated, (plus 2 weeks), then everyone including those who are less at risk can expect a relaxation in the restrictions.
I appears the argument is when that will happen.
As no-one has a time machine, we're all guessing but my 'better safe than sorry' guesstimate would be April, as long as the numbers keep reducing.

It's going to be a good summer if we can all hold on for a bit longer.
If you can't stay in, stay safe everyone

 

[Deleted member 25172]

Should and Could are not definites, death and infection rates are.

If you cannot read my post and understand that those would be requisites for a relaxation even for me. Well, there's nothing I can do about that. I think you actually do understand that, but you just want to keep going for the sake of it.

You wil have to forgive me. Your previous statement mentioned only deaths, and an obsession with death rates only is a thing amongst those who are desperate to remove lockdown measures asap.

I would certainly agree that vaccination of the higher risk groups will cut both hospital admissions and deaths. I would guess that we will start to see an effect soon, although it is difficult to assign what proportion of that will be due to vax and what to lockdown restrictions. It seems clear that the Govt sees the point at which they can declare that all the over 70s plus CEVs are vacc'd (plus at least 2 weeks) as a key milestone, followed by over 50s and other less serious at risks. These milestones are risky, though as any statement which sounds too positive runs the risk of lots of people abandoning social distancing and all the rest.

I could've been clearer, but to me I've always seen them as highly intertwined. My bad.

 

[hovis]

As no-one has a time machine, we're all guessing but my 'better safe than sorry' guesstimate would be April, as long as the numbers keep reducing.

everyone

I'm going to stick my neck out and say there is no way on God's earth the government are going to keep us locked up until April. Even though the government have specifically said they don't know when lockdown will end the majority of people hitched their star to mid late February. Purely a guess but I'm going with some schools back after the break and lockdown ends a week later releasing us into teirs

 

[bobmac]

Purely a guess but I'm going with some schools back after the break and lockdown ends a week later releasing us into teirs

Let's hope so for everyone's benefit.

 

[Jimaroid]

Possibly, and CAMHS is an aspect which sees a range of issues reflected around families, sometimes parental issues expressed through the kids. I have no doubt there is an increase in softer stuff, but my point was that some of that stuff does not translate into actual "hard" psychopathology, admissions, suicides and so on. Almost every family is seeing more tension, frustration and stress, but much of that will evaporate as lockdown restrictions are lifted and will cause few lasting problems.

No disagreement on the mental health aspect here. I do have a different view on whether they will evaporate as lockdown restrictions are lifted, I think it's just going to be differently bad due to the economic and political aftermath of the last year. I hope I'm wrong. I do believe we can lessen the future impact with some type of grand plan to rebuild in unity instead of looking backwards for blame but perhaps I'm just too optimistic on that one.

 

[User62651]

Echoing some other thougths here but wrt easing out of lockdown we messed up, now we have to pay - that means waiting months and months longer than other places to unlock until the whole vaccination program has completed imo. If we dont and open up again it's just thousands more unnescessary and avoidable deaths, which is borderline criminal to permit. Yes that creates no end of other problems but staying alive is more important, no matter peoples age. That's the price we have to pay (whilst waiting for vaccinations) for a combo of bad strategic decisions and a proportionately selfish exceptionalist populace.
Radio saying just now PM is going to outline another path out of lockdown this week, haven't we been here several times before?
Just wait for all the vaccinations, not sooner or it'll backfire....again.
Reducing restrictions to benefit economy argument is flawed, other countries showed early stringent control of virus works best for economic outcomes.

 

[Ethan]

No disagreement on the mental health aspect here. I do have a different view on whether they will evaporate as lockdown restrictions are lifted, I think it's just going to be differently bad due to the economic and political aftermath of the last year. I hope I'm wrong. I do believe we can lessen the future impact with some type of grand plan to rebuild in unity instead of looking backwards for blame but perhaps I'm just too optimistic on that one.

Well, there is, and will be, some genuine pathology in the population. But I get a bit pissed off at people complaining that because little Tarquin can't go to his karate lessons, it is damaging his mental health. No, it really isn't. There was some over entitled social media bimbo in the media today defending her decision to go to Dubai just before lockdown, for her mental health. She needs a kick up the arse, not demanding pandering attention from other people who will now be thinking "But what about my mental health, babes?" and getting reinforcement from others who also think they are missing out.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

Well, there is, and will be, some genuine pathology in the population. But I get a bit pissed off at people complaining that because little Tarquin can't go to his karate lessons, it is damaging his mental health. No, it really isn't. There was some over entitled social media bimbo in the media today defending her decision to go to Dubai just before lockdown, for her mental health. She needs a kick up the arse, not demanding pandering attention from other people who will now be thinking "But what about my mental health, babes?" and getting reinforcement from others who also think they are missing out.

