Body turn or hands, arms

[steadyon]

How do you swing the thing.

I’ve been focusing for a few weeks on getting a good release, club head fastest after impact, maybe even focusing on getting the club head past the hands (not that you can really). That found me a few extra yards to be fair but I started to get a bit wild and struggled to keep it on the course.

Yesterday I went out and focused on a really nice shoulder turn back and through. So much straighter and more consistent striking. AND, more distance again, first ever drive over 250 yards without the wing or hills open and 240 was almost the norm.

I think a lot of is about being a new player and nothing quite works properly and muscle memory not fully ingrained. I do have one rule though, max of one swing thought at a time and don’t keep changing during a round.

it’s the arms verses shoulders thing that is really interesting though, I’m just wondering what their players do or recommen.

 

[Orikoru]

I've no idea. It would scare me to think too much about what I'm doing. I prefer to focus on where I'm going.

 

[RichA]

I saw a practice drill from a pro on YouTube the other day that I tried and it seemed to work quite well. It's intended to ingrain turning your body properly in the swing rather than being all arms and is for practice rather than on course play.
On the range, set yourself up closer to the ball than you're comfortable with. To get a strike on the ball, you have no choice but to really rotate as there isn't room to put in an armsy swing.
Do it until you've got the feeling of really rotating, then go back to your normal ball position.
You can get so much more speed just by rotating your core than by frenetically swinging your arms, without even trying to be faster.

 

[Fabia999]

Youtube "Ben Hogan - Fundamental Swing Lesson", its about 2 minutes long.

Ben Hogan was the best swinger of the club of all time imo. He describes it perfectly too.

 

[Maninblack4612]

If you want a scientist's view look at this http://www.tutelman.com/golf/swing/golfSwingPhysics3a.php#wristtorque
What he basically says is that, as the club is accelerating, the hands are actually slowing down. It follows that any attempt to move the hands faster will actually slow the clubhead down. Your discovery that using the shoulders to drive the hands & arms gives you more distance is along the right lines. Also, it's easier to control the big muscles so you are likely to be more accurate.

If you are interested in the physics of the golf swing there are some good articles on the website I've indicated. I can even understand some of it!

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

My change of thinking is that I do not think about swing…I think about what I want the ball to do; I check positions of hands and ball at address; and then just hit the ball.

The ball does not know about my swing; it knows about being hit.

I might have to change my forum name and avatar ?

 

[Neilds]

My change of thinking is that I do not think about swing…I think about what I want the ball to do; check positions of hands and ball at address; and just hitting the ball.

The ball does not know about my swing; it knows about being hit.

I agree with this. I have often wondered why, in lessons, the pro has told me about taking the club away low and wide. Surely it is how the club arrives at the ball that is important, not how it leaves. I sometimes wonder if we would be better just getting the club into the top position by lifting it and setting the pose, then just doing the downswing part ???

PS I know this isn’t feasible for a whole load of reasons ?

 

[patricks148]

Used to have just an arms swing but been working for the last few years on body turn. Had a set of sessions with a sports physio and did Mobility and turn of the Upper body against lower. Its shown results, well it did last year?

 

[Canary_Yellow]

How do you swing the thing.

I’ve been focusing for a few weeks on getting a good release, club head fastest after impact, maybe even focusing on getting the club head past the hands (not that you can really). That found me a few extra yards to be fair but I started to get a bit wild and struggled to keep it on the course.

Yesterday I went out and focused on a really nice shoulder turn back and through. So much straighter and more consistent striking. AND, more distance again, first ever drive over 250 yards without the wing or hills open and 240 was almost the norm.

I think a lot of is about being a new player and nothing quite works properly and muscle memory not fully ingrained. I do have one rule though, max of one swing thought at a time and don’t keep changing during a round.

it’s the arms verses shoulders thing that is really interesting though, I’m just wondering what their players do or recommen.

I would say it's both, but which one you need to feel depends on which one you're not doing enough. This ties in with your observations.

You worked on using your arms more, which worked to start with, but then probably took it too far, at which point feeling like you weren't using them became a good feel for you.

I'm a very big fan of Monte Scheinblum's view on how the golf swing works. Very simple and very effective for me. His view is get the arms and hands right and the body will react correctly and athletically.

 

[Depreston]

some need more arms some need more body turn

some instructors will say hold the angles others say dump them

many ways to skin a cat in the golf swing quite fascinating really

AMG Pro v Ams videos are great content to watch to see if your concepts of the swing are on the right track imo

 

[Maninblack4612]

I agree with this. I have often wondered why, in lessons, the pro has told me about taking the club away low and wide. Surely it is how the club arrives at the ball that is important, not how it leaves. I sometimes wonder if we would be better just getting the club into the top position by lifting it and setting the pose, then just doing the downswing part ???

PS I know this isn’t feasible for a whole load of reasons ?

The takeaway is important because, if you do it wrong, you can't get into a proper position at the top. At the range I often put myself in what I know is the correct position at the top, pause & then swing down from a completely stationary start. I can hit a decent shot this way with anything up to a 6 iron. It's somehow easier to get into a correct position at the top by putting myself there than swinging the club into the same position.

 

[Depreston]

I would say it's both, but which one you need to feel depends on which one you're not doing enough. This ties in with your observations.

You worked on using your arms more, which worked to start with, but then probably took it too far, at which point feeling like you weren't using them became a good feel for you.

I'm a very big fan of Monte Scheinblum's view on how the golf swing works. Very simple and very effective for me. His view is get the arms and hands right and the body will react correctly and athletically.

Yeah Monte is another excellent source and someone who was the complete opposite of what a lot of pros were teaching at the time i first found him

 

[HomerJSimpson]

I found this quite interesting

 

[Canary_Yellow]

Yeah Monte is another excellent source and someone who was the complete opposite of what a lot of pros were teaching at the time i first found him

Yep - and as body sensors etc have caught up, technology seems to be supporting his view of the world, as compared to those looking at 2D images who were teaching that holding the lag was the way to go.

Seems that quite a few now teach similar principles.

 

[milngavie_hacker]

I found this quite interesting

Danny very similar here to Zen golf mechanics and using the feet and ground to turn the pelvis, arms and body.

 

[Mel Smooth]

The feeling of passing a rugby ball with speed is what you need. Transfer the weight and rotate thw wrists to flight the rugby ball.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Did a 60 ball session on the range this afternoon. All I did was stand behind looking down line; take some time to visualise shot and get a feel for strike position; walk up to ball; address/pause/look/hit ball. Absolutely no ‘traditional’ swing thoughts and have possibly never hit a session of balls better. Little bit squinty at times as wasn’t putting huge focus on line up at stance, but the strikes were generally excellent. I estimate that the A/P/L/H ball bit was taking no more than maybe 3 seconds in total. Weird how easy and relaxed it felt.

 

[Oddsocks]

I saw a practice drill from a pro on YouTube the other day that I tried and it seemed to work quite well. It's intended to ingrain turning your body properly in the swing rather than being all arms and is for practice rather than on course play.
On the range, set yourself up closer to the ball than you're comfortable with. To get a strike on the ball, you have no choice but to really rotate as there isn't room to put in an armsy swing.
Do it until you've got the feeling of really rotating, then go back to your normal ball position.
You can get so much more speed just by rotating your core than by frenetically swinging your arms, without even trying to be faster.

Interesting as this is my reset when the wheels are off. On practice swings pick a point on the floor ( daisy, divot, tugged if grass. Set up outside it with the objection of missing it on the inside.

 

[Pokitren]

How do you swing the thing.

I’ve been focusing for a few weeks on getting a good release, club head fastest after impact, maybe even focusing on getting the club head past the hands (not that you can really). That found me a few extra yards to be fair but I started to get a bit wild and struggled to keep it on the course.

Yesterday I went out and focused on a really nice shoulder turn back and through. So much straighter and more consistent striking. AND, more distance again, first ever drive over 250 yards without the wing or hills open and 240 was almost the norm.

I think a lot of is about being a new player and nothing quite works properly and muscle memory not fully ingrained. I do have one rule though, max of one swing thought at a time and don’t keep changing during a round.

it’s the arms verses shoulders thing that is really interesting though, I’m just wondering what their players do or recommen.

Well, this is just a task for concentration! In your experience, how long or fast does it take your muscles to remember the desired movement?

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Everyone has to make their own judgement but I know for myself that when I get my body turn and arms in sync I hit it better, truer and further than arms alone. Arms alone are a disaster for me. Each to their own though.