Ball embedded into face of bunker

[markyjee]

Hi guys, looking for some advice on what you should do if ball is embedded in the grass face of a bunker.
Watching the golf from Turkey yesterday I saw this happen to Shane Lowrey, he was told by referee he could drop it, when it rolled back into bunker he re-dropped and then placed after it rolled away again.
I found myself in a similar situation today but no one in my group was sure of how I should proceed.
Is what Shane Lowrey done the correct procedure or a local rule for the pro tournament.
Regards Mark

 

[williamalex1]

There was long drawn out thread on here awhile ago , stating that if a ball is embedded so much , that it could possibly be outside the confines of the bunker.
But the experts will be along shortly and clarify.

 

[markyjee]

On the face of bunker where the ball was embedded had grass length of about 1" - 1 1/2"
All around the bunker was short mown.

 

[SammmeBee]

Local rule on the Europeam Tour Hard Card. Plugged anywhere through the green and you get relief.....

Not as we play it tho or as the R&A play in their events including The Open......

 

[markyjee]

So no free drop, either play as it lies or take an unplayable penalty

 

[rulie]

There was long drawn out thread on here awhile ago , stating that if a ball is embedded so much , that it could possibly be outside the confines of the bunker.
But the experts will be along shortly and clarify.

Let's start with the definition of a bunker:

[FONT=&quot]Bunker[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]A "bunker" is a hazard consisting of a prepared area of ground, often a hollow, from which turf or soil has been removed and replaced with sand or the like. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Grass-covered ground bordering or within a bunker, including a stacked turf face (whether grass-covered or earthen), is not part of the bunker. A wall or lip of the bunker not covered with grass is part of the bunker. The margin of a bunker extends vertically downwards, but not upwards. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]A ball is in a bunker when it lies in or any part of it touches the bunker.[/FONT]


As above, grass-covered ground bordering a bunker is not part of the bunker. Hence, a ball embedded in a grass-covered ground is not in the bunker. Relief for an embedded ball may be available under Rule 25-2 if the grass is cut to fairway height or less. If not, no free relief is available, unless there is a local Rule in place that extends relief for an embedded ball to through the green. Many professional events have this local Rule in place.

 

[Colin L]

I watched that moment live. Firstly, Shane Lowry got confirmation from the referee that his ball was embedded. That was done by marking the ball and lifting it to see if was embedded or not [Decision 20-1/0.7]. The bank was clearly not closely mown and so I assumed that relief was being allowed for an embedded ball through the green. He dropped the ball as near as possible to where it had been embedded [Rule 25-2] and it rolled in to the bunker thus requiring a redrop [Rule 20-2c(i)]. He redropped and again the ball rolled into the bunker. He then placed his ball where it had struck the course on the second drop in accordance with Rule 20-2c.

It was neatly done and a text-book illustration of proceeding under the applicable rules. Also rather neatly done was his chip up to the hole, but that was a matter of envy not application of the rules.

 

[williamalex1]

Let's start with the definition of a bunker:

[FONT="]Bunker[/FONT][/B][B][FONT="] [/FONT]

[FONT="]A "[I][URL="http://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/rules/rules-and-decisions.html#%21rule-14253,Bunker"]bunker[/URL][/I]" is a hazard consisting of a prepared area of ground, often a hollow, from which turf or soil has been removed and replaced with sand or the like. [/FONT]
[FONT="]Grass-covered ground bordering or within a [I][URL="http://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/rules/rules-and-decisions.html#%21rule-14253,Bunker"]bunker[/URL][/I], including a stacked turf face (whether grass-covered or earthen), is not part of the bunker. A wall or lip of the bunker not covered with grass is part of the bunker. The margin of a bunker extends vertically downwards, but not upwards. [/FONT]
[FONT="]A ball is in a [I][URL="http://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/rules/rules-and-decisions.html#%21rule-14253,Bunker"]bunker[/URL][/I] when it lies in or any part of it touches the bunker.[/FONT]


As above, grass-covered ground bordering a bunker is not part of the bunker. Hence, a ball embedded in a grass-covered ground is not in the bunker. Relief for an embedded ball may be available under Rule 25-2 if the grass is cut to fairway height or less. If not, no free relief is available, unless there is a local Rule in place that extends relief for an embedded ball to through the green. Many professional events have this local Rule in place.

The original thread showed very good drawings/diagrams and measurements to help decide .

 

[markyjee]

Thanks rulie, before yesterday I would have confidently proceeded as you described but seeing the Lowrey situation caused me to question the process.