Absolutely spot on, it’s almost like “mental health” is the latest fashion/buzz word for people to use as an excuse and imo, it lessens the impact for those in genuine need of help and who are struggling.

 

[Ethan]

I'm going to stick my neck out and say there is no way on God's earth the government are going to keep us locked up until April. Even though the government have specifically said they don't know when lockdown will end the majority of people hitched their star to mid late February. Purely a guess but I'm going with some schools back after the break and lockdown ends a week later releasing us into teirs

I think that is optimistic/ambitious, and schools will not open right after half term. Perhaps in some areas, but should be pinned to clear and notable drops in cases and deaths.

The last thing anybody needs is yet another false dawn leading to further and longer restrictions down the line.

 

[GB72]

Well, there is, and will be, some genuine pathology in the population. But I get a bit pissed off at people complaining that because little Tarquin can't go to his karate lessons, it is damaging his mental health. No, it really isn't. There was some over entitled social media bimbo in the media today defending her decision to go to Dubai just before lockdown, for her mental health. She needs a kick up the arse, not demanding pandering attention from other people who will now be thinking "But what about my mental health, babes?" and getting reinforcement from others who also think they are missing out.

No disagreement with what you say and I will admit that I have no idea as to what I am going through at the moment (child of the 70s so part of the don't talk about it' keep it all in until you have a breakdown generation) and I am probably guilty of brandishing the mental health card too easily due to a lack of real understanding. What I do know is that I am tired, unmotivated, quiet, maybe slightly withdrawn and sometimes randomly sad to a point of nearly being in tears. That is just not me. Don't get me wrong (and not to panic anyone on here) I am not suicidal and I would probably limit the impact at the moment to me be sometimes unpleasant to be around (couple of hours locked away with my xbox helps that) and me just generally not liking who I am at the moment.

I am a sensible, educated bloke. Lockdown has not hit me financially too much and I am honestly surprised at the impact that the lack of social interaction is having on me. What would help me, an hour at the weekend, sat in the garden (in a big warm coat) having a coffee and a chat with one other person, socially distanced. Basically something on the same risk level as a round of golf which, apparently, should be allowed.

 

[Beezerk]

Absolutely spot on, it’s almost like “mental health” is the latest fashion/buzz word for people to use as an excuse and imo, it lessens the impact for those in genuine need of help and who are struggling.

Bang on, there will be people genuinely struggling, of course there is, but the amount of people now throwing about the mental health line makes my pash boil.
I've had to stop listening to Radio 5 on a morning, it seems to attract a whole new generation of weak willed people, what ever happened to being resilient?

 

[Ethan]

No disagreement with what you say and I will admit that I have no idea as to what I am going through at the moment (child of the 70s so part of the don't talk about it' keep it all in until you have a breakdown generation) and I am probably guilty of brandishing the mental health card too easily due to a lack of real understanding. What I do know is that I am tired, unmotivated, quiet, maybe slightly withdrawn and sometimes randomly sad to a point of nearly being in tears. That is just not me. Don't get me wrong (and not to panic anyone on here) I am not suicidal and I would probably limit the impact at the moment to me be sometimes unpleasant to be around (couple of hours locked away with my xbox helps that) and me just generally not liking who I am at the moment.

I am a sensible, educated bloke. Lockdown has not hit me financially too much and I am honestly surprised at the impact that the lack of social interaction is having on me. What would help me, an hour at the weekend, sat in the garden (in a big warm coat) having a coffee and a chat with one other person, socially distanced. Basically something on the same risk level as a round of golf which, apparently, should be allowed.

Sure, I agree and sometimes feel the same. Other people have their own responses. But for many people these are acute stressors and when the situation changes not even necessarily getting back as far as full "normality", they will go away, at varying speeds.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Echoing some other thougths here but wrt easing out of lockdown we messed up, now we have to pay - that means waiting months and months longer than other places to unlock until the whole vaccination program has completed imo. If we dont and open up again it's just thousands more unnescessary and avoidable deaths, which is borderline criminal to permit. Yes that creates no end of other problems but staying alive is more important, no matter peoples age. That's the price we have to pay (whilst waiting for vaccinations) for a combo of bad strategic decisions and a proportionately selfish exceptionalist populace.
Radio saying just now PM is going to outline another path out of lockdown this week, haven't we been here several times before?
Just wait for all the vaccinations, not sooner or it'll backfire....again.
Reducing restrictions to benefit economy argument is flawed, other countries showed early stringent control of virus works best for economic outcomes.

The whole vaccination program won’t be completed until October ?

Do you really see a 9 month lockdown - the results of that would be far damaging than any virus