Brexit - or Article 50: the Phoenix!

[woody69]

Dream on. Most of the immigrants were from Sud Saharan countries who were economic migrants and not from war zones.

Where did I make this assertion that after claiming asylum they went on the run, you made that one up matey. Maybe you could try and read the post you referenced and respond to that instead of ranting on to suit your own prejudices like most socialist do. Oh! While were on the subject, how many did you take in.

Dream on about what? I was making a specific remark about the poster Farage used as part of his campaign. It's a fact the picture was of Syrian migrants fleeing whilst crossing the Croatia-Slovenia border in 2015.

With regards to your other question, where you asked where you made the assertion that after claiming asylum they went on the run, you said:

Millions of unchecked illegal immigrants flooding into Europe is racist is it

For an immigrant to become an "illegal immigrant" they need to have entered the country illegally and not claimed asylum, had their asylum request turned down and then stayed instead of returning to their country of origin or even overstayed on their visa. You're the one who appears to have conflated the image of that poster with "millions of unchecked illegal immigrants flooding into Europe", as that was what was being discussed and why I responded in the way I did. However, if you do want to extend the conversation onto the more general topic of immigration into Europe and the EU rather than the poster we were discussing it might be worth having a read of these articles first:

https://fullfact.org/immigration/eu-migration-and-uk/
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-34131911
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uk...n-crisis-how-many-people-are-on-the-move.html
https://fullfact.org/europe/how-many-migrants-are-coming-europe-and-uk/

Hopefully you will see from the figures that it isn't quite the "millions" you appear to believe it is.

Also, although a little old now, these are interesting articles on whether migration in itself (those economic migrants you mentioned) are good for the economy or not:

http://www.oecd.org/migration/OECD Migration Policy Debates Numero 2.pdf
https://www.forbes.com/sites/stuart...migrants-key-to-economic-growth/#a5dd52f7dabd

I'm not sure why you have labelled me a socialist, (especially as you seem to be using it as some kind of ad hominem attack)?

 

[Hacker Khan]

Caught a bit of the Lib Dems political broadcast last night , Cable was on about overturning the "wafer thin " majority of the referendum , i bet if he got in on such a majority he would not be asking for that one to be overturned.
It just winds me up , a majority was gained ,bloody act on it if not get off the pot and let someone who is willing to have a go get on with it .Hypocrites the lot of them they would all be happy enough if they were elected with such a majority !!!

Not 100% sure the lib dems are 'on the pot' and are the problem here. Getting angry and blaming the lib dems for some specific form of Brexit people thought they were voting for not happening is kind of missing the point IMHO.

 

[robinthehood]

Caught a bit of the Lib Dems political broadcast last night , Cable was on about overturning the "wafer thin " majority of the referendum , i bet if he got in on such a majority he would not be asking for that one to be overturned.
It just winds me up , a majority was gained ,bloody act on it if not get off the pot and let someone who is willing to have a go get on with it .Hypocrites the lot of them they would all be happy enough if they were elected with such a majority !!!

It's the hard line erg brexit bad boys who in the end have scuppered the brexit dream. Not the lib dems .

 

[jp5]

How many Tory Leavers voted in confidence of Theresa May but then repeatedly against her deal?

That's where your ire should be aimed.

 

[Slime]

Are we not still in the EU ?

Isn’t most of the issues people worrying about when we actually leave

So you can say we have unemployment at an all time low whilst in the EU - good news 👍

Or, you can say we have unemployment at an all time low despite being in the EU.

 

[Deleted member 18121]

Or, you can say we have unemployment at an all time low despite being in the EU.

With language skills like that the BBC will have you writing for them in no time at all!

 

[drdel]

It's the hard line erg brexit bad boys who in the end have scuppered the brexit dream. Not the lib dems .

Strange deduction when Parliament voted for actioning the Referendum result. A parliament majority (despite a minority Government) triggered the Article 50 process. The reality is that a significant number of politicians from all parties oppose (despite their Party manifesto promises) the Referendum result.

The ERG is one faction following the promises of both Labour and Tories

 

[jp5]

The ERG have been frustrating the Brexit process as much as any of the ultra-remainers.

 

[Foxholer]

The link below is to a trade paper, not a piece of propaganda. Its full of numbers and facts about the current state of manufacturing in various sectors in the UK. Its an interesting read.

One comment in it - "the UK is currently 9th in the world in manufacturing, and will rise to 5th by 2021." It certainly brings into question the oft heard comment that the UK's manufacturing industry has been decimated through the 70's and 80's. And there's a lot in it that raises a few questions about what the doom mongers continue to say.

Rather than take on board too much from politicians and the main stream media, it sometimes helps to do a little research.

uk-manufacturing-statistics

H'mm! I'm inclined to believe that publication has got a considerable 'propaganda' (to use your word, but mine would probably be 'positivity') element to it!

But, with no axe to grind, I believe a touch of 'reality' needs to be applied to your enthusiasm/positivity!

The first sentence of the body of the publication actually starts 'Despite the decline since the 1970s...', so perhaps the comment about UK manufacturin declining is correct.

You've also produced a quote about UK's current and projected world ranking. However, you've dropped an extremely important part from that quote! The prediction about UK rising to 5th was actually '...If current growth trends continue, the UK will break into the top five by 2021'! So a huge disclaimer that you should have included As it is, there's no obvious explanation of that claim.

