Brexit - or Article 50: the Phoenix!
- Thread starter drdel
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Mudball
Assistant Pro
So Easter turns to Halloween... does this mean this thread will go on for another few months? What’s the max number of posts a thread can take??
Hacker Khan
Yurt Dwelling, Yoghurt Knitter
I don't know about you but I feel that we've had a good try and been found wanting. We've had a quick glimpse into a post Brexit world where characters like Mark Francois hold court and it isn't pretty. So I say let's just pretend it didn't happen, chalk it down to experience and carry on as we are 
Slime
Tour Winner
Why do I feel so utterly betrayed.
bluewolf
Money List Winner
I don't know about you but I feel that we've had a good try and been found wanting. We've had a quick glimpse into a post Brexit world where characters like Mark Francois hold court and it isn't pretty. So I say let's just pretend it didn't happen, chalk it down to experience and carry on as we are
In all seriousness, we can't do that now.. It's gone too far and we've created so much disruption and resentment that our position within the EU is untenable.
Whilst I strongly don't believe that there'd be any type of civil unrest if we didn't Exit, I do believe that there are enough petty minded morons around to ensure that a significant amount of "Politicians" elected to the EU from these shores would be elected on a manifesto of causing disruption and frustration at every turn.
Can you imagine what a little army of small minded bigots like Farage and Francois could do to the EU? We'd be like a nasty little virus within the Host body.
robinthehood
Hacker
You're to overly concerned with the wrongs things in life I'd say.
MegaSteve
Tour Winner
Like one of the basics of a well functioning society...
bluewolf
Money List Winner
What? Like a well organised, honest Democracy?
Let me know when you see one of those..............
drdel
Tour Rookie
If any of the remaining members were in any doubt before, yesterday should prove to them that once the UK has left it will be France and Germany in charge.
Tashyboy
Please don’t ask to see my tatts 👍
May I be the first to wish you all a happy Halloween.
Looks like Missis May has started her trick or treat early.
Looks like Missis May has started her trick or treat early.
U
User62651
Guest
Agreed on your first point.
Re your second point I think if it gets to the point where we have to vote in EU elections there will be a highish turnout overall because of Brexit, remainers will want to make a point of supporting the EU parliamentary process and leavers will also want to make a point by backing the Brexit Party or UKIP MEP candidates. Abstaining wont be noticed as it's been a historically low turnout anyway. Expect Tory candidates to suffer. Some current Tory MEPs won't stand again anyway.
Whilst May is in charge I can't see revoke Art50 coming, can't see another referendum/people's vote coming, can't see No Deal either (before Halloween at least). Where does that leave us? - exactly where we are now with Theresa May repeating the same old soundbites last night as she always does but with UK parliamentary arithmetic unchanged and not budging in her so called talks with Labour. Expect another 6.5 months of the same old arguments then "can we have another brexit extension please EU" . Just dont know if they'll allow that next time, think they've had enough. At that point No Deal might be enforced. Dear oh dear. She is also protected from a leadership challenge until December now. She could walk but she won't.
At least we know now that the EU wont capitulate last minute for a deal as we were told they would, that helps, one less variable. They saw the 2 deadlines through (29th and 12th) and basically made us beg.
No way out of this until there is a big change like a General Election, however current polls will deter May going down that route too.
Only 3.25 years until next enforced General Election!
IanM
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And you dont think that's the case now regardless of the UK's position?
Well... no need for me to repeat anything, as my calling of this is still spot on.
bluewolf
Money List Winner
Agreed on your first point.
Re your second point I think if it gets to the point where we have to vote in EU elections there will be a highish turnout overall because of Brexit, remainers will want to make a point of supporting the EU parliamentary process and leavers will also want to make a point by backing the Brexit Party or UKIP MEP candidates. Abstaining wont be noticed as it's been a historically low turnout anyway. Expect Tory candidates to suffer. Some current Tory MEPs won't stand again anyway.
Whilst May is in charge I can't see revoke Art50 coming, can't see another referendum/people's vote coming, can't see No Deal either (before Halloween at least). Where does that leave us? - exactly where we are now with Theresa May repeating the same old soundbites last night as she always does but with UK parliamentary arithmetic unchanged and not budging in her so called talks with Labour. Expect another 6.5 months of the same old arguments then "can we have another brexit extension please EU" . Just dont know if they'll allow that next time, think they've had enough. At that point No Deal might be enforced. Dear oh dear. She is also protected from a leadership challenge until December now. She could walk but she won't.
At least we know now that the EU wont capitulate last minute for a deal as we were told they would, that helps, one less variable. They saw the 2 deadlines through (29th and 12th) and basically made us beg.
No way out of this until there is a big change like a General Election, however current polls will deter May going down that route too.
Only 3.25 years until next enforced General Election!
Some very good points..
If May does walk, then there is no chance in hell that a Remain supporting MP will put their hat in the ring. Imagine how popular that person would be!!