 

[rulie]

The original thread showed very good drawings/diagrams and measurements to help decide .

Not sure what the previous discussion said, but hopefully it complied with this...

[h=2]13/4[/h] [h=4]Ball Completely Embedded in Lip of Bunker[/h] Q. A player's ball is completely embedded in the vertical lip of a bunker. The lip is not grass-covered, so it is part of the bunker. Is the ball considered to be lying through the green? If so, the player would be entitled to drop the ball behind the bunker if he deems it unplayable.


A. No. An embedded ball is considered to be lying in the part of the course where it entered the ground.

 

[Fish]

I think it was when I played at Formby with the NW boys that I was informed that anything embedded in the stacked turf sods forming the face of the bunkers that we got relief, obviously a local rule. But where would I have taken relief, is it NPR and thus possibly in the bunker, 2 clubs no nearer or back on the line?

 

[delc]

Some clubs are using artificial turfs to make up the faces of revetted bunkers. Does this still count as grass within the rules?

See: www.ecobunker.co.uk

 

[delc]

I think it was when I played at Formby with the NW boys that I was informed that anything embedded in the stacked turf sods forming the face of the bunkers that we got relief, obviously a local rule. But where would I have taken relief, is it NPR and thus possibly in the bunker, 2 clubs no nearer or back on the line?

Rules 25-2 and 20-2 apply. If the ball rolls into a hazard, it must be re-dropped.

 

[rulefan]

Some clubs are using artificial turfs to make up the faces of revetted bunkers. Does this still count as grass within the rules?

See: www.ecobunker.co.uk

They would be immovable obstructions with no free relief. But possibly declared to be an integral part of the course.

 

[rulefan]

Rules 25-2 and 20-2 apply. If the ball rolls into a hazard, it must be re-dropped.

I doubt 25-2 as it would not be closely mown. But the corresponding local rule for a ball embedded through the green would apply.

 

[delc]

They would be immovable obstructions with no free relief. But possibly declared to be an integral part of the course.

But is artificial turf (AstroTurf etc) still regarded as grass, or does it have to be the green growing stuff? Would an artificial tee mat be regarded as an immovable obstruction if your ball came to rest on one, even though you could easily play off it?

 

[Colin L]

Astroturf or the likes is not grass. It is, as already said, an obstruction. An artificial mat used on a tee or dropping zone or to protect a bit of worn out ground is an obstruction. Anything artificial/man-made such as artificial turf, railway sleepers used to form the face of a bunker is an obstruction. You are entitled to relief from any of these unless they are stated to be an integral part of the course. (I suspect a slip of the pen in Rulefan’s comment above.)

The ease, difficulty or impossibility of playing your ball as it lies when there is interference by an obstruction is not relevant. If there is interference you may take relief.

I would normally hope that obstructions that are parts of the structure of a bunker are defined as integral parts of the course. This is so that if your ball is in the bunker, right up against a face shored up with sleepers, for instance, you don’t get a get out of jail free card that allows you a drop further back in the bunker with an easier shot.

Back to Shane Lowry. His ball was embedded on a grassed slope above the bunker with never any question of the face of the bunker coming into it.

 

[delc]

They would be immovable obstructions with no free relief. But possibly declared to be an integral part of the course.

I thought you got free relief from immovable obstructions unless they define the boundaries of the course, or are declared to be integral parts of the course (e.g. the metalled road across the 18th fairway on the Old Course at St Andrews).

 

[delc]

I think it was when I played at Formby with the NW boys that I was informed that anything embedded in the stacked turf sods forming the face of the bunkers that we got relief, obviously a local rule. But where would I have taken relief, is it NPR and thus possibly in the bunker, 2 clubs no nearer or back on the line?

Just another thought. If the stacked turf sods making up the face of the bunker are as steep as they sometimes are, any attempt at dropping the ball will almost certainly mean it rolling back into the bunker, and you probably wouldn't be able to place it so that it remains at rest either, so the same thing would happen. What do you do then, apart from maybe declaring it unplayable?

 

[MashieNiblick]

Just another thought. If the stacked turf sods making up the face of the bunker are as steep as they sometimes are, any attempt at dropping the ball will almost certainly mean it rolling back into the bunker, and you probably wouldn't be able to place it so that it remains at rest either, so the same thing would happen. What do you do then, apart from maybe declaring it unplayable?

I think then you would have to place it on the nearest spot NNTH and not in the bunker, where it will come to rest, in accordance with Rule 20-3d(i).

In that case you might end up having to place the ball right on the edge of the bunker where you will have to stand in the bunker to play it but I guess that's just tough.