In fact, the ranking chart showing UK's 9th position also shows that the previous year it was higher at 8th! I'd like to know how they arrived at that 'top 5 by 2021' prediction!

 

[Mudball]

Not sure if this will swing any voters among the 50+ golf demographics but she makes some interesting points.. it’s about taking back control..

https://www.ted.com/talks/carole_ca...in_brexit_and_the_threat_to_democracy/up-next

 

[oxymoron]

Not 100% sure the lib dems are 'on the pot' and are the problem here. Getting angry and blaming the lib dems for some specific form of Brexit people thought they were voting for not happening is kind of missing the point IMHO.

It's the hard line erg brexit bad boys who in the end have scuppered the brexit dream. Not the lib dems .

If you both would take the time to read what i said , i was saying they want to overturn a majority vote i never blamed them for the mess i was just pointing out in the first sentence that if it suits they seem to want to ignore the will of the people who voted , and in the second sentence i was saying a majority was gained so act on it .And in the third i was just having a rant i should have stated that any MP would not turn their noses up at a majority like was voted if it meant they could get back in to the Westminster gravy train. Sorry if it was not clear enough for you .

 

[Mudball]

If you both would take the time to read what i said , i was saying they want to overturn a majority vote i never blamed them for the mess i was just pointing out in the first sentence that if it suits they seem to want to ignore the will of the people who voted , and in the second sentence i was saying a majority was gained so act on it .And in the third i was just having a rant i should have stated that any MP would not turn their noses up at a majority like was voted if it meant they could get back in to the Westminster gravy train. Sorry if it was not clear enough for you .

Given that the Lib Dem’s fought the GE on the ticket that they would rerun the referendum.. would you blame them for sticking to their election promise (unlike others?)

 

[Blue in Munich]

Given that the Lib Dem’s fought the GE on the ticket that they would rerun the referendum.. would you blame them for sticking to their election promise (unlike others?)

How extremely commendable of them; and utterly stupid. Running a GE campaign where you effectively tell the people whose votes you want that you wish to ignore the result of a previous vote, and therefore by extension are quite likely to ignore the outcome of future votes.

I don’t know about on the pot, but it sounds like the logic of someone who is on pot to me.

 

[Deleted member 1418]

How extremely commendable of them; and utterly stupid. Running a GE campaign where you effectively tell the people whose votes you want that you wish to ignore the result of a previous vote, and therefore by extension are quite likely to ignore the outcome of future votes.

I don’t know about on the pot, but it sounds like the logic of someone who is on pot to me.

The same Lib Dems who - if I recall correctly - were the main party calling for a referendum on Europe a couple of elections ago!! Granted they were in favour of remaining but fully prepared to let the people decide......! 😀

 

[Hobbit]

The same Lib Dems who - if I recall correctly - were the main party calling for a referendum on Europe a couple of elections ago!! Granted they were in favour of remaining but fully prepared to let the people decide......! 😀

That'll be the same LibDems that were almost annihilated in the last GE. They're obviously very good...

 

[SocketRocket]

That'll be the same LibDems that were almost annihilated in the last GE. They're obviously very good...

The same LibDems who are no longer Dems.

 

[Doon frae Troon]

I love the thoughtful anti EU bill boards that advises leave types to boycott the EU elections and not to vote for the 'unelected bureaucrats'

I sense the hand of Nigel.

 

[drdel]

I love the thoughtful anti EU bill boards that advises leave types to boycott the EU elections and not to vote for the 'unelected bureaucrats'

I sense the hand of Nigel.

Much more likely to be the SNP....

 

[SocketRocket]

Not sure if this will swing any voters among the 50+ golf demographics but she makes some interesting points.. it’s about taking back control..

https://www.ted.com/talks/carole_ca...in_brexit_and_the_threat_to_democracy/up-next

I don't think it will swing many. She goes on about her Welshness but doesn't have a Welsh accent, she has this annoying theme to her lecture that insinuated the people who voted Leave didn't understand the issues, she then goes on to suggest every thing in the town that has improved since the nasty Tories closed down the pits is due to the generosity of the EU.

She seems unaware that the so called EU funding for those projects has to be part funded by UK government and the rest comes out of the huge amount we pay into the EU coffers.

She does her kinsmen down by suggesting they cannot see beyond the Daily Mail headlines and only the likes of journalists like her can see through their racisit and blinkered views.

I guess she is probably a card carrying member of Remain and incapable of seeing any other view point.

Maybe she should take up golf 😉

 

[woody69]

I don't think it will swing many. She goes on about her Welshness but doesn't have a Welsh accent, she has this annoying theme to her lecture that insinuated the people who voted Leave didn't understand the issues, she then goes on to suggest every thing in the town that has improved since the nasty Tories closed down the pits is due to the generosity of the EU.

She seems unaware that the so called EU funding for those projects has to be part funded by UK government and the rest comes out of the huge amount we pay into the EU coffers.

She does her kinsmen down by suggesting they cannot see beyond the Daily Mail headlines and only the likes of journalists like her can see through their racisit and blinkered views.

I guess she is probably a card carrying member of Remain and incapable of seeing any other view point.

Maybe she should take up golf 😉

The irony of this post...