I can't see any option but a No Deal at Halloween. We need to be using all the allotted time to prepare for it, starting now.. Stop fannying about with meaningless votes. Announce the intention to Leave and just get on with it.. As I said, we're too far down the road to recover now anyway. The short term damage to our Economy is already done. Long term? Who knows? I don't think we've done our international reputation any good though, and I sincerely doubt we'll get any deals better than we currently enjoy..
U
User62651
Guest
Recently we were told May would allow the Commons to make the final decision on the type of Brexit to get us out by 22nd May if her talks with Labour went nowhere and there had been no extension offered.
I've lost track now given the new extension last night.
Is that 'let commons decide' option still on the cards or does the extra 6.5 months just allow May to go back to flogging the dead horse of 'Back my Deal, it's the only real option' thing?
Although she's won some more time she must be wanting to avoid partaking in the EU elections so there is still an onus on her to get things decided soonish, yes?
Also I don't think being a remainer would deter candidates standing for Tory leadership, the MPs vote in the first few rounds and they are remain more than leave, the wider party membership only gets a say when it's whittled down to last 2 I think. Boris or Gove will not be allowed to get through the early rounds unless they change the voting process, they're too tainted now. We will get Hunt or Javid as next PM imo.
I've lost track now given the new extension last night.
Is that 'let commons decide' option still on the cards or does the extra 6.5 months just allow May to go back to flogging the dead horse of 'Back my Deal, it's the only real option' thing?
Although she's won some more time she must be wanting to avoid partaking in the EU elections so there is still an onus on her to get things decided soonish, yes?
Also I don't think being a remainer would deter candidates standing for Tory leadership, the MPs vote in the first few rounds and they are remain more than leave, the wider party membership only gets a say when it's whittled down to last 2 I think. Boris or Gove will not be allowed to get through the early rounds unless they change the voting process, they're too tainted now. We will get Hunt or Javid as next PM imo.
Hacker Khan
Yurt Dwelling, Yoghurt Knitter
Hacker Khan
Yurt Dwelling, Yoghurt Knitter
So we've had the short term pain and long term it probably won't get any better? Temping offer
Doon frae Troon
Ryder Cup Winner
Jings crivens help ma boab. Voting in that plank as leader would be a tremendous boost for those seeking an independent Scotland and a united Ireland.
D
Deleted member 18121
Guest
Oh how I'm looking forward to several more months of this shambles.
Another day goes by and I still cannot fathom why anyone would want to stay in the EU, their desperation to keep us in tells me more than I need to know about how important we are to them or should I be more specific - how important our money is to them.
I believe it's naive to think there will not be demonstrations and maybe riots, you can only push people so far before they snap......To quote bluewolf "there are enough petty minded morons around".....unfortunately it's that kind of feeling that has made this whole situation worse. We all have our right to vote, our reasons to vote and to say mine is more important that someone elses would be arrogant and just plane wrong, but I hope my vote does eventually count.
If brexit doesn't happen this year I have full belief it will happen in the not too distant future and we'll just curse the fact that it wasn't handle properly in 2016.
I too hope that these recent events will see the rise of another credible party or parties. The tories or labour shouldn't be our only real options, choosing the least bad one to run our country is disgraceful and I hope votes we have in coming elections show these MPs that they've taken the mickey too far this time and we wont stand for it.
I can but hope.
Another day goes by and I still cannot fathom why anyone would want to stay in the EU, their desperation to keep us in tells me more than I need to know about how important we are to them or should I be more specific - how important our money is to them.
I believe it's naive to think there will not be demonstrations and maybe riots, you can only push people so far before they snap......To quote bluewolf "there are enough petty minded morons around".....unfortunately it's that kind of feeling that has made this whole situation worse. We all have our right to vote, our reasons to vote and to say mine is more important that someone elses would be arrogant and just plane wrong, but I hope my vote does eventually count.
If brexit doesn't happen this year I have full belief it will happen in the not too distant future and we'll just curse the fact that it wasn't handle properly in 2016.
I too hope that these recent events will see the rise of another credible party or parties. The tories or labour shouldn't be our only real options, choosing the least bad one to run our country is disgraceful and I hope votes we have in coming elections show these MPs that they've taken the mickey too far this time and we wont stand for it.
I can but hope.
bluewolf
Money List Winner
Would I be right in thinking that you've just called me naive, arrogant and plain wrong?
If so then firstly, thank you
Secondly, every bit of evidence shows that there are only a small minority of people who feel strongly enough to actually get out and break the law. This was shown by the "March" in London a few weeks ago.. Just a Far Right excuse for a booze up and a few Nazi salutes..
Thirdly, thanks for taking the quote out of context.. I said that there would be enough Petty Minded Morons around to vote in Politicians on a manifesto of causing mischief and frustrating Processes. This is evidenced by the recent tweets from JRM and Mark Francois.. If you're voting solely to destroy from within, then guess what? You're a Petty Minded Moron.
jp5
Q-School Graduate
It's the UK asking for the extension...
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