Am I being a bit daft?

[One Planer]

Simple thread really.

I've decided to move away from the Stack and Tilt swing pattern.

I can see the shock on your face :smirk:

It's something I've decided I need to do if I want to improve how I play in the long term. The reason I say this is simple. I'm, now, a firm believer in searching out professional help to improve a golf swing. You can only get so far through your own study, help feom these boards and, dare I say it, natural talent. The rest needs to be looked at by someone who understands the golf swing and has an expertise, so to say, in helping people improve.

The problem with the S&T pattern is there are very few coaches in the UK. Unless I'm willing to travel, and with a young son that's nigh on impossible. My nearest coach for the S&T pattern is Preston. That's a good 2.1/2 hour drive from where I live. Too far, even for once a month.

To this end I've decided that If I am to improve in the long term I have to change certain things. My swing being one and my mind-set the other. I wanted to be one of these folk, and there a few on here who are playing to 10 or better without having a lesson. I wanted that. My problem is, I feel like I'm fighting my swing, pretty much everytime I play.

Last weekend I shot 77 round my local track, but never, once, did I feel comfortable with my swing.

Before May 2010 I had never swung a club, aside from on a field out back of my mums and dads house with friends, but never on a course.

When I was out with an injured wrist I got to thinking about starting afresh. Going back to the beginning starting with my short game and working down to my driving and fairway woods under a professionals supervision.

I've decided to take the plunge. I'm booking a series of lessons to start at the beginning of March which at one a month will see through until August, doing pretty much as I said. Then once August comes around, probably repeat the dose again through the winter. Then take them as required the following year.

I will say this. I'm not looking for a quick fix. The way I look at it is this. With a bit of luck, I'll be playing golf for a long, long time to come. With this in mind, what's the point in dabbling with quick fixes when I can take my time, under professional supervision over the course of several lesson and do it right and get a swing that will see me to a level I want to be at.

I just needed to put it down in Sorry for the long post. I think writing to get it straight in my own head.

It's not a decision I've taken lightly. I've given it some thought and, personally think, I've made the right decision.





....... I hope.

 

[louise_a]

good luck with the change.

Oh, and you will have to change your sig.

 

[pbrown7582]

Good luck enjoy the ride no doubt there will be moments when you why oh why! But with the help of a good coach and a bit of effort you'll get there!

Not much left to change now then!! :rofl: maybe some premium mizzy balls instead of pro v's :rofl:

 

[StrangelyBrown]

Good luck with it fella :thup:

 

[Fader]

Good Luck with the long road ahead and the changes that will happen but with all things you only get out what you put in. Sounds like you've made a solid and sound decision thats come from the thinking time you've had.

Will be worth it to continue to enjoy this game without getting to complex in your own learning. :thup:

 

[User20205]

Last weekend I shot 77 round my local track, but never, once, did I feel comfortable with my swing.






.

you've just got new clubs, you're bedding them in & you shot 77 ! I'm not sure there is much wrong physically, maybe just in your head 'fighting your swing' isn't that a mental thing?

get a lesson off someone local who has a good rep, he should be able to encorporate & enhance what you are currently doing. From my understanding S&T and a traditional swing share many common aspects. I don't think you have to competely re-invent yourself, just become comfortable/confident in what you are doing

 

[bladeplayer]

Simple thread really.

I've decided to move away from the Stack and Tilt swing pattern.

I can see the shock on your face :smirk:

It's something I've decided I need to do if I want to improve how I play in the long term. The reason I say this is simple. I'm, now, a firm believer in searching out professional help to improve a golf swing. You can only get so far through your own study, help feom these boards and, dare I say it, natural talent. The rest needs to be looked at by someone who understands the golf swing and has an expertise, so to say, in helping people improve.

.

To this end I've decided that If I am to improve in the long term I have to change certain things. My swing being one and my mind-set the other. I wanted to be one of these folk, and there a few on here who are playing to 10 or better without having a lesson. I wanted that.
Last weekend I shot 77 round my local track, but never, once, did I feel comfortable with my swing.


I've decided to take the plunge. I'm booking a series of lessons to start at the beginning of March which at one a month will see through until August, doing pretty much as I said. Then once August comes around, probably repeat the dose again through the winter. Then take them as required the following year.

I will say this. I'm not looking for a quick fix. The way I look at it is this. With a bit of luck, I'll be playing golf for a long, long time to come. With this in mind, what's the point in dabbling with quick fixes when I can take my time, under professional supervision over the course of several lesson and do it right and get a swing that will see me to a level I want to be at.

.

It's not a decision I've taken lightly. I've given it some thought and, personally think, I've made the right decision.





....... I hope.

Wow .. shock on my face? , ive fallen off my seat ha ..

Fair play mate & having read your post i applaud the fact you have accepted its time to get help (at least with your swing) its a pity there is no one closer to you to help you further the S&T ..

