Brexit - or Article 50: the Phoenix!

[Hobbit]

I paraphrased from actually watching the interview...in fact Coveney stated clearly that if UK leaves with No Deal then that was not the EU's choice; it was not Ireland's choice - it was the UK's choice.

And.... Surely it should be the UK's choice if the UK so desires. If the EU and the UK decide they want something inbetween, and can agree on what that in-between is, great. However, if the terms are so onerous, why should the UK be bound by them?

There's a hell of a lot in the early part of the Withdrawal Agreement that is good and equitable but, equally, the latter part of it is appalling. I hope he does consign it to the bin, and if the EU don't like that - bloody tough on them.

Leave is costing me hundreds of Euros a month, and I don't want Leave but the WA that the EU say they won't budge on is not a compromise deal in any way, shape or form.

 

[ger147]

I paraphrased from actually watching the interview...in fact Coveney stated clearly that if UK leaves with No Deal then that was not the EU's choice; it was not Ireland's choice - it was the UK's choice.

So when you said above you were "quoting" you were in fact "paraphrasing". I'm sure you weren't intentionally trying to be dishonest or mislead anyone.

You have more in common with Boris than you think...

 

[spongebob59]

Laura Kuenssberg
@bbclaurak

1h

So according to a source who knows their way around the machinations of Whitehall... if MPs want to be sure there is no chance of leaving without a deal they need to call and win a vote of no confidence today or the first day of recess

https://twitter.com/x/status/1154309504370139137

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

So when you said above you were "quoting" you were in fact "paraphrasing". I'm sure you weren't intentionally trying to be dishonest or mislead anyone.

You have more in common with Boris than you think...

OK - what Coveney said exactly - though quite what I misrepresented of what Coveney said I am not sure. And I quote.

If a new British prime minister chooses to take Britain in that direction then it will happen. But this will be a British choice. Not an Irish choice. Not an EU choice. This is a British choice

So when Johnson says, as he did today in the HoC, that if he cannot agree a new withdrawal agreement with the EU then he has No Choice but to leave on 31/10 with No Deal. He is lying. Because he DOES have a choice. It may be unpalatable to him and all who support him - and adjusting the legislation that has 31/10 enshrined in it may not be that easy - but he still has a choice. Coveney is absolutely correct in what he says.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1152879198395985920

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

..and as an aside - they can stop using the £39Bn figure - with exit delayed until 31/10 the figure is now £33Bn. You can buy a lot of Smarties for £6Bn.

 

[Hobbit]

..and as an aside - they can stop using the £39Bn figure - with exit delayed until 31/10 the figure is now £33Bn. You can buy a lot of Smarties for £6Bn.

But what about the money paid from March till the end of October? Add that to your £33bn and it comes to £39bn give or take. It could be argued that the U.K. has been a full member during that time, but has it? What about the tenders that British businesses have been excluded from?

 

[ger147]

OK - what Coveney said exactly

I wasn't making any comment on anything Coveney said, merely picking you up on your lie which I'm sure wasn't deliberate. Perhaps it was just an inadvertent mistake on your part?

I'm sure you have no issue in being held to the same high standards you hold others to...

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

But what about the money paid from March till the end of October? Add that to your £33bn and it comes to £39bn give or take. It could be argued that the U.K. has been a full member during that time, but has it? What about the tenders that British businesses have been excluded from?

All that may be true - though how a contract let under EU Law to a British company on the basis of it being a member of the EU and so the company and it's delivery will be compliant and aligned with all EU rules, regulations, laws etc would work I do not know - might be dead straightforward.

But that aside, what remains to be paid is £33Bn. So when Johnson tells us he will not be paying the EU the £39Bn - he is telling a porkie.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

I wasn't making any comment on anything Coveney said, merely picking you up on your lie which I'm sure wasn't deliberate. Perhaps it was just an inadvertent mistake on your part?

I'm sure you have no issue in being held to the same high standards you hold others to...

OK - I said I quoted then I made clear that I had paraphrased what he had quoted.

 

[MegaSteve]

One day... Hopefully...
The penny will drop there's no such a thing as 'no deal'...
Or, 'falling over a cliff'...

 

[ColchesterFC]

But that aside, what remains to be paid is £33Bn. So when Johnson tells us he will not be paying the EU the £39Bn - he is telling a porkie.

Are you sure? If Boris agrees to pay the EU 33 billion then how is him saying he won't be paying 39 billion a lie? It is factually accurate, he won't be paying the EU 39 billion because we will only "owe" 33 billion - although I'm sure even the lower figure will be disputed as to whether that is the gross figure or nett of what we are due back from the EU.

 

[Doon frae Troon]

The new Sec of State for Scotland is now saying the absolute opposite about leaving the EU with no deal than he told my daughter a couple of months ago at a one to one meeting at her warehouse.
Amazing what a whiff of power does to your honesty.

 

[spongebob59]

well said :




Tim Dawson

@Tim_R_Dawson
·
13h

I think a lot of Remainers, so obsessed with the "consequences" of Brexit, haven't thought through the consequences of Remaining. Certainly the end of the UK as a major player. The Euro, prbly. Abnegation of our legal system. 2016 was seminal: the status quo, as it was, is dead.

 

[Doon frae Troon]

You know this bruhahaha about closing Parliament to get Brexit through against the wishes of our elected MP's.
Isn't Parliament closed right now.........…. and all the leave MP's have gone off on their holidays.

 

[IanM]

Quote of the day.... Barnier doesn't like the language Boris is using!

I guess he isn't on the payroll like the last lot, lets hope is stays like it.

 

[Hobbit]

Quote of the day.... Barnier doesn't like the language Boris is using!

I guess he isn't on the payroll like the last lot, lets hope is stays like it.

Good, I'm all for it. To be honest, its no different to what May said about Red Lines and leaving on March 29th. Let's hope this PM isn't the wet dishcloth the last one was.

 

[drdel]

I really don't get why Barnier, Macron, Merkel and Juncker are so surprised.

They sent May back with a Wda twice after the UK Parliament rejected it. All that BJ has said is there's no point going back to the UK again without change.

It was Ok for Juncker, et al to be insulting to May but BJ is being 'combative': it is about time we fired back. They have said repeatedly they did not know what the UK wanted, now they do.

 

[SocketRocket]

You know this bruhahaha about closing Parliament to get Brexit through against the wishes of our elected MP's.
Isn't Parliament closed right now.........…. and all the leave MP's have gone off on their holidays.

Surely even you know they wont be away until October. Can't see the problem with closing parliament, all that will happen is nothing will happen, the status quo will be maintained just like when the MPs voted for article 50 and the EU withdrawl bill.
What's wrong with that other than being careful what you vote for.

 

[Deleted member 1418]

Surely even you know they wont be away until October. Can't see the problem with closing parliament, all that will happen is nothing will happen, the status quo will be maintained just like when the MPs voted for article 50 and the EU withdrawl bill.
What's wrong with that other than being careful what you vote for.

They more or less are as they return for around 9 days from memory in September; and then the House rises again for Conference season mid-September until mid-October.

 

[spongebob59]

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/9a46063e-afef-11e9-84cf-31ddba0e0fae