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AND HERE WE GO - THE 2019 GENERAL ELECTION THREAD

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harpo_72 said:
Which means your falling into the position I have stated ... the Brexit situation needs to be cleared up .. either way.
Posting about the outcome situation is pointless as is discussing what will occur if so and so get's into power until Brexit is cleared.
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OK have it your way, you obviously know me better than I know myself. I don't really understand why you get so strident with people who have a different view to yourself. Its just a golf forum which has a range of views which are largely debated in an amusing and polite way. I've responded to your post 3 times in short succession: there won't be a fourth which will give you the last word which you seem to crave.
 
harpo_72 said:
Probably more old school Tory not the Tory we see now, silver spooned wide boys with a “me,me first” attitude and a lack of morals.
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Aye - that’s true - there are maybe a handful of Brexit Party types but I’m guessing, as I know most of us well, that most who do vote Tory will be of the Truthfully Caring Conservative camp.
 
harpo_72 said:
Absolutely bang on !
A brexit will impact the banking situation .. we already are seeing a migration to Luxembourg
As for privatisation, well that really hasn't been that successful for the consumer and the initial profit gain from the shares has been and gone. So a compulsory purchase back would not be a bad thing ... and I suppose the Tories could sell it again :LOL: .
I really worry that Boris will sell the NHS, the American system is not something I want.

Basically DrDel is using a typical tory tactic of project fear and making up scenarios to try and make it sound worse than our current offerings from the liar Boris.

But if Corbyn is too far then the Lib Dems are somewhere in the middle and probably more toward traditional Tory values... a government made up of Lib Labour may actually be the best option for the centrist.
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...and on the NHS - I’m not sure most of the electorate are aware of the cost of Private Health insurance - especially to cover an existing condition. When I took my career break my work medical insurance was paused - and so was my wife’s - as my spouse on the company policy we paid £60/month for her. We looked at taking our own insurance just for her with the same cover. They agreed to take her on and to cover her existing condition (in remission with breast cancer). How much were we quoted? £520/month. That’s potentially what privatisation of the health service might mean in creation of a two-tier service. From my conversations with US-resident friends - it certainly does in the States.
 
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Hacker Khan said:
https://twitter.com/x/status/1193450658193641472

https://twitter.com/x/status/1192467215716638726

You do wonder about the tactic by the parties to send some junior minister on so the real leaders avoid any decent scrutiny. As it inevitably never ends well. Always reminds me of this from The Thick of It.

Warning, will inevitably contain swearing as it is The Thick of It.
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I watched the paper’s review on The Andrew Marr Show this morning and they discussed the headlines about Labours spending and the journalists themselves agreed that Labour’s current proposed spending was about half what the headline suggested and the tories had added things in that was a lie, ie, all Private Schools to be close immediately.

Then we get the Labour spokesman saying after next weekend their manifesto will be published with full costings and the tory saying it’s a disgrace and refusing to put a single penny on theirs.

I’m not saying either is in the right, but it just highlighted to me the amount of mis-information on both sides and it is doing nothing to actually help the Nation.

I totally disagree with the cliche, “you get what you vote for” we don’t, because none of them can be trusted!
 
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I think what I've seen over the many years I've watched politics is the total, and open, disregard for the truth. The lack of knowledge some politicians have on their subject and the lack of professionalism is astounding. We also have a pretty much 100% biased media peddling news from their own standpoint only, also with little regard for the truth.
 
chrisd said:
I think what I've seen over the many years I've watched politics is the total, and open, disregard for the truth. The lack of knowledge some politicians have on their subject and the lack of professionalism is astounding. We also have a pretty much 100% biased media peddling news from their own standpoint only, also with little regard for the truth.
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I'd argue that is true in the print media. But for TV and radio luckily we have not followed the US model and our TV and radio are relatively politically neutral, and indeed some TV/Radio journalists are very good at holding them to account. It's just that unfortunate that both parties like to peddle a narrative that they are very biased if they do not slavishly repeat whatever propaganda they come up with. Nowhere near as bad as what Trump does, but there for the grace of god.
 
harpo_72 said:
I understand your point, and the anti Semitic stuff is worrying. But let’s put it this way is it acceptable to be is islamphobic ?
Neither is acceptable, but no one here has raised that topic - nor has any one mentioned the overt sexism rife in the Tory party ...
what we have on here is some very right wing skewed views which are propagated by the right wing press.
I have just stated and you have agreed previously that Brexit will determine the policy because it will determine the budget.
What is worrying is your all thinking about what is in the room before you have gone through the door .. And your willing to believe a liar
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The highlighted bit;

You have often commented on what Brexit will bring about, i.e. worrying about what is in the room before you have gone through the door. Ironic, again? You seem ok to dismiss Labour's antisemitism with a its worrying, and its Labour who released those figures.

As for willing to believe a liar... where on earth do you get that from? Who is it you think I believe?
 
Hobbit said:
The highlighted bit;

You have often commented on what Brexit will bring about, i.e. worrying about what is in the room before you have gone through the door. Ironic, again? You seem ok to dismiss Labour's antisemitism with a its worrying, and its Labour who released those figures.

As for willing to believe a liar... where on earth do you get that from? Who is it you think I believe?
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I find Boris and most of his cabinet indefensible.. so there you have it.
Justify his position and quote him as the new messiah then we need a reality check.
I have a rough idea where you stand and I appreciate for you Corbyn is too far left. But the point was your overlooking the poor behaviours of the others, like the press.
 
Old Skier said:
And or are you suggesting that a higher % of Tories are religious than any other party?
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Erm - No...I think it easy enough to see that I was drawing a (not too serious) conclusion about the voting intentions of my church's congregation from the Yougov survey Age Group voting intention.
 
harpo_72 said:
I find Boris and most of his cabinet indefensible.. so there you have it.
Justify his position and quote him as the new messiah then we need a reality check.
I have a rough idea where you stand and I appreciate for you Corbyn is too far left. But the point was your overlooking the poor behaviours of the others, like the press.
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Once upon a time there was Mandy willing to call out Brian's mistaken identity...

"He's not the messiah, he's a very naughty boy!"
 
harpo_72 said:
I find Boris and most of his cabinet indefensible.. so there you have it.
Justify his position and quote him as the new messiah then we need a reality check.
I have a rough idea where you stand and I appreciate for you Corbyn is too far left. But the point was your overlooking the poor behaviours of the others, like the press.
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Where on earth are you coming from? "Justify his position..." If you're referring to Boris, that's just laughable in the extreme. If you care to look back you will see I think Boris is a Trump-lite. Probably the second worst politician in the western world. You will also see that I would prefer to vote Labour but have said hell will freeze over before I would vote for them whilst Corbyn, McDonnell and Momentum lead Labour.

Its not just a case of not wanting Corbyn. He's the head of the snake. To a certain extent I think McDonnell is worse. And whilst Momentum are there to perpetuate far left extremism and antisemitism, they're not for me. Stormtroopers springs to mind. An organisation that admits they've had 673 instances of antisemitism in less than a year, and you want to vote for them... Mmm, maybe I've got a rough idea where you stand - turning a blind eye to antisemitism.

I'm not overlooking the behaviour of others. Where do you get that from? "You have a rough idea where I stand..." To be honest, I don't think you have much clue where I stand. You're making a lot of assumptions which, quite frankly, are 2+2=27.
 
Hobbit said:
Where on earth are you coming from? "Justify his position..." If you're referring to Boris, that's just laughable in the extreme. If you care to look back you will see I think Boris is a Trump-lite. Probably the second worst politician in the western world. You will also see that I would prefer to vote Labour but have said hell will freeze over before I would vote for them whilst Corbyn, McDonnell and Momentum lead Labour.

Its not just a case of not wanting Corbyn. He's the head of the snake. To a certain extent I think McDonnell is worse. And whilst Momentum are there to perpetuate far left extremism and antisemitism, they're not for me. Stormtroopers springs to mind. An organisation that admits they've had 673 instances of antisemitism in less than a year, and you want to vote for them... Mmm, maybe I've got a rough idea where you stand - turning a blind eye to antisemitism.

I'm not overlooking the behaviour of others. Where do you get that from? "You have a rough idea where I stand..." To be honest, I don't think you have much clue where I stand. You're making a lot of assumptions which, quite frankly, are 2+2=27.
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Haven’t seen you mention islamaphobia or the sexism .. you have said a lot a about Corbyn, McDonnell et al .. you cannot sit on the fence and continue to point out the failings of one side.

Incidentally I have already indicated who I would vote for and it wasn’t Corbyn.

The point I was making in my posts and I will rephrase it .. there is a lot of Tory fan boys trotting out right wing propaganda- and it should be contested.

If you disagree with that, it’s okay but step out of it or accept the other view point.

By the way 2+2 =4, don’t bring maths into a debate it usually gives a definitive answer 👍🙂
 
harpo_72 said:
Haven’t seen you mention islamaphobia or the sexism .. you have said a lot a about Corbyn, McDonnell et al .. you cannot sit on the fence and continue to point out the failings of one side.

Incidentally I have already indicated who I would vote for and it wasn’t Corbyn.

The point I was making in my posts and I will rephrase it .. there is a lot of Tory fan boys trotting out right wing propaganda- and it should be contested.

If you disagree with that, it’s okay but step out of it or accept the other view point.

By the way 2+2 =4, don’t bring maths into a debate it usually gives a definitive answer 👍🙂
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Crikey! If we're going to mention every instance we'd vote for no one. I am very aware of the Islamaphobia and sexism which, along with the antisemitism, shouldn't happen. For me, if we're talking about who should get the vote, its about scale too. 673 instances of antisemitism reported by Labour. Labour's own figures, not the right wing press you fear.

I absolutely accept the other point of view, and this is where it gets a little confusing. You don't seem to accept the brickbats thrown at Labour, and that's what I was trying to highlight. Maybe we've both misunderstood each other a little.

I highlighted Corbyn, McDonnell and Momentum because they are too extreme for me. And if you want a little balance in that respect, I'm no fan of the 1922 Committee either.

As for my own voting record in the last 43 years of voting; 70% Labour, 20% LibDems, 10% Tory. I'm no Tory fanboy but I'd vote for them ahead of the current Labour offering - I genuinely fear, and I mean fear, Momentum controlling the Labour Party. Where next, concentration camps by another name?
 
Doon frae Troon said:
Does anyone else wonder how the Tories can 'expertly' cost Labour's spending but, when challenged, do not seem to have a clue what their own spending will cost.
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There is a meme out there (yes, memes are made up) where the Labour minimum wage proposal of GBP 10 gets called unaffordable by some newspeaper which celebrates the Tory proposal of GBP 10.50 as a brilliant idea. I think they were express front pages which someone collated together.
 
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