Brexit - or Article 50: the Phoenix!

[Deleted member 15344]

 

[Old Skier]

I could have dreamed it but did someone post something about the EU finding a tech solution to the Irish border a couple of days ago.

 

[bluewolf]

I could have dreamed it but did someone post something about the EU finding a tech solution to the Irish border a couple of days ago.

It was mentioned that they'd explore alternative arrangements as part of their No Deal planning. Not one person has yet given a working example. I'm all ears though 👍

 

[Blue in Munich]

Why oh why is everyone still blaming all MP’s for this mess!
The only person a finger needs pointing at is TM, she put the rules down 2 years ago, fast forward to late last year when the rest of Parliament and the Country got to see what she’d achieved, what was it? A bad deal, a deal supported by very few of her own Party, we’ve had resignations, threats, votes of no confidence, sugar deals for support and still we are no further forward.

Maybe MP’s should be given one last vote, 2 choices, TM’s deal or No deal.

That’s it, we leave one way or another and any for any future issues we know were the blame lies.

There were 8 options last night, at least you could argue some politicians were trying to move forward, sad fact is, none of them had full backing.

She had 2 years, they’ve had 3 months, enough is enough.

Maybe for this reason Paul, assuming it is correct, I was sent it earlier today;

"EU referendum results 2016.

By votes; 17.4m Leave, 16.1m Remain.

By constituency; 406 Leave, 242 Remain.

Constituency by Party: Labour; 148 Leave, 84 Remain, Conservative; 247 Leave, 80 Remain.

By Region; 9 Leave, 3 Remain.

By MP; 160 Leave, 486 Remain.

Brexit isn't the problem, it's our MP's who are the problem."

If correct, why are the MP's NOT the problem?

 

[Blue in Munich]

It was mentioned that they'd explore alternative arrangements as part of their No Deal planning. Not one person has yet given a working example. I'm all ears though 👍

Thought Hobbit gave an example of this some time back?

 

[spongebob59]

I could have dreamed it but did someone post something about the EU finding a tech solution to the Irish border a couple of days ago.

Can't find any links only this :

https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/brexit/2019/02/why-technology-can-t-solve-irish-border-problem

 

[bluewolf]

Thought Hobbit gave an example of this some time back?

He gave a good example of how Trade could work. That's not the problem though. People cross borders too. Without a hard border then any EU national could cross into the UK without showing any ID.

 

[Blue in Munich]

He gave a good example of how Trade could work. That's not the problem though. People cross borders too. Without a hard border then any EU national could cross into the UK without showing any ID.

Thought it was trade that the OP was referring to, my apologies.

https://forums.golf-monthly.co.uk/t...le-50-the-phoenix.97927/page-291#post-1956409

 

[Deleted member 16999]

Maybe for this reason Paul, assuming it is correct, I was sent it earlier today;

"EU referendum results 2016.

By votes; 17.4m Leave, 16.1m Remain.

By constituency; 406 Leave, 242 Remain.

Constituency by Party: Labour; 148 Leave, 84 Remain, Conservative; 247 Leave, 80 Remain.

By Region; 9 Leave, 3 Remain.

By MP; 160 Leave, 486 Remain.

Brexit isn't the problem, it's our MP's who are the problem."

If correct, why are the MP's NOT the problem?

Because she’s accepted/been bullied/negotiated such a bad deal.
Seriously, if she was not willing to listen how else would they react, hence my line only giving them 2 choices, both leading to us leaving.

Spongebob’s link earlier today was quite an eye opener.

Are those stats correct? ie we had a GE after the Referendum, is that current MP’s or MP’s at the time?

 

[Blue in Munich]

Because she’s accepted/been bullied/negotiated such a bad deal.
Seriously, if she was not willing to listen how else would they react, hence my line only giving them 2 choices, both leading to us leaving.

Spongebob’s link earlier today was quite an eye opener.

Are those stats correct? ie we had a GE after the Referendum, is that current MP’s or MP’s at the time?

I've been sent them mate, haven't verified them hence the if correct caveat.

I understand & fully accept your point about her deal, but the MP's do not appear to have been actively helping the process hence my disdain for them.

 

[Hobbit]

And the Norway/Sweden border...

https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-41412561

The Beeb also did a piece on the Estonia/Russian border.

For those with concerns about smuggling. It exists on every EU border, land and sea. The "it can't be done" cries are correct, but expecting perfection at any border(and using it as a Remain excuse) is both naive and a little disingenuous.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

I've been sent them mate, haven't verified them hence the if correct caveat.

I understand & fully accept your point about her deal, but the MP's do not appear to have been actively helping the process hence my disdain for them.

I’m not overly sympathetic at all, it’s just she won’t budge an inch, look at what she’s done today for tomorrow, for all the hot air in Parliament or alternatives offered, she’s bringing the same deal for a 3rd time!

 

[Blue in Munich]

I’m not overly sympathetic at all, it’s just she won’t budge an inch, look at what she’s done today for tomorrow, for all the hot air in Parliament or alternatives offered, she’s bringing the same deal for a 3rd time!

How; I thought Bercow had blocked this?

 

[bluewolf]

And the Norway/Sweden border...

https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-41412561

The Beeb also did a piece on the Estonia/Russian border.

For those with concerns about smuggling. It exists on every EU border, land and sea. The "it can't be done" cries are correct, but expecting perfection at any border(and using it as an Remain excuse) is both naive and a little disingenuous.

Forgive me, but I'm struggling to understand your point. You admit it can't be done, but then state that this is no excuse for not doing it. Doing what? It can't currently be done. I'm lost 😂

 

[spongebob59]

Of course he wants a GE.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1111347764162646016

 

[Hobbit]

Forgive me, but I'm struggling to understand your point. You admit it can't be done, but then state that this is no excuse for not doing it. Doing what? It can't currently be done. I'm lost 😂

You're being too literal, and maybe I didn't make it clear. Perfection can't be achieved. There will always be smuggling, including people smuggling. But as per our previous discussion, managing trade is achievable. Its happening elsewhere in the EU so why not in NI/Ireland?

 

[Deleted member 16999]

How; I thought Bercow had blocked this?

She’s split it in 2! Tomorrow they vote on just the Withdrawal Agreement.

The other half, the Political Declaration will be voted on at a later date, depending on tomorrow’s result.

DUP & Labour have already said they’ll vote against it.

And we must remember she and the EU have previously stated the 2 halves must be treated as one package.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

Of course he wants a GE.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1111347764162646016

Call his bluff and agree the to support his Customs Union idea, then watch him squirm!

 

[IanM]

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1013324069055921&id=657015324686799

Nuts to Little Englanders. Listen to a German

 

[bluewolf]

You're being too literal, and maybe I didn't make it clear. Perfection can't be achieved. There will always be smuggling, including people smuggling. But as per our previous discussion, managing trade is achievable. Its happening elsewhere in the EU so why not in NI/Ireland?

Oh, I agree that managing trade across the border is achievable. But as we discussed, that's only half of the problem. Freedom of movement is a UK red line. If we don't have a hard border between Ireland and N. Ireland then we have an open border for people. I'm not sure how we could overcome that.