I too made a decision to get help this year , having never had a lesson i realised its time to start doing the right thing more often on the course , & i needed help to get better , so i booked some lessons .. i too didnt take this decision lightly or easy to get around to , but 3 lessons in im glad i did.. a few simple pointers will have you hitting the ball better & more confidently , ok it will take time to see real results but its good knowing you are doing something twords that aim ..

Well done on taking the decision it cant have been an easy one & tho it will seem alien & it will seem "i cant swing properly at all for a while " it will come good

Best of Luck

 

[CMAC]

do whatever works for YOU, whether thats tilt and stack or the normal way:smirk:

As Tiger said, "if its repeatable and works for you then do it"

 

[Slab]

Of the shots you lose in a given round, how many are due to your swing & how many are because of your mind-set?
(not to mention the shots lost to weather conditions, club selection, poor shot execution, environmental conditions, dumb course management & just poor luck)

Will you be putting an equal amount of time & effort into these other areas which I guess you have too really otherwise you'll be wasting the time spent changing your swing

 

[One Planer]

Of the shots you lose in a given round, how many are due to your swing & how many are because of your mind-set?

Of the shots I lose. 90% ish are swing related. When my swing is on, it's great. However when it's off it's stone cold and soul destroying.

 

[mcbroon]

I wanted to be one of these folk, and there a few on here who are playing to 10 or better without having a lesson. I wanted that.

I hear that. I'm exactly the same. But it's better to be in single figures having had lessons than be above 10 and going it alone. After not really seeing a lot of improvement through last summer, I had a couple of lessons towards the end of the year (not a series or anything, just a couple of check-ups) in which the pro spotted a couple of things I needed to tweak and, having worked on them over winter, I shot a PB on Saturday in my first full round of 2013. Once our qualifying comps start up again, I'm hopeful that I'll get into single figures quickly and, if I do, I won't care a jot that I needed lessons to help me get there.

Sounds like you've made a good decision to me. Good luck with it.

 

[Slab]

Of the shots I lose. 90% ish are swing related. When my swing is on, it's great. However when it's off it's stone cold and soul destroying.

Cool (wish my lost shots were concentrated like this) sounds like you have a plan to deal with it though, good luck

 

[One Planer]

Cool (wish my lost shots were concentrated like this) sounds like you have a plan to deal with it though, good luck

It's pretty much the case.

What I'm looking for is to improve my miss and make it less severe.

I believe the pro I've chosen can help me get the results I'm after.

Believe me, I'm not having a downer on the S&T pattern. It's opened up my eyes to a lot of things in the golf swing, however to progress, I feel this is the right step.

 

[JustOne]

Are you being daft?

It's a tough one to answer.

Golf is a pastime for most so you have to enjoy the process, if you look back in 10yrs and tell yourself that you shot a 77 in the Winter is that not good enough for you? how about under par in the Summer? would that be good enough? This isn't a question about Stack and Tilt, it's about you enjoying the game.

At your disposal is ME and also Sam Quirke who is a qualified S&T instructor - but I don't see a thread with your swing videos in it?!

If you want to go it alone then already you've chosen the hardest possible route, yet you shot a 77 with basically NO HELP. In my book that's outstanding!

If you are not enjoying the process then yes you should change but if you can't be bothered to video your swing what exactly CAN you be bothered to do?

 

[scratch]

I'd say probably a good decision to revert to a more traditional method where you can get expert help locally.

S&T is just a passing phase, it will be long forgotten about in a few years time.

 

[cookelad]

I'd say probably a good decision to revert to a more traditional method where you can get expert help locally.

S&T is just a passing phase, it will be long forgotten about in a few years time.

That's the blue touch paper lit now move to a safe distance and wait!

 

[One Planer]

I'll try and answer these the best I can James.

Are you being daft?

It's a tough one to answer.

Golf is a pastime for most so you have to enjoy the process, if you look back in 10yrs and tell yourself that you shot a 77 in the Winter is that not good enough for you? how about under par in the Summer? would that be good enough? This isn't a question about Stack and Tilt, it's about you enjoying the game.

Am I enjoying the game. Very good question. My honest answer is yes and no.

Yes, I enjoy playing the game of golf. I enjoy making a score and plotting my way around the course. However when my swing is "Off", I don't enjoy the game one bit.

It's hard for me to put into words the feeling but is almost like I've moved back to square one. I don't feel I swing the club any differently than usual but the results are vastly different and this is in the sapce of days.

As an example, I shoot 77 last Saturday, Great! Go to the range on Monday and shank my way, pretty much, through a basket of balls. Not so great.

This is not down to Stack and Tilt this is down to me having an inconsistant swing.

At your disposal is ME and also Sam Quirke who is a qualified S&T instructor - but I don't see a thread with your swing videos in it?!

