Coronavirus - how is it/has it affected you?

Rlburnside said:
It was never my intention to slag the police off just asking the question.

I think the organizers are being dealt with that’s why I didn’t mention them.

What’s the answer then just let these gatherings continue.
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Indeed , what is the answer. ?

One solution would be martial law. Forget fines, if you break the rules, you'll go to jail- temporary places of detention. - Till the message gets through.
These people who selfishly do what they want have no interest in whether the infection rates are going up or down as a result of lockdown.
They behave on the basis of , "What lockdown?"
Worse still are those who know of the lockdown but their culture and traditions and beliefs are more important than any law obedience or societal responsibility to the lockdown, if it interferes with those.
so, tell us, are you in favour of martial law? Because , frankly, I cannot see anything a lot short of that stopping determined offenders.
 
maxfli65 said:
Going to raise this again but the 2nd dose delay issue is not going away. We are the only country in the world going on a 12 week 2nd does strategy when it should be 3 and no more than 6 at worst.
My mum had this jab last week, 93 yo. She has been told 12 weeks for repeat. Unsettled by this.
Do we do this half baked or do we do it right.......by waiting longer for enough supply? At the moment - half baked it seems on the basis that some defence is better than no defence.:(

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55777084
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It is unfortunate, but I assume she probably got the Pfizer jab. So did my wife, an NHS Consultant who sees patients and can be called on to attend the Covid ward, and whose second dose was likewise postponed. Your mother will be fine. One dose gives more protection than they ever anticipated two would, and even those who got Covid despite vaccination had a mild course.

This is a population strategy, and the more people that get decent protection, the more we are all protected. It is not a good use of a scarce resource to offer a small incremental benefit to someone who is already pretty well protected when you can offer a much larger protection to someone who is completely unprotected.

The science behind immunity suggests that a longer interval may be better, if indeed a booster is even needed. There is certainly no science to suggest that the antibody response wears off in anything less than about 6 months, and even then the T-cell response will kick in. Nor is there any evidence that older people lose response any more quickly than younger.
 
Swinglowandslow said:
Indeed , what is the answer. ?

One solution would be martial law. Forget fines, if you break the rules, you'll go to jail- temporary places of detention. - Till the message gets through.
These people who selfishly do what they want have no interest in whether the infection rates are going up or down as a result of lockdown.
They behave on the basis of , "What lockdown?"
Worse still are those who know of the lockdown but their culture and traditions and beliefs are more important than any law obedience or societal responsibility to the lockdown, if it interferes with those.
so, tell us, are you in favour of martial law? Because , frankly, I cannot see anything a lot short of that stopping determined offenders.
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Martial law....wow. You’ve really drunk the kool aid !!???
 
maxfli65 said:
Going to raise this again but the 2nd dose delay issue is not going away. We are the only country in the world going on a 12 week 2nd does strategy when it should be 3 and no more than 6 at worst.
My mum had this jab last week, 93 yo. She has been told 12 weeks for repeat. Unsettled by this.
Do we do this half baked or do we do it right.......by waiting longer for enough supply? At the moment - half baked it seems on the basis that some defence is better than no defence.:(

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55777084
Click to expand...
If you were in charge and you could declare 20% vaccinated or 40% vaccinated by certain date, and you could put a reasonable argument for the approach that gives you 40%, even though that might contradict the reasoning for the approach that gives 20% - what would you do...?

Meanwhile - he who waits may act too late...and whilst ‘wait and see‘ may be appropriate when I do not have much idea of the likely outcome, when I DO know the likely outcome but hope for a different one...
 
harpo_72 said:
I suspected as much, but I don’t think we are allowed to say that as it’s related to a political stance ?. Let’s brush it under the carpet and say we have import export goblins
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...and let’s not mention loss of Community police officers and overall shortage of officers across the country...as that drifts into the political arena also - but as we are seeing a lack of police numbers and the ability of the police to enforce the pandemic rules is impacting us all now...
 
SwingsitlikeHogan said:
...and let’s not mention loss of Community police officers and overall shortage of officers across the country...as that drifts into the political arena also - but as we are seeing a lack of police numbers and the ability of the police to enforce the pandemic rules is impacting us all now...
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Yes I kind of feel it’s a thing of our own creation. UK tax is extremely low, compared to most of Europe. So yes we don’t have the social resources to actually support any of our services. But will this teach us anything? No sadly I think that is just who we are.
 
harpo_72 said:
I suspected as much, but I don’t think we are allowed to say that as it’s related to a political stance ?. Let’s brush it under the carpet and say we have import export goblins
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Have they lost it or is it just delayed? It should give an indication on the tracking. If lost then ask them to raise a missing parcel case. If delayed then just put your feet up and accept it with everyone else ?.

It could be worse, I'm sending pallets and parcels right now and the pallet situation is much worse. One haulier told me that French customs were checking every invoice against every pallet against every declaration. All when physically in front of them. The system can't deal with that level of checks. There is definitely a level of payback happening here.
 
Lets get real.

So if I continue to follow the rules of isolation my risks are very low. If I get an injection my survival rate is even more enhanced. If I have to wait up 6 weeks for a booster jab to increase immunity from about 3 months to a much longer period: how in the real world does the extra 3 week, potential delay, really make a difference when lockdown ìs not likely to be fundamentally changed for several months?
 
drdel said:
Lets get real.

So if I continue to follow the rules of isolation my risks are very low. If I get an injection my survival rate is even more enhanced. If I have to wait up 6 weeks for a booster jab to increase immunity from about 3 months to a much longer period: how in the real world does the extra 3 week, potential delay, really make a difference when lockdown ìs not likely to be fundamentally changed for several months?
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I believe the whole idea of the delay is to allow more people to get the first dose of vaccine to increase the spread of immunity across more of the population- especially the groups 1-4 , getting the first dose to those groups by mid feb would then allow the government to think about a Tier system to allow some level of restrictions to be eased.
 
drdel said:
Lets get real.

So if I continue to follow the rules of isolation my risks are very low. If I get an injection my survival rate is even more enhanced. If I have to wait up 6 weeks for a booster jab to increase immunity from about 3 months to a much longer period: how in the real world does the extra 3 week, potential delay, really make a difference when lockdown ìs not likely to be fundamentally changed for several months?
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After the first dose of the pfizer vaccine, the risk of you catching the virus is vastly reduced especially if you keep following the safety guidlines. If however you are unlucky and catch it, your symptoms will be greatly reduced which means less people in hospitals.
 
I keep hearing about sections of the population being unwilling to take the vaccine, hopefully not too many. If people want to take that risk then I'm largely ambivalent about it, their problem not mine, but the question I would ask is could that impact on the rest of us, even if we have had the vaccine? This may have been asked before, apologies if so.

Will it damage the herd immunity concept that will be built or will it be classic Darwinism at work?
 
Lord Tyrion said:
Have they lost it or is it just delayed? It should give an indication on the tracking. If lost then ask them to raise a missing parcel case. If delayed then just put your feet up and accept it with everyone else ?.

It could be worse, I'm sending pallets and parcels right now and the pallet situation is much worse. One haulier told me that French customs were checking every invoice against every pallet against every declaration. All when physically in front of them. The system can't deal with that level of checks. There is definitely a level of payback happening here.
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I am hoping it’s just delayed in the mess but the tracking number has stopped working.
As for payback, more like vigorous application of the regulations. This was always going to be the case, and when raised was always dismissed with it will be a computer system... the point is anyone wants to do a job properly you have to get hands on, believing pieces of paper and what they say is open to smuggling.
I mean we trusted everyone coming in and we have all these illegal immigrants, just think if we checked properly we wouldn’t have this issue
 
Liverpoolphil said:
I believe the whole idea of the delay is to allow more people to get the first dose of vaccine to increase the spread of immunity across more of the population- especially the groups 1-4 , getting the first dose to those groups by mid feb would then allow the government to think about a Tier system to allow some level of restrictions to be eased.
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Tier systems haven’t worked before as each time it’s led to a lockdown. I don’t think this time (as end in sight) the scientists will allow an early release. The country is broke, schools would have already lost half the term, exams already cancelled, I can see scientists and then boris et al holding out until Easter. Could they deem the mental health of a ‘few’ as collateral damage to save the masses.
 
Lord Tyrion said:
I keep hearing about sections of the population being unwilling to take the vaccine, hopefully not too many. If people want to take that risk then I'm largely ambivalent about it, their problem not mine, but the question I would ask is could that impact on the rest of us, even if we have had the vaccine? This may have been asked before, apologies if so.

Will it damage the herd immunity concept that will be built or will it be classic Darwinism at work?
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It’s estimated that we need between 60 - 70% from studies I’ve seen to achieve herd immunity. I have faith that there is nowhere near 30 - 40% of the population who either can’t get it for medical reasons or are anti-vaxxers.
 
Leftitshort said:
Martial law....wow. You’ve really drunk the kool aid !!???
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If you really read what I've written, I have not advocated martial law.
I have asked the question ( of Riburnside, and others if you like).
Riburnside asked what was the answer to these determined offenders.
I gave an extreme example because he was knocking the Policing as if they should have done better.
I said that Martial law would be an answer, and it would. Whether it was desirable or not is another question .
And I think it is the case that there doesn't seem to be the resources and ability to stop these determined offenders unless something draconian is considered.
You saw the words "martial law" and it seems you consider I think there should be such a situation. I don't.
I think there should be much firmer action, involving arrest, detention, massive fines for all involved, with access to their funds if they refuse to pay, etc.
As you aren't on the kook aid, what is your answer?
 
Kellfire said:
It’s estimated that we need between 60 - 70% from studies I’ve seen to achieve herd immunity. I have faith that there is nowhere near 30 - 40% of the population who either can’t get it for medical reasons or are anti-vaxxers.
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Chris Whitty actual words on that were when weve vacc'd 50% of the population weve won, the virus won't be able to spread after that. No idea myself but I'm not a professor
 
harpo_72 said:
I am hoping it’s just delayed in the mess but the tracking number has stopped working.
As for payback, more like vigorous application of the regulations. This was always going to be the case, and when raised was always dismissed with it will be a computer system... the point is anyone wants to do a job properly you have to get hands on, believing pieces of paper and what they say is open to smuggling.
I mean we trusted everyone coming in and we have all these illegal immigrants, just think if we checked properly we wouldn’t have this issue
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The intention was that the trust would be between the carrier and customs to an extent where only random checks would be required. They may stop a one man band driver or firms they have suspicions about but they would largely go on trust with the multi nationals or big boys. Currently it's the equivalent of every passenger on a flight having their bag opened and checked upon arrival. That's unsustainable.
 
Kellfire said:
It’s estimated that we need between 60 - 70% from studies I’ve seen to achieve herd immunity. I have faith that there is nowhere near 30 - 40% of the population who either can’t get it for medical reasons or are anti-vaxxers.
Click to expand...

And we'd need the rest of the world to get similar levels of immunity before allowing unrestricted ìnternational travel. The rate of vaccination in other countries is not great so it will be many months.

I fear relying on herd immunity might not be a wise strategy.
 
Lord Tyrion said:
I keep hearing about sections of the population being unwilling to take the vaccine, hopefully not too many. If people want to take that risk then I'm largely ambivalent about it, their problem not mine, but the question I would ask is could that impact on the rest of us, even if we have had the vaccine? This may have been asked before, apologies if so.

Will it damage the herd immunity concept that will be built or will it be classic Darwinism at work?
Click to expand...

I think the answer, unfortunately, is that it will impact on the control of the virus. If too few are vaccinated, the virus may still flourish.
Would like to be wrong.
 
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