James you've been more than helpful in helping me to understand the swing and how it works. I've also PM'd Sam with various pictures and, maybe a video, but there is only so much I can learn from the feed back I get.

I totally agree that a swing video will highlight faults in the swing, but this is where, IMO, having an instructor stood behind you correcting you and going through drill.

While I have no doubt that you, Sam, Bob, Brian etc could give corrective information and maybe drills over the forum, if I don't understand or mis-understand what is said, which is easily done on a forum, I'm potentially practicing the wrong thing.

Believe me if there was an instructor local, I'd be there.

If you want to go it alone then already you've chosen the hardest possible route, yet you shot a 77 with basically NO HELP. In my book that's outstanding!

Very good of you to say James, Thank you.

As I say. My issue is not shooting a score. My issue is consistancy. With my swing in it's current guise, I have the potential to shoot a low number (77) but equally the next time out I could shoot in the 90's shanking my way around the course. The Stack and Tilt philosophy is sound, I don't dispute that one bit, after all it got me from 24 to 16.

Getting to my current handicap, hasn't been an easy ride for me. I'm far from a natural at this game which is why I put in so much practice.

I said earlier in the thread that I felt like I was fighting my swing the whole round last week. Again this was more than likely in my head. Even so, I never felt settled over the ball. Even with a 3/4 wedge into a green, I just could not settle. This, is suppose nervousness, could have helped me focus a little more (?), who knows.

Again it comes back to consistancy. I've ben playing for just over 2.1/2 years now and regardless of what swing pattern I've used, consistancy has always eluded me.

If you are not enjoying the process then yes you should change but if you can't be bothered to video your swing what exactly CAN you be bothered to do?

The learning process of golf is something I enjoy immensley. As I've said I'm probably the least natural golfer you could come across, hence why I practice as much as I do. I want to be good at this game.

Shooting 77 at the weekend giving me a massive high, followed by 2 practice sessions that involved shanking my way through a bucket of balls and over and under hitting pitched to 80 yards which is normally my strongest attribue behind putting, takes any confidence I gained from Saturdays round and throws it out of the window.

What has this got to do with Stack and Tilt?

Nothing. The pattern works, see Charlie Wi ad many others as a reference. Is it best for me, well it's certainly given me some of my best scores thats for sure.

I don't think the pattern is the problem. I think how I impliment the pattern is, after all, my swing has been pieced together from what I have read from the book and you and Sam helping me to understand it.

Do I think a more traditonal swing, with hands on coaching is the answer? Honesty, I don't know. But I have nothing to lose by trying.

 

[One Planer]

S&T is just a passing phase, it will be long forgotten about in a few years time.

Hasn't it been around since 2007'ish

Would you also say the same for Sean Foley's approach with Tiger Woods and Hunter Mahan?

Charlie Wi (Stack and Tilts poster boy) has made $258,048 year to date and $9,146,978 over his career with a scoring average of Average 69.38.

Not too shabby for a passing phase.

 

[Ethan]

I'd say probably a good decision to revert to a more traditional method where you can get expert help locally.

S&T is just a passing phase, it will be long forgotten about in a few years time.

I am inclined to agree. It is a method of the moment, just as there have been methods in the past which have been the hot new swing thing and then faded away (Kelley's Golfing Machine, a la Bobby Clampett, Ballard's connectedness, a la Curtis Strange, Mac O'Grady's methods, Jim McLean's X factor, Leadbetter's method, and now Sean Foley's method). I suspect that many of those who think they have improved due to S&T have improved instead just because they had a focus for their game.

The S&T crew have re-engineered their narrative to try to be all things to all people, and claiming that most of the greats have used elements of S&T. Look at the WGC event this weekend and count the number of players who really use S&T. I think it might be zero. The fact that some golfers have made money using S&T doesn't mean they made money because they were using S&T. Equally you could look at those who gave it up and conclude they thought it didn't work.

If you want to have a swing where you stay largely centred over the ball, that is fine, but that isn't S&T.

 

[CMAC]

I am inclined to agree. It is a method of the moment, just as there have been methods in the past which have been the hot new swing thing and then faded away (Kelley's Golfing Machine, a la Bobby Clampett, Ballard's connectedness, a la Curtis Strange, Mac O'Grady's methods, Jim McLean's X factor, Leadbetter's method, and now Sean Foley's method). I suspect that many of those who think they have improved due to S&T have improved instead just because they had a focus for their game.

The S&T crew have re-engineered their narrative to try to be all things to all people, and claiming that most of the greats have used elements of S&T. Look at the WGC event this weekend and count the number of players who really use S&T. I think it might be zero. The fact that some golfers have made money using S&T doesn't mean they made money because they were using S&T. Equally you could look at those who gave it up and conclude they thought it didn't work.

If you want to have a swing where you stay largely centred over the ball, that is fine, but that isn't S&T.

Good Post